I remembered reading an old post awhile ago where an NP (who got her DNP) was told by Human Resources that she couldn't use the title "Doctor" at the hospital, because it would mislead the patients.
I am wondering if anyone has seen or heard anything similar where they work (you personally or someone else).
If hospitals are "all about introductions", I see nothing wrong with telling a patient, "Hi, I'm Dr. Smith, I'm a Nurse Practioner"...I see no difference between that and saying, "Hi, I'm Dr. Jones and I'm your Cardiologist".
To me, that would be a HUGE slap in the fact to someone who has worked hard for that degree, because they are entitled to use that title.
This may all look very simple and clear to all the bright, enthusiastic, young people here who want to become very independent NPs (and I don't mean that in any negative way at all :)), but those of us who have been "in the trenches" on this issue for many years understand what a fragile, delicate tightrope we're walking.
This is where you and I agree.
I personally, do not support NP's practicing independently, such as in Urgent Care clinics or even a Health Department without a physician physically present. Not on call, not just his name on the practice, but physically present.
Even though I fully support NP's being addressed as "Doctor" as long as you fully make clear to the patient that you are an NP and not a medical doctor, NP's are not physicians...for an NP to practice independently, there is too much of a chance for something major to be missed...you simply cannot substitute the "schooling".
I aspire to be an NNP, but in my future, I plan to work with hospitals with a Neonatologist on staff 24/7...none of this on-call crap. It's too much of a liability.
If a hosptal is going to run a NICU, then they need to be staffed appropriately.
The reason I feel this way is very personal...I had a family member that was hospitalized and died of a very survivable condition...on a SATURDAY..b/c the "specialist" was "on-call" and couldn't get to the hospital in time(took them 90 minutes to get there and we found out that hospital policy was that the on-call physicians had to be able to get there 20 minutes or less)...as if emergencies only occurred Monday through Friday.
Even though I fully support NP's being addressed as "Doctor" as long as you fully make clear to the patient that you are an NP and not a medical doctor, NP's are not physicians...for an NP to practice independently, there is too much of a chance for something major to be missed...you simply cannot substitute the "schooling".
I agree. "Independent practice" and "salutation" are 2 different issues. I am not an NP, but I am a nurse with a PhD who works in a hospital. I have earned my doctoral degree and the salutation of "Doctor," but my independence of practice lies only within the discipline of nursing.
I work in indigent care, on a mobile clinic (actually a beautifully-equipped semi with 3 exam rooms, a small lab and a dispensary). Usually we have 2 providers available, but at times I am the only provider onboard. Why? Because they can't always get MDs that are willing or able to work there. So it's me or nobody. My patients can be incredibly complex, and some of them are in need of specialist care. We do the best we can for them, and I really feel the responsibility of their care. Periodically after a clinic, I feel the need to go home and get out the books (we don't have room for a medical library on board), and there are times that I've called patients with new instructions.
What's interesting is that my co-providers are both young MDs (recent FP residency grads), and when I'm stumped about an issue, they're often stumped as well. I have better luck discussing patients at home with my husband, who's been an MD for many years. Of course, there are some times he says "look it up, that's what I'd have to do".
Dana
P.S. With regards to this thread's subject: I do not have a doctorate, I have a MSN. I always introduce myself as _____, a NP. Many of my patients call me doctor anyways, despite multiple corrections.
Specializes in ED, Cardiac-step down, tele, med surg.
I'm not sure any practitioner practices independently, as physicians may consult other members of the health care team for assistance. I think health care is becoming more and more collaborative. I think there may be a difference between autonomy and non-collaboration. One of the above posters mentioned that sometimes the physician may not be able to actually be there at all times when needed, she may be busy with other patients or the community does not have access to a physician (i.e. an impoverished urban or rural area, for ex.) so an NP or PA is all that is available. Within the hospital, there should always be help to rely upon if needed.
Are Nurses With a Doctor of Nursing Practice Degree Called "Doctor"?
Question:
I am thinking of going back to school to earn a DNP. If I earn this degree, can I be called "Doctor" when I practice? How must I identify myself to the public as a nurse practitioner?
The Clinical Doctorate
Practitioners, employers, credentialers, and the public may soon notice that the title "Doctor" applies to many health practitioners who are not physicians or dentists. The clinical doctorate (doctor of nursing practice [DNP]) signifies completion of a clinically focused, rather than research-focused, advanced degree program. Beginning in 2015, the DNP has been...
Specializes in ED, Cardiac-step down, tele, med surg.
Why is it important to be called "doctor"? Are physicians really trying to prohibit the use of "doctor" to apply to other health care professionals? I haven't had time to read all of the above post.
As a new MD I am terrified to be called doctor. The term is a public trust, contributed to over decades by the men and women who came before me, and when you use the term you draw on that trust. You cannot have it both ways, wrapping yourself in a word that means to people what it does because of the work of others and at the same time not *being* what those people were. At least not for long. That applies to anyone who uses the word, MD or not.
I study every day in the hope that I can someday live up to the assumptions people have about my level of knowledge. I wont be living up to it any time soon. I don't think NPs or DNPs should be called doctor for the same reason *I*, as some one with the degree, doesn't like being called doctor. It is not people of my knowledge and eduction that gave the term worth.
If the assertion that patients are savy enough to distinguish a half dozen different types of doctor from one another they should also be savy enough to accept a unique term for DNPs. If after years of experience with DNPs the public has the same reverence for them as for physicians then they wont need to appropriate a term that gained its meaning through others efforts...their own term will carry all the cache they need. But that is not what some would want. They, as a group, want to seize the respect associated with the term without earning it as a profession.
This should nor be construed to be a put down on any profession. My girl friend is an RN incidentally.
Welcome to allnurses and thankyou for your very valuable perspective on this issues. I don't think you have put down either profession you have articulated your opinions in a very respectful way. We don't have DNP's in the UK (yet) and nursing doctorates are not very common outside the academic arena I agree with your comment about public trust and I think that you have a really good point, it doesn't matter what title you call yourself it's how you live up to that title and perform at the levels that are expected. It took me ages to be able "wear" the NP title without feeling like a fraud after 4 years I feel like it fits.
I understand why someone would want to use the title they have earned through study, and feel entitled to use it but I can also see how this could be mis-intepreted by the patient as a MD.
If the assertion that patients are savy enough to distinguish a half dozen different types of doctor from one another they should also be savy enough to accept a unique term for DNPs. If after years of experience with DNPs the public has the same reverence for them as for physicians then they wont need to appropriate a term that gained its meaning through others efforts...their own term will carry all the cache they need. But that is not what some would want. They, as a group, want to seize the respect associated with the term without earning it as a profession.
I disagree...this is where the public simply needs to be educated.
I do agree, and would even support a law, that a physician can walk into a room and say, "Hello, I'm Dr. Smith", but I believe a DNP should introduce themselves (and be required to do so) as, "Hello, I'm Dr. Jones, and I am a nurse practioner."
To say anything less IS misleading the public.
Anyone upon entering a room should properly identify themselves. I don't believe a CNA should come in and take vitals without telling me she is a CNA...b/c I don't know if she is a CNA, a LPN or an RN.
I don't believe that someone who has earned a doctorate in a specific profession should have to "earn" the right after "many years" to receive a salutation as "Doctor". That has already been determined by our educational system and in most state laws, not all of them, but most.
What physicians need to understand, that while most people do associate the term "doctor" with "physician", that isn't the case--and dentists have been making this argument for years. Dentists are doctors, but they are not physicians. They are healthcare professionals, specializing in the care of the oral health.
Psychologists, are referred to as "Doctor", because they specialize in mental health and have a doctorate degree in that field.
They are not psychiatrists, who also have an MD, but called "Doctor" just the same...and psychiatrists don't have an issue with this because they work in harmony with one another and as a team and both thoroughly knows the other's role in the care of people with mental health concerns.
So why can't DNP's, NP's and Physicians do the same thing and respect each other's place and educational level instead of trying to fight for exclusive right to use a title that isn't theirs to start with?
Irregardless of the general public's understanding, I think it is important to remember that the word Doctor is not a profession, it is a level of education attained. Anyone who has completed a doctorate level course of study can, and should, be able to be called doctor (professors, scientists, health care professionals). A MD or DO is a Physician, which is the correct term for their chosen profession. To say that no one should now use the term doctor because through the years it has become a colloquialism for a physician is absurd. If I ever get my DNP, I will certainly make sure my patients know I'm a Nurse Practitioner, but I will not hesitate to use the title of Dr. Djc1981. :wink2:
Unless you happen to live in Oklahoma. Our state physicians ramrodded through a law that prevents us from doing that. The only exceptions include chiropractor, dentist, optometrist and podiatrist...
dhigbee
76 Posts
Well, this bright, enthusiastic, young person is 52 years old.