DNP vs EdD

[HOPEforRNs]

I have my BSN from the same top 5 nursing program where I have taught for the past 5 years. My MSN (nursing education) is from Capella University. My job is pushing me hard to get a terminal degree. I'm not eligible for most DNP programs nor do they make sense since I am not an advanced practice nurse nor do I desire to be. There are a few CCNE accredited DNP programs that would allow me to complete the program but I would need 900 clinical hours and it would be quite expensive. American Sentinel University has a DNP nurse educator and due to their ACEN accreditation, the hours would drop to 600. I got accepted and got full NFLP funding. But I worry about getting another degree from an online "diploma mill" style school. And I am still hesitant about the DNP since the degree was designed for advanced practice nurses, not educators.

I recently discovered that Columbia University has an EdD specifically in nursing education. It is a long and intense program that seems to be closer aligned to a PhD. However, I would be specifically prepared as a nurse educator at the doctoral level, not a nurse scientist like with a PhD. It seems perfect, although I'm not thrilled about all the extra time / effort vs the DNP. But is it worth it? Will it look way better on paper? Open up more doors? Guide me to being a better educator? I have not found anyone who personally went through that program.

A final option is that I am aware of a school that is creating a brand-new degree, the DNE... Doctorate in nursing education. It is essentially a DNP specifically designed for nurse educators. They are actively seeking CCNE accreditation. It will mirror the DNP and also have the 1000 hours post bachelor's requirement which would mean 900 hundred hours for me. This is a well ranked and well respected university.

I have no interest in being a nurse scientist who lives for grant money and publishing. I like teaching. Most of what I want to do is translate the existing research into the educational world to ensure we are educating our nursing students in the best way we know. However, if a topic interests me, I want to have the ability and knowledge do a study. I just finished a big QI project that got me published in a peer-reviewed journal which was exciting. The DNE sounds amazing, but it's a few years off. And I'm annoyed at having to do 900 hours because that would mean adding to my current workload and doing my job extra without pay. What's the point and benefit!? But it would be faster and less rigorous than the EdD.

Also, I have 2 kids and plan to start trying for a 3rd. I would love to wait but a combination of my job pushing me and not knowing if NFLP funding will still exist down the road and knowing down the road I will wish I had just done it has led me to looking at options now. I'm in my lower 30s so I have a long career ahead of me.

Sorry for rambling and the long post but any insight would be greatly appreciated. Anyone I've asked at work is just PhD or nothing except the NPs all say DNP. I have no idea why the EdD doesn't seem to have the respect in nursing education. It seems like the most ideal degree for an educator.

Thanks!

[efthimia519, ADN, BSN, MSN, RN]

Regis College has a DNP with a nursing education concentration. They offer this through both the online and the on campus programs. They are very well established and by no means a "diploma mill"

They also have the NFLP program. Good luck with whatever you decide.

[TheSquire, DNP, APRN, NP]

Are you going for advanced practice? If not, why would you look at a DNP, which specifically has "Advanced Practice" as one of its Eight Pillars.

Go for the Ed.D. It's the doctorate in the field you're actually pursuing.

[HOPEforRNs, ADN, BSN, MSN]

15 hours ago, TheSquire said:

Are you going for advanced practice? If not, why would you look at a DNP, which specifically has "Advanced Practice" as one of its Eight Pillars.

Go for the Ed.D. It's the doctorate in the field you're actually pursuing.

At least for me, the EdD is longer, more difficult, more expensive. While relevant, my employer looks at PhD > DNP=EdD.

[TheSquire, DNP, APRN, NP]

4 minutes ago, HOPEforRNs said:

At least for me, the EdD is longer, more difficult, more expensive.

This is part of the problem with non-advanced practice DNPs: nurses view it as an "easy" doctorate. Of course it's "easy" - because you're using it for something it wasn't designed for. If you want a non-Ph.D. doctorate for nursing education, get your Ed.D.

[HOPEforRNs, ADN, BSN, MSN]

13 minutes ago, TheSquire said:

This is part of the problem with non-advanced practice DNPs: nurses view it as an "easy" doctorate. Of course it's "easy" - because you're using it for something it wasn't designed for. If you want a non-Ph.D. doctorate for nursing education, get your Ed.D.

But why not get your PhD then? Similar degrees with similar requirements. I'm holding out for the DNE I've read about. Seems like what education needs.

[TheSquire, DNP, APRN, NP]

2 minutes ago, HOPEforRNs said:

But why not get your PhD then? Similar degrees with similar requirements.

The DNP is not similar to a PhD - the former is focused on advanced practice and applying research to practice, and since I'm an NP that makes sense. The Ph.D. is research oriented, and I have neither the interest nor the patience to deal with Nursing research.

[HOPEforRNs, ADN, BSN, MSN]

3 minutes ago, TheSquire said:

The DNP is not similar to a PhD - the former is focused on advanced practice and applying research to practice, and since I'm an NP that makes sense. The Ph.D. is research oriented, and I have neither the interest nor the patience to deal with Nursing research.

I was referring to the EdD and PhD being similar. Both are research focused with candidacy and dissertation. Both 4-5 years long.

[efthimia519, ADN, BSN, MSN, RN]

TheSquire, are you apposed to non NPs pursuing a DNP? On a separate note, is anyone familiar with an EdD program that offers NFLP other than Coumbia's that was previously mentioned? The NFLP program is for nurses who are teaching full time or plan to teach full time but yet most educational programs that are offering NFLP are DNP programs rather than EdD programs. Thoughts?

[TheSquire, DNP, APRN, NP]

4 minutes ago, efthimia519 said:

TheSquire, are you apposed to non NPs pursuing a DNP? On a separate note, is anyone familiar with an EdD program that offers NFLP other than Coumbia's that was previously mentioned? The NFLP program is for nurses who are teaching full time or plan to teach full time but yet most educational programs that are offering NFLP are DNP programs rather than EdD programs. Thoughts?

I am opposed to non-advanced practice nurses pursuing a DNP. The entire point of the DNP is to promote and developed advanced practice nursing, with advanced practice being one of the eight pillars of the DNP. Take out the advanced practice, and getting a DNP is just an exercise in resume fluffing.

[HOPEforRNs, ADN, BSN, MSN]

2 minutes ago, TheSquire said:

I am opposed to non-advanced practice nurses pursuing a DNP. The entire point of the DNP is to promote and developed advanced practice nursing, with advanced practice being one of the eight pillars of the DNP. Take out the advanced practice, and getting a DNP is just an exercise in resume fluffing.

I agree. This is why I hope the DNE becomes a "thing" because I think nursing education needs it. The EdD is great, but it's being phased out for nursing and it's still a research heavy degree. I am far from the only educator who wants a doctorate degree that focuses primarily on teaching, not research.

[professorcait, BSN, MSN, RN]

@efthimia519 I am pursuing my EdD with an emphasis in nursing education from Bryan College of Health sciences currently. When I started last year, they were in the NFLP Program. However, unfortunately, with budget cuts to the program, my school lost their funding 3rd quarter last year. They are actively pursuing to get back in the program for the upcoming school year, so hopefully It will all pass. When I was originally doing my search for a program, I looked at Columbia, my school, and the University of West Georgia because they all have EdDs with emphasis in nursing education and had the NFLP program. Hope this helps!

[TheSquire, DNP, APRN, NP]

I don't see the need for a Nursing-specific education degree. I am willing to be convinced otherwise, but the Ed.D. can be applied to adult education, as @professorcait points out - why do we need a duplicate degree?