CNAS behind Nurses Station more than nurse

[vanurse1968]

I work in a LTC facility. The CNA's are sitting behind the nurse's station more than the nurses. We don't even have enough room to sit down and chart! I have had to ask them to move on several occasions (more than I care to count). :angryfire

Are there regulations about who is allowed behind a nurse's station? If so, would someone please show me where to find it????

[flashpoint]

I don't think that CNAs should be expected to know everything about a resident. I do, however, think that they have a right to know. CNAs are the ones on the front line of care. If there is something going on with the resident, whether it be a medical condition, psychological condition, trouble with family, etc, the CNAs have a right to know...they need to know why the resident is peeing orange or that they are upset because of something going on with their family or that they may act out because the doctor just changed their psych meds...

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

I don't think that CNAs should be expected to know everything about a resident. I do, however, think that they have a right to know. CNAs are the ones on the front line of care. If there is something going on with the resident, whether it be a medical condition, psychological condition, trouble with family, etc, the CNAs have a right to know...they need to know why the resident is peeing orange or that they are upset because of something going on with their family or that they may act out because the doctor just changed their psych meds...

And the nurse has access to this info, and if a CNA needs to know something, either the nurses should tell them, or the CNAs should ask.

[ktwlpn, LPN]

I don't think that CNAs should be expected to know everything about a resident. I do, however, think that they have a right to know. CNAs are the ones on the front line of care. If there is something going on with the resident, whether it be a medical condition, psychological condition, trouble with family, etc, the CNAs have a right to know...they need to know why the resident is peeing orange or that they are upset because of something going on with their family or that they may act out because the doctor just changed their psych meds...

They generallly get a pretty inclusive report from me-of course they are often eating,drinking coffee and chatting through out....I am all about involving them in the plan of care-the ones that care.....Sad that many don't...all they seem to want to do is feed,wipe,dipe and leave.....Problem is-and I am speaking generally-the requirement to become a cna is being able to read at a 6th grade level in PA --Just kidding-I don't know what it really is but judging by the current crop at my ltc it isn't much...Many of these men and women don't even have a high school diploma and some are just barely literate enough to pass the testing.They have never learned manners in the home or work place-some are strangers to the work ethic.....Many are happy to do just enough to slide by and they are earning more money then they ever have (working where I do) They are fighting in front of the residents-damaging cars in the parking lot-sleeping with each other's boyfriends and husbands-and accidently dropping their bags of dope in the hall....But they are directly responsible for a most helpless segment of the population.....Believe me-I appreciate the good cna's and do my best to encourage them to learn why they are doing the things they do-I am often asked to write recommendations for cna's whom want to continue their education....But the other kind cannot be trusted for a minute-the ones I work with will look for every opportunity to slack off and I HATE it....These people in our care are someone's beloved mom,dad,sister ,child or husband---

[Mystery5]

In LTC I found that the CNA's pretty much run the show. You just have some real hardened characters who do this type of work. It's usually the ones who are older and have been doing it for years. I've found the younger ones who are doing it temporarily pretty amiable.

I always got along with them really well. I was thankful for their hard work that they did, and I never tried to get blood out of a turnip. Also, I never went out of my way to call them to do some dirty work if it was just as easy for me to do it. They really appreciated that.

I work in a hospital now, and there are less CNA's per nurse, which makes the whole situation more manageable. The only issue I've had is the O2 SAT machines that we got which hang around your neck. I insist on having one the entire shift for spot checks and have had to stand my ground.

[flashpoint]

So if the nurse is going to tell the CNAs everything the need to know anyway, HIPAA is not a reason for CNAs not to be behind the desk. Nurses should have prioity on the seats behind the desk, simply because they have mroe charting, need to make phone calls, etc. I get so tired of everyone with more training than the next guy treating people like they are second class citizens...a little respect goes a long way. CNAs should not have to stand to chart...they should have the right to get off their feet during the shift as long as the work is getting done. I would much rather have the CNAs at the desk where they can be available to answer call lights, answer the phone, assist visitors, etc than sitting in the break room or in a smoking area outside...

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

I get so tired of everyone with more training than the next guy treating people like they are second class citizens...a little respect goes a long way.

What i said has nothing to do with my nursing training. What i'd said has to do with being a CNA for 11 years. This is not treating any staff like second class citizens, this is treating the pts. with respect to them and to their privacy.

One facility i worked for had computers that had pt. info on them. And the computers at the desk could access all the info on the pts. staying at the facility. This was a 4 floor facility. I did not need to know the report on the other floors because i was no where near them for my shift, so i would get a report on the floor i was on. Yes, i may learn that so-and-so has been incontinent and combative, but i did not need to know his SSN, his family's contact numbers, or the whole details of his psych eval., etc. For me to know things like that about my pts. would have been the same as me changing them and leaving the door wide open, that's the way i feel about it.

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

And on the other hand, never even HAD the chance TO sit the majority of the time.

[not now, RN]

I worked at one NH that had a policy that NAs could not sit behind the desk or even go behind the counter. At the time I thought it was harsh, but I do see the good points that policy could have, especially in situations as you relay.

How the heck is a CNA supposed to chart if he/she can't get behind the counter?

[stn2003, RN]

i work as a pct (similar to cna) at a local hospital to get me through school ( i graduate next year) and i just wanted to say that where i work, the pct's work our butts off! in fact, i missed both of my breaks today and barely had time for lunch on my 12 hr shift bc it was so stinking busy. we have team nursing and a great relationship with all the nurses, which i know is not true everywhere and i am very thankful for it.

we do sit behing the nurses station at times to chart or if we have a slow period, but if a nurse or doctor needed a seat we'd always be the first to offer to move. also, we have what we call a 'tech' sheet for all of the patient care techs to have for the entire day-at the end of the day it gets shredded- and it contains the census of the floor, who gets blood glucose monitoring and when, who has foleys, who is on telem, if there are contact precautions, the pt name and diagnosis etc. if we need additional info besides those general things, we usually just ask the nurse and dont go nosing through records or anything.

it makes me sad that there are cna's/whoever out there that would treat pt badly/neglect their duties bc it makes us all sound bad and incompetent : / thank god this does not go on where i work.

also, i think that we sometimes get taken for granted for what we do. i know how busy our nurses get with their pt assignments, and its hard for them to spend as much time with a pt as they'd like to, so the pct's end up spending the most time with the pts. as a student i can't help but go through a mini-assessment in my head while bathing a pt, and i always make sure to let the nurse know of anything i might find unusual and most times they are very receptive bc it gives them more info on which pts may need to have issues addressed that may have so far gone unnoticed.

staff needs to treat eachother with respect bc in the end we are all responsible and accountable for the care we give. cnas need to respect the nurses for what they do, and vice versa. we all have long days, get frustrated, etc but should remain professional.

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

How the heck is a CNA supposed to chart if he/she can't get behind the counter?

Heck, some places i worked at, there wasn't enough room for all the nurses to get back there to chart. They stood like the rest of us.

[Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN]

staff needs to treat eachother with respect bc in the end we are all responsible and accountable for the care we give.

Exactly.

[night owl]

I don't mind them being there and doing their computer charting, but when the three computers that we do have at the desk have three cna's from the oncoming shift browsing the net and I still have to do a few notes before I can go home, it ticks me off how they have no clue that they're even at work. They can sit there for an hour or more being sucked into the cyber world unaware of their surroundings while the pt's breakfast trays are at the bedside getting cold and the pt is waiting to be fed. I usually have to tell them to give up their browsing so the pts can eat. I really hate playing their mother.