Country's with socialized medicine vs the USA (Personal Income Tax)

RN4MERCY · Jul 26, 2009

The website from NPR does not count. NPR is blatantly liberal, there facts and figures are as corrupt as Hugo Chavez.
Please stop listening to NPR and MSNBC.

Typical. Can't argue the facts so you shoot the messenger..."blatantly liberal" "corrupt as Hugo Chavez"? Aw, c'mon. Which facts and figures do you dispute? The doctors and nurses are saying the patient has cancer (or, if you will, a broken health care system) and someone like you says, please stop listening to those doctors, and those nurses, who by the way have been quoted extensively on NPR, MSNBC, and Bill Moyer's Journal on PBS in support of a single payer national health plan. So what's your solution? More corporate cronyism? More inhumanity and injustice and the highest rate of death from preventable/treatable causes in the modern industrialized world? :typing

Neveranurseagain, RN · Jul 26, 2009

GCTMT made a good point! Trust the government for our health care or a private for profit insurance company???? I'd take the nonprofit system of the government any day!

allnurses Guide · Jul 26, 2009

one percenters enjoy unprecedented protection

friday 24 july 2009

according to government figures, 1 percenters' share of america's total income is the highest it's been since 1929, and their tax rates are the lowest they've faced in two decades.

through bonuses, many 1 percenters will profit from the $23 trillion in bailout largesse the treasury department now says could be headed to financial firms. and most of them benefit from irs decisions to reduce millionaire audits and collect zero taxes from the majority of major corporations.

but what really makes the ultra-wealthy so fortunate, what truly separates this moment from a run-of-the-mill gilded age, is the unprecedented protection the 1 percenters have bought for themselves on the most pressing issues.

to review: with 22,000 americans dying each year because they lack health insurance, congress is considering universal health-care legislation financed by a surcharge on income above $280,000 - that is, a levy almost exclusively on 1 percenters.

this surtax would graze just 5 percent of small businesses and would recoup only part of the $700 billion the 1 percenters received from the bush tax cuts. in fact, it is so miniscule, those making $1 million annually would pay just $9,000 more in taxes every year - or nine-tenths of 1 percent of their 12-month haul.

nonetheless, the 1 percenters have deployed an army to destroy the initiative.

the foot soldiers are the land rover liberals. these democratic lawmakers secure their lefty labels by wearing pink-ribbon lapel pins and supporting good causes like abortion rights.

however, being affluent and/or from affluent districts, they routinely drive their luxury cars over middle-class economic interests. hence, this week's letter from boulder's dot-com tycoon rep. jared polis, d, and other land rover liberals calling for the surtax's death….’

…that fantastical fairly tale, of course, couldn't exist without the millionaire media - the elite journalists and opinion mongers who represent corporate media conglomerates and/or are themselves extremely wealthy….

…most brazenly, nbc's meredith vieira asks president barack obama why the surtax is intent on "punishing the rich"?...

… for his part, obama has responded with characteristic coolness – and a powerful counter-strike. "no, it's not punishing the rich," he said. "if i can afford to do a little bit more so that a whole bunch of families out there have a little more security, when i already have security, that's part of being a community."

http://www.truthout.org/072509d?print

wowza · Jul 26, 2009

Actually, wowza, with all of my combined income, investments, and property.. I do pay about 35 to37% ...and most nurses in the area where i work make over 100k a year...not bragging, but since you want to try and figure/guesstimate how much i make a year...your figures were way off, but how i arrived at my tax bracket was at 37% with all my mutualfunds, stocks, investments...etc... I as well as other nurses i know who are single pay through the nose in taxes... All i was saying was, if we are going to pay that much in taxes then I would hope someone could benefit through a free healthcare system/ socialized system... Heck, I would be willing to smile every april, when i make the check out to the lovely IRS, instead of crying...lol If we had healthcare for every man, woman, and child in the U.S. That was all I was getting at in my post.. I didn't mean to confuse you with ..how was it that bush said..oh yeah...FUZZY MATH!!! not my intention at all... LOL.. Not trying to offend any ones politics.. Thanks!

I am glad that you are doing well for yourself but the math still doesn't work to get you to 37%. At 110K without state taxes you are paying 22.5% in income taxes not 37%.

Neither property tax nor is investment tax can be considered "income tax". For instance, these are not included in the statistic when comparing the US income tax to that of other countries. So your income tax is actually 22.5% well below the income tax rate of other socialized countries. Furthermore, their property taxes are often much higher than the US rate. So while you may be paying a total amt of 37% in the US, you would be paying much more in another country.

To illustrate the disparity in taxation, let's look at income tax in Canada:

US income tax on $110,000= 22.5%

Canadian Tax on $110,000= 33.3%

Even assuming you would have the same taxes on your property/investments add another 14.5%

Overall tax rate of traumamike- 37%

Overall tax rate in canada- 47.8%

So you may feel you pay through the nose now, but other countries really pay through the nose.

wowza · Jul 26, 2009

to review: with 22,000 americans dying each year because they lack health insurance, congress is considering universal health-care legislation financed by a surcharge on income above $280,000 - that is, a levy almost exclusively on 1 percenters.
this surtax would graze just 5 percent of small businesses and would recoup only part of the$700 billion the 1 percenters received from the bush tax cuts.in fact, it is so miniscule, those making $1 million annually would pay just $9,000 more in taxes every year - or nine-tenths of 1 percent of their 12-month haul.

what the piece fails to tell you is that the top 1% now pays a larger proportion of all the taxes the irs gets than it ever has. oh but that wouldn't support the author's point so it was left out. convenient.

i would like to call attention to the highlighted portion because it exemplifies the position of those pushing for the rich to pay for universal health care. recoup was an interesting choice of words. to recoup is to get back a portion of something due to you. it is to get back something you have a rightful claim to. in this case the author shows that he feels the gov't has a rightful claim to the money of the "rich".

those on the left feel the gov't has a right to take your money. it is their money, not yours. it is seen clearly in this piece herring_rn quoted. when the author uses the word recoup, he infers that the tax cuts gave money back from the government's coffers; the gov't lost money and now reversing the cuts will allow them to recoup their losses. again this assumes it was their money from the get-go. the reality however is that the cuts kept the gov't from taking money out of the pockets of those who had earned it. it is a paradigm shift from the ideals of our founding fathers. the author, exemplifying the position of those on the left, shows that he feels the gov't has a right to take the spoils of your labor. it is theirs anyway... :rolleyes:

Crash_Cart · Jul 26, 2009

http://helpglobe.com/answers.aspx?qid=152
Notice the countries with the highest personal income taxes are those who have adopted universal health care plans. Do you really want $.50 of every dollar you earn being turned over to the government?

Perhaps instead of paying .50 in federal tax, it's better to shell out $1000's and $1000's of dollars in out of pocket expenses, co-pays, insurance premiums and other similar fees (even if you have "so called" private insurance) instead?

Funny how an Aspirin doesn't cost $10 each in the Canadian health care system but they do in the American health care system..? Who do you suppose pays that little "extra" cost which actually amounts to billions of extra dollars in "profit" revenue for the private health insurance companies? ...Do the taxpayers or does the insurance company pay for it through your private insurance plan? Basically, you are already paying the "extra" money anyways. No, it's not in the form of a direct "tax" but you ARE paying more for the same basic services than other countries which offer universal health care. ...A lot more!!

With universal health care, you have public accountability for the costs associated with products and services offered unlike the "for profit" health care service we currently have. This is what happens in a "private market" Costs are NOT placed under the "public taxpayer microscope" and that's why an Aspirin costs $10 each when you get a hospital bill in the United States. So the "extra taxes" argument is a moot point because you are paying for it one way or another anyways.

I suspect Universal Heath care will actually decrease costs associated with providing health care. Oh, yeah.. that's exactly why there's so much opposition to it in Congress. The big drug pushers and their private health insurance plan buddies stand to loose a pile of money and that translates into lost political campaign contributions for politicians too. Gee, no wonder there's so much political opposition to the idea huh? :nuke: I used to think politicians supported the people and with 41 million uninsured Americans you would think they would. Oh, yeah.. it's about money..not people.

My Best.

CRNA2007 · Jul 26, 2009

I gurantee I make double what you made last year and I did not pay a final tax of 37% even your investments those are taxed at a capital gains rate which as of now is no where close to 37%. Plus very few states have no state income tax so I know you are not working in a high paying state such as California or possibly New york. so I am pretty sure you are not in a high hourly rate (almost $50/hr to hit 100K per year unless you are working enormous amounts of overtime) plus you have a personal deduction as well as possible interest on a house you are paying. Plus, with so many investments that you claim to have some of those are going to be tax deferred which will also bring down the final amount of your taxable income. I am in no way buying that you are taxed that high but don't mind paying more for health care for all.

Actually, wowza, with all of my combined income, investments, and property.. I do pay about 35 to37% ...and most nurses in the area where i work make over 100k a year...not bragging, but since you want to try and figure/guesstimate how much i make a year...your figures were way off, but how i arrived at my tax bracket was at 37% with all my mutualfunds, stocks, investments...etc... I as well as other nurses i know who are single pay through the nose in taxes... All i was saying was, if we are going to pay that much in taxes then I would hope someone could benefit through a free healthcare system/ socialized system... Heck, I would be willing to smile every april, when i make the check out to the lovely IRS, instead of crying...lol If we had healthcare for every man, woman, and child in the U.S. That was all I was getting at in my post.. I didn't mean to confuse you with ..how was it that bush said..oh yeah...FUZZY MATH!!! not my intention at all... LOL.. Not trying to offend any ones politics.. Thanks!

traumamike · Jul 28, 2009

I gurantee I make double what you made last year and I did not pay a final tax of 37% even your investments those are taxed at a capital gains rate which as of now is no where close to 37%. Plus very few states have no state income tax so I know you are not working in a high paying state such as California or possibly New york. so I am pretty sure you are not in a high hourly rate (almost $50/hr to hit 100K per year unless you are working enormous amounts of overtime) plus you have a personal deduction as well as possible interest on a house you are paying. Plus, with so many investments that you claim to have some of those are going to be tax deferred which will also bring down the final amount of your taxable income. I am in no way buying that you are taxed that high but don't mind paying more for health care for all.

actually, If you must know I made 125,000 last year. and i have alot of hedge funds that did almost 300k, and 10k a month in rental property.:bowingpur So, congratulations on being the highest paid nurse in the WORLD!!!!! And before you can ask...the reason I do nursing is for the same reason I went into nursing, and most likely the reason you went into nursing.... To help and to care for sick people!!!! Not the money, I didn't need the money when i went into it in the first place....So there, i am glad you made almost 1million dollars last year as the highest paid nurse on the planet, but that doesn't change the fact that we are still over taxed in this country with no organized socialized healthcare. That is all I was stating, that I and everyone else pays to much tax for what is offered to the less fortunate. And also yes the 125,000 is with some overtime, but I love my job, And yes before you say something else ...I do give back to mine and other communities with doctors without borders.... Thanks!

CRNA2007 · Jul 29, 2009

Not buying it. Not just anyone can invest in hedge funds and they typically require several hundred thousand dollars to invest and in this economy making almost 300K, Puhlease. If you are such a good investor and have all this rental property then you would certainly know how to avoid paying taxes on a lot of the income, so again being taxed at 37% is highly unbelievable since you can apparently make money better than Warren Buffet. The point I do agree is that we are overtaxed in this country.

actually, If you must know I made 125,000 last year. and i have alot of hedge funds that did almost 300k, and 10k a month in rental property.:bowingpur So, congratulations on being the highest paid nurse in the WORLD!!!!! And before you can ask...the reason I do nursing is for the same reason I went into nursing, and most likely the reason you went into nursing.... To help and to care for sick people!!!! Not the money, I didn't need the money when i went into it in the first place....So there, i am glad you made almost 1million dollars last year as the highest paid nurse on the planet, but that doesn't change the fact that we are still over taxed in this country with no organized socialized healthcare. That is all I was stating, that I and everyone else pays to much tax for what is offered to the less fortunate. And also yes the 125,000 is with some overtime, but I love my job, And yes before you say something else ...I do give back to mine and other communities with doctors without borders.... Thanks!

CRNA2007 · Jul 31, 2009

Still not buying it. First of all hedge funds are not something you can just call up scott trade and get into. Secondly, hedge fund require a tremendous amound of investment usually several hundred thousand dollars. Making 300k in hedge funds when everyone else was losing their shirts on investments this past year I also find truly amazing as would Warren Buffet. Are you even a nurse? If you were you would know that I am not a staff nurse but a nurse anesthetist (CRNA). The rental property I could believe that one. But if you are so savvy in the market and in real estate then whu would you be paying a 37% income tax rate? A savvy person such as yourself would know how to have write offs to avoid such a penalty. So I find your post really hard to believe and appears overly "perfect".

actually, If you must know I made 125,000 last year. and i have alot of hedge funds that did almost 300k, and 10k a month in rental property.:bowingpur So, congratulations on being the highest paid nurse in the WORLD!!!!! And before you can ask...the reason I do nursing is for the same reason I went into nursing, and most likely the reason you went into nursing.... To help and to care for sick people!!!! Not the money, I didn't need the money when i went into it in the first place....So there, i am glad you made almost 1million dollars last year as the highest paid nurse on the planet, but that doesn't change the fact that we are still over taxed in this country with no organized socialized healthcare. That is all I was stating, that I and everyone else pays to much tax for what is offered to the less fortunate. And also yes the 125,000 is with some overtime, but I love my job, And yes before you say something else ...I do give back to mine and other communities with doctors without borders.... Thanks!