Note: This might seem like a strange topic, but seeing as how that is nothing new coming from the source, I'll go ahead anyway.
As nurses, we are trained to do everything we can to save someone until it's no longer feasible or unless doing so would go against a patient's wishes, such as performing CPR for a patient with a a DNR/DNI.
However, theoretically, anyone of us could "code" at anytime--and this includes at work.
For those who are full codes, this wouldn't create any ethical issues. You would simply perform CPR on your coworker as you would anyone else.
However, for those who have DNR/DNIs, issues could come up if coworkers are unaware such orders exist. How do we ensure that these coworkers have their wishes respected should the need come up?
For example, I am legally a Full Code but am wanting to pursue a DNR/DNI. Based on my age and no apparent health issues, I have a feeling most of my coworkers would automatically assume I am a Full Code should circumstances arise, however.
What is the best way to inform my coworkers that under no circumstances should anyone provide CPR to me?
For the rest of you, how do you ensure your coworkers' wishes for CPR or no CPR are ensured? Have you ever experienced such an ethical dilemma at work?
Seriously doubt you’ll find an ethical physician who will sign DNR papers for a perfectly healthy young person who experiences a sudden and unexpected medical crisis or trauma. This post is disturbing in a “suicide by cop” kind of way. What a horrible position to put your co-workers in.
Please get help.
Curious as to how it would be unethical for a physician to sign DNR/DNI orders for a healthy 30 year old? My thinking is just as a 92-year old with 20+ diagnoses has the right to be a full code, a healthy 30-year-old should also have the right to be a DNR/DNI.
I'm not sure how this would be putting anyone in a horrible position. I would think it would actually make things easier for all to know that I do not wish to be resuscitated in any circumstances.
7 hours ago, Davey Do said:
SilverBells is the National Enquirer of allnurses.
There are plenty of boring threads about how to do a job interview, or other mundane subjects. It's nice to see something a little more lively.
Yes. This thread takes a break from ordinary subjects you'll see multiple times on this website and brings forth a subject that most would not think of, but in reality, could be applicable to the workplace.
If we take the facts presented by OP at face value, do you think that it’s healthy for a person in their early thirties without any morbidities to be adamant about wishing to be DNR and choosing to share that on the internet? Perhaps that’s creativity to you. I see it differently.
What is wrong with someone in their 30's knowing their wishes? Not everyone desires to live for a long time. This thread was designed to address my concerns that many people would assume that someone my age and with my health would automatically wish to be a full code, which is not true.
This thread brings a valid concern forward. If I, as a 30 year old nurse, do not wish to be resuscitated in any circumstances, including at work, who is to say that there are not other nurses who would feel the same way? Just as we must respect a 92 year old's desire to be a full code, a younger person's wishes to be a DNR/DNI should also be considered. And since this is something that could happen in the workplace among nurse colleagues, it is something to think about. How do we respect the wishes of colleagues if they have a known code status?
I find it amazingly arrogant that you actually feel that you know what you want at this stage in your life!
I hope you are aware that your circumstances as well as your perspective changes as you get older and learn more. Therefore your decisions will change. By initiating a discussion of such a strange topic with your colleagues, aren't you running a risk of them judging you and changing your current relationships with them? Surely that is something only your immediate family and legal representative should know about.
Consider how you are viewed in this forum? Caffeine consumption and erratic sleep and work schedules. Now I am a person who pays no attention and remembers practically nothing about anyone, except for a very few people here, but you stand out.
Get my point? You maybe defined wrongly with the subsequent consequences if you broach a DNR with your colleagues.
How is it arrogant for me to know my wishes at age 30? Some people do not wish to live forever, and I am one of them. Therefore, I have decided that should something happen to me at work, I desire my coworkers to not perform any heroic measures. I am not sure how this is arrogant at all, simply me knowing that if I am gone, I am gone. No need to bring me back. And since there is no way to predict a code and I obviously work with nurses, I would think this information would be relevant in the workplace as well, not just at home. One cannot predict the time of one's code after all. And my coworkers being aware of my wishes would make things easier for all.
And since this is something that could happen in the workplace among nurse colleagues, it is something to think about. How do we respect the wishes of colleagues if they have a known code status?
Come to think of it, for a new job, I had to fill out an extensive health background check. It covered mental health/history of addiction in far greater detail than I have ever seen from any other company (possibly because of the area the hospital is located in and the clientele I will be serving- was told that an estimated 75% of patients I'll be seeing have problems related to substance use). Nowhere in that long, somewhat repetitive pamphlet did it ask about code status.
Curious as to how it would be unethical for a physician to sign DNR/DNI orders for a healthy 30 year old?
Gotta agree. In the old days when I was a first responder about that same age I had an advanced care plan as to my explicit wishing allowing my natural death all worked out ...in writing... and discussed with my family.
I'd seen far too much to ever, ever want to exist chained to this earth by well meaning medical people with laryngoscopes and vents.
That POV has not changed one little bit in the intervening decades.
I know codes can happen anywhere and to anyone, but you cited heavy caffeine use as a possible factor in your hypothetical emergency. How do you feel about taking steps to prevent a health emergency?
I figure if a code happens, it happens. At this time, I am single and childless so there's no real incentive for me to prevent any emergency of any kind. Unless, of course, said emergency involves one of my patients, but that's a different subject.
Now I do lose sleep over whether or not I might not be relieved because a coworker has found their way into jail and has not made bail.
This actually happened! A coworker got arrested and couldn't come in for their shift (or so they said). They later claimed that it was actually their twin sister who got arrested and that they were helping their sister. They later (recounting the same incident) claimed that their twin sister had an outstanding warrant and, in a case of mistaken identity, they (the coworker) were the one who got arrested.
As far as I know, I have never met this coworker's twin sister.
SilverBells, BSN
1,108 Posts
Curious as to how it would be unethical for a physician to sign DNR/DNI orders for a healthy 30 year old? My thinking is just as a 92-year old with 20+ diagnoses has the right to be a full code, a healthy 30-year-old should also have the right to be a DNR/DNI.
I'm not sure how this would be putting anyone in a horrible position. I would think it would actually make things easier for all to know that I do not wish to be resuscitated in any circumstances.
?