Covid Vaccine

Nurses COVID

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I’m sure you all know about the COVID vaccine and the plan to first vaccinate healthcare workers. How does everyone feel about this vaccine ? I personally do not want it..Where are the long term studies. IDK it’s worrisome to me that it will prob be mandated for us 

The idea that if we don't take a certain vaccine then we are at an increased risk of "giving" the infection to someone else (patients, family) is completely backed by no scientific data at all. So the theory is, if one healthy person who takes care of their body has healthy diet maintains strict exercise patterns and everything else that involves avoiding being sick because they understand how the immune system works, if they decide to not receive a influenza or covid vaccine then all the sudden that same person is going to contract it without knowing and not feel sick and then give it to somebody else it's just completely insane. 

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On 11/25/2020 at 6:38 PM, katerinsols said:

Well myself and a few nurses are weary of it because of how it is being rushed and I trust the government to cut corners. I am no anti vaxxer but seeing how this vaccine has been made into a whole political thing.. 

I feel like people should be given options, why should we always be forced to do this. I would like to read the studies on the trials.

If anything I believe the most vulnerable should be given the vaccine. I would rather wear my mask, wash my hands and distance. Right now I still have the antibodies from when I got it back in March. Just no..

Welcome to AN!

I agree that you should read the vaccine studies. Right now we only have the interim data released by the various pharmaceutical companies conducting vaccine trials and I too will look for further information in peer-reviewed medical journals when it becomes available. That’s just science-based medicine 101 in my opinion. 

My personal stance is that I don’t like vaccines being mandated. But it is my hope that a large part of the population are sufficiently informed to understand exactly how lucky we are to have vaccines (in general) in the first place and that vaccines save a very large number of human lives and prevents morbidity. I certainly expect individuals with an education in the healthcare field to appreciate this. 

I’m curious, if you are wary that corners are being cut, why do you think that  it’s better to give the vaccine to a population more vulnerable than you?

My default position regarding vaccines is that they are beneficial to our individual and collective health. I will evaluate each candidate on its scientific data/merit but I don’t understand this ”blanket scepticism” that you and others are voicing. 


 

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On 11/28/2020 at 6:02 AM, Probably said:

I presume that you all are aware that this vaccine isn't a traditional vaccine? That is, this vaccine doesn't make use of a weakened COVID-19 virus. This vaccine will use messenger RNA (mRNA). I'd be less leery if the vaccine did contain an attenuated COVID-19 virus. However, mRNA! That's too worrisome! 

Welcome to AN!

Which vaccine are you referring to when you say ”this vaccine”? Pfizer/BioNTech’s and Moderna’s vaccines are mRNA vaccines but there are several others currently in phase 3 trials that aren’t. 

Do you want to provide some further information on why you consider mRNA vaccines worrisome? 

I have some questions I want answered myself but it bothers me when someone who identifies as a BSN states that a vaccine that might soon receive approval states it’s ”worrisome” without providing a single supporting fact for that worry. We as nurses should be fact and science-based, not emotion-based when we evaluate different treatments and interventions. 

https://www.CDC.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/mrna.html

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I'm not for it and I'm no anti-vaxxer. There are many strains and people who've had the virus aren't immune and can catch it again because the antibodies aren't long-lasting. So if that's the case, how long do they expect this vax to provide immunity? What evidence supports it? Which strand does it provide immunity against? One of them? All of them? I have too many unanswered questions AND I'm leery of anything mandated that has nothing to support it. I am high risk but that doesn't mean a vax will be forced upon me as a test dummy.

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7 hours ago, Jack Peace said:

The idea that if we don't take a certain vaccine then we are at an increased risk of "giving" the infection to someone else (patients, family) is completely backed by no scientific data at all. So the theory is, if one healthy person who takes care of their body has healthy diet maintains strict exercise patterns and everything else that involves avoiding being sick because they understand how the immune system works, if they decide to not receive a influenza or covid vaccine then all the sudden that same person is going to contract it without knowing and not feel sick and then give it to somebody else it's just completely insane. 

Welcome to AN!

You haven’t identified yourself as a nurse (or paramedic etc.) so I’m unsure of you have any healthcare related education?

The claim that an unvaccinated individual is at an increased risk of infecting another individual is not ”backed by no scientific data at all”. On the contrary.  We know that it’s possible for vaccines to decrease transmission. 

You do not specify if you are speaking about a specific vaccine or just vaccines in general.

There are vaccines that only prevent disease and others that prevent infection, ie prevents colonization and transmission. 

As far as I know the study designs of the various Covid vaccine trials currently ongoing have only looked at protective efficacy against disease, and their ability to actually protect against being infected in the first place is unknown at this time. We will learn more in the future. 

Who has claimed that if a person chooses not to take a flu or Covid-19 vaccine, then they will all of a sudden become infected ”without knowing it and without feeling sick and then give it to somebody else”? 

I’m not sure what it is you consider insane. I think you need to provide further information/data in support of that claim. 

Are you aware that individuals can have a Covid-19 infection and be asymptomatic? It is absolutely possible to have a Covid infection and not be aware that you do. It is more common that you have at least some mild symptoms, but you can also feel healthy. Are you aware that they are also considered a risk when it comes to infecting others? Are you aware that with infectious diseases in general it is not unusual to be able to infect others in the day or days, before symptoms occur? 

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32 minutes ago, NurseBlaq said:

I'm not for it and I'm no anti-vaxxer. There are many strains and people who've had the virus aren't immune and can catch it again because the antibodies aren't long-lasting. So if that's the case, how long do they expect this vax to provide immunity? What evidence supports it? Which strand does it provide immunity against? One of them? All of them? I have too many unanswered questions AND I'm leery of anything mandated that has nothing to support it. I am high risk but that doesn't mean a vax will be forced upon me as a test dummy.

Well, as I’ve said a few times I absolutely agree that we should do our due diligence and research the relevant published data before we make a decision. 

When you ask questions like how long a vaccine will provide immunity and what evidence supports it, surely you already know the answer to that? It is impossible to have data beyond the duration of the trials so far. That’s a no-brainer. 

Only you can decide what’s best for you and as I already mentioned, I don’t think that vaccines should mandated.

However, I don’t agree with the of use the term ”forced” unless people are being tied up or handcuffed in place and subsequently injected. If that’s not what’s happening you still have a choice, even if it’s a hard one like leaving your job. 

And I think we should all be grateful for the many tens of thousands of ”test dummies” that have volunteered for the Covid vaccine trials and many more who have volunteered for others through the years. Without people willing to do that, modern medicine would be less effective than it is today. 

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2 minutes ago, macawake said:

Well, as I’ve said a few times I absolutely agree that we should do our due diligence and research the relevant published data before we make a decision. 

There is no research data, only the words of the drug companies competing to peddle their unchecked/unresearched/unchallenged/non-peer reviewed drugs. We have to take their word and that's it. I don't trust their word, especially in today's environment and in a year where several drug company admins have been charged/found guilty of deceiving the public about their product leading to ill effects on the public.

When you ask questions like how long a vaccine will provide immunity and what evidence supports it, surely you already know the answer to that? It is impossible to have data beyond the duration of the trials so far. That’s a no-brainer.

That's my point. There is no evidence yet they're trying to mandate a vax with zero supporting information.

Only you can decide what’s best for you and as I already mentioned, I don’t think that vaccines should mandated.

However, I don’t agree with the of use the term ”forced” unless people are being tied up or handcuffed in place and subsequently injected. If that’s not what’s happening you still have a choice, even if it’s a hard one like leaving your job. 

You're playing semantics. Mandated is forced especially if people are at risk of losing their income in a depression for not getting a vax they don't feel comfortable receiving. They're forced to comply or lose their jobs. What if they're in a saturated or rural area? It's the equivalent of being handcuffed and it's only being done because employers know this. They have too much authority over our physical being.

And I think we should all be grateful for the many tens of thousands of ”test dummies” that have volunteered for these vaccine trials and many more who have volunteered for others through the years. Without people willing to do that, modern medicine would be less effective than it is today. 

How did you arrive at this? They volunteered to be "test dummies", it wasn't forced upon them like it's being done/will be done to us. Volunteering and mandating are different things. Some "volunteers" get paid to participate in trials too so there's that as well.

 

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39 minutes ago, NurseBlaq said:

 

When you write your reply inside a quoted post it means that the post you write can’t be quoted but shows up like the above blank.

When you use this ”format” it’s more work to than I’m willing to do to copy and paste the parts of your post that I would like to respond to.

But one thing I do wonder is why you think that I am of the opinion that anyone of us should take a vaccine based only on interim data? I’ve been crystal clear in several of these covid vaccine threads that I first intend to look at the complete study details once they’ve been peer-reviewed and published. 
 

 

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1 hour ago, macawake said:

When you write your reply inside a quoted post it means that the post you write can’t be quoted but shows up like the above blank.

When you use this ”format” it’s more work to than I’m willing to do to copy and paste the parts of your post that I would like to respond to.

But one thing I do wonder is why you think that I am of the opinion that anyone of us should take a vaccine based only on interim data? I’ve been crystal clear in several of these covid vaccine threads that I first intend to look at the complete study details once they’ve been peer-reviewed and published. 
 

 

I didn't say you are of any opinion. I replied to this thread with my response and you responded to me so here we are in this discussion. In my replies to you, I'm responding to what you're saying. Also, if that's your stance why reply with a rebuttal in the first place? I'm not getting that vaccine because I have too many unanswered questions and no way to get answers or further information so it's a no for me and I don't care what any employer says, I'm not doing it! The drug makers don't have enough information on their own vax so it's like blind testing on the public IMO.

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Specializes in Vascular Surgery.

The idea that the public is given such contradictory information-since day one- is extremely concerning. We are told to social distance, yet we sit in restaurants, on airplanes, etc., and we eat, drink, etc. while our masks are off.

We are told young people are pretty much immune and less likely to gett Covid. We are told to wear our masks in public-Yet, we see thousands wearing their mask UNDER their nose. We see Government officials sneaking around without a mask; talking, drinking, eating, etc. We see businesses closed down, churches closed down-while bars and casinos run full force. The public has no faith in anyone anymore! I've seen medical professionals on TV with their mask under their nose! Do they, as doctors and nurses, etc., not Know that viruses are more likely to invade and survive through the nasal cavity than the mouth!? People are scared and they don't know where to turn, because they feel they can't trust anyone! WHY would people trust a vaccine that has not been given a thorough and proper research time? I do NOT trust this vaccine! There has never been a virus in the history of mankind that has gotten this kind of fear-mongering response from any government. Now, we shut down businesses one day, open others the next day, etc. It's Insane.

I have over 34 years experience in the hospital setting, and I am saying this whole mess has something going on more than a virus. I just read that they are in the process of implementing Passports that must Prove you have taken the vaccine Before you can fly! Be aware of scare tactics that create so much fear-people will do anything they are Told. Be cautious. Be judicious. But be wise. I'm not saying the virus is a hoax-but I am saying they have 'skewed' the stats from the beginning.

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Specializes in Vascular Surgery.

At this point in time, I think a mandated vaccine is dangerous at best. People may not be required Yet...but being Coerced is just as wrong. Threatening people (staff or others) with the loss of jobs, income, travel, etc. is the same as 'forcing.' When you are so coerced that you have no choice, if you want to eat, pay your bills, and just live your life, firing people is putting them in a position of being forced to accept a vaccine they do not want, have no faith in, has not been proven, has no concept of future adverse effects, and is daily touted by labs around the world as a viable vaccine. If those who volunteered are fine with possible adverse effects, unknown side effects, etc., that was their 'choice.' We all did not volunteer. We all do not want this vaccine. I am a firm believer in vaccinations-always have been. But this is not a proven, time tested option. When a lab plays around with peoples DNA (mRNA), it's time to stop and think! Exactly when did we lose our freedom of choice?

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13 hours ago, SWRNURSE said:

WHY would people trust a vaccine that has not been given a thorough and proper research time? I do NOT trust this vaccine!

 

13 hours ago, SWRNURSE said:

We all do not want this vaccine. I am a firm believer in vaccinations-always have been. But this is not a proven, time tested option. When a lab plays around with peoples DNA (mRNA), it's time to stop and think! Exactly when did we lose our freedom of choice?

Welcome to AN! You are one of several new posters who have recently joined this community. You appear to have one thing in common and that is that you seem to distrust Covid-19 vaccines and you also seem to think that the pandemic we’ve experienced worldwide is something more sinister or nefarious than for example the 1918 flu pandemic which also posed a huge challenge to the world. 

Regarding the vaccine, none has been approved yet. As a nurse don’t you think you should wait to make your decision until you’ve actually had the chance to review the complete study data when they become available?

I don’t know if you are aware but mRNA vaccines most definitely to not change a human beings DNA. They do not ”play around” with your DNA.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-covid-19-vaccine-modify-idUSKBN22U2BZ
 

What do you consider a ”thorough and proper research time”? How long do you think a vaccine trial has to last and how many study participants would have to be enrolled before you would feel comfortable taking an approved vaccine? I will definitely study the details when they become available and base my decision on what I find out, but I feel reasonably confident that any potential serious side effects will likely have been identified. Most of the phase 3 trials that are currently ongoing appear to be quite large. I don’t know of many vaccine-related serious side effects that show up years after you’ve taken the vaccine? Do you? 
 

 

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