CNA or EMT while in school, CNA being a "dirty job" help please

KdnRN2B · Sep 7, 2008

i guess i'm going against the general consensus here, but i'd vote for emt by a long shot. to the guy that said you won't learn anything about bedside care as an emt -- hello??? you're sitting right next to them the entire time you're with the patient. can it get much more bedside than that?
anyway, i am an lpn and a tn emt-iv, and i just feel that you'll get a lot more experience in patient care and handling various scenarios as an emt than you would as a cna. yes, as a cna, you will be more comfortable in a hospital environment, but that's about the only advantage.
continuing education opportunities are scarce for cna's in my area, but i'm not sure how it is in other areas of the country. the ambulance company i work part time for offers pals, acls, itls, cpr instructor, and many, many other certifications at no cost. as a cna, i'd like to see you try to convince your hospital to shell out the $$$ for any of those certifications. heck, when i worked fulltime as an lpn on a med/surg floor at a local hospital, i was told that i had "no reason whatsoever to get acls or pals certified", so they refused to let me attend the classes unless i was willing to pay for it myself. true, as an lpn i would not be pushing the als drugs in the code, but neither will the emt. still, the point is that all direct patient care staff should have access to that kind of education so that they can get the big picture. but, for whatever reason, that hospital felt that only rn's should benefit from education.
you will be exposed to a broader range of scenarios and widely varying types of patients as an emt. as a cna, you will more or less be doing the same thing day in and day out on a floor with a narrow range of patient types.
this is in no way meant to belittle the knowledge and education of cna's. it is simply to say that an emt is in all reality a higher level of practitioner than a cna, has more autonomy, and has to make more critical choices at any given time than a cna.
another interesting note is that in florida, if you are an rn with an emt-b certification, you can challenge the florida paramedic exam, which will open up some more opportunities for you.
however, my concern is this: how will you find time to go through emt school if you're doing pre-req's for nursing school? i'm not sure how it is in florida, but out here, the fastest you can go through emt school is 3 months, and that's going 17 hours per week. unfortunately, it may not be feasible to do emt school in your situation.
good luck with whatever choice you make.

hello, thabk you for your reply. i do understand where you are going with this, but i am not going into emt or cna to do more training. i wanted to get a "job" for the learning experience while i study to become a rn. taking the pre-req and going to cna or emt training is not a problem. i find it doable and im unemployed so it works out for me...again thank you for you help i do appreciate it.

Jules A, MSN · Sep 7, 2008

hello, thabk you for your reply. i do understand where you are going with this, but i am not going into emt or cna to do more training. i wanted to get a "job" for the learning experience while i study to become a rn. taking the pre-req and going to cna or emt training is not a problem. i find it doable and im unemployed so it works out for me...again thank you for you help i do appreciate it.

my hesitation when people inquire about working as a cna while in school is that the pay stinks. it was my experience that after the first semester those with cna experience really didn't have much of an advantage skills or knowledge wise over those that didn't work in health care. if jobs are not plentiful in your area it is a good segway onto a unit you are interested in but if there is a nursing shortage new grads can get hired pretty much anywhere. good luck with whatever you decide.

Roy Fokker, BSN, RN · Sep 7, 2008

insert saline locks

You mean you can start IVs? :confused:

cheers,

rockytopRN2b · Sep 8, 2008

However, my concern is this: how will you find time to go through EMT school if you're doing pre-req's for nursing school? I'm not sure how it is in Florida, but out here, the fastest you can go through EMT school is 3 months, and that's going 17 hours per week. Unfortunately, it may not be feasible to do EMT school in your situation.

I did an accelerated EMT-B course in a California community college that met for four hours a day, four days per week, for just shy of a month.

I was one of several pre-nursing students at the time and the instructor actually laughed at us. "I don't know what all these nursing students are doing here. Nursing and being an EMT are NOTHING alike." Of course, she was a practicing medic as well as instructor and had nothing but criticism for nearly every health professional except EMT's, so I think that was just the way she was.

I have worked both as an EMT and CNA and yes, some of the skills overlap. But in my experience (and this is stereotypical, of course), being an EMT was more rough around the edges and less "Florence Nightingale." I don't mean to imply that any of the EMT's and medics I worked with were anything less than caring and solicitous with patients, or that nursing is just hand-holding, but emergency care in the field seemed to have more of a (necessary) focus on the medicine/illness/emergency, and less of the softer side of patient care that attracted me to the field in the first place. I personally enjoy CNA work a lot more.

joyflnoyz, LPN · Sep 8, 2008

Please keep in mind that what a CNA does is ***Basic Nursing Care***

EMTs are utilized much more as ambluance transport(when we tranport a resident that is urgent but not an emergency, we call a private ambulance for transport) and basic emergency care --'least that's been my experience where we work

KdnRN2B · Sep 8, 2008

i went through an advanced cna class and can obtain ekg's (not read them), draw blood, insert saline locks, and insert foley catheters.

i was a cna while in nursing school. we could not insert foleys or start iv's. we could perform ekg's but were not trained to read them. we could straight cath patients. even as a ns i was not trained to start ivs.
i would shadow a cna for a shift. i enjoyed working as an aide. yes, it is exhausting as you try to meet everyone's needs but it is so rewarding too. the patients were so greatful for even the smallest things you could do for them. i was always too busy to really go with the nurses too see what they were doing, but i used a lot of communication skills and seen first hand how hard hospital nurses worked. i do not regret for a minute being an aide. i would recommend it to any nursing student.

i have to agree with all the other posts. you have to do what is best for you. do not let someone else tell you what you should do with your future. cna is a great way to start and gain some insightful knowledge and experience. i wish i had the time to start a cna course before starting ns. but, i thought of it too late, besides i here that is where i'm going to do my first clinical away. ltc i mean. good luck and stay focus on what is best for you not what is best for the next person.

sorry, if you are doing inserting iv's you are not doing it legally. emt-b's also don't develop "working diagnosis", paramedics do that. emt-b's do basic assessments to determine if als intervention is required or just transport with basic life support protocols.
that said to op: i did both before nursing and both jobs helped in their different ways. both are hard jobs and both can very dirty. picture being confined in an ambulance with smelly drunks, vomit, diarrhea, etc. not very nice. you should look into job opportunities in your particular area. it may be difficult to get a paying job as an emt, there are still many areas where this is a volunteer job. hospitals may not always have pct jobs available. see how available shifts work with your school schedule. if you must choose one over the other, i found cna/pct helped most because i got used to dealing with multiple patients at once and mulit-tasking. i also learned a lot more about how nurses function. although both part of health care, ems and nursing are very differenet areas of expertise.
except for administrative nurses all working nurses get dirty. most appreciate the hard work that their assistants do and are willing and ready to pitch in when needed.

i did an accelerated emt-b course in a california community college that met for four hours a day, four days per week, for just shy of a month.
i was one of several pre-nursing students at the time and the instructor actually laughed at us. "i don't know what all these nursing students are doing here. nursing and being an emt are nothing alike." of course, she was a practicing medic as well as instructor and had nothing but criticism for nearly every health professional except emt's, so i think that was just the way she was.
i have worked both as an emt and cna and yes, some of the skills overlap. but in my experience (and this is stereotypical, of course), being an emt was more rough around the edges and less "florence nightingale." i don't mean to imply that any of the emt's and medics i worked with were anything less than caring and solicitous with patients, or that nursing is just hand-holding, but emergency care in the field seemed to have more of a (necessary) focus on the medicine/illness/emergency, and less of the softer side of patient care that attracted me to the field in the first place. i personally enjoy cna work a lot more.

please keep in mind that what a cna does is ***basic nursing care***
emts are utilized much more as ambluance transport(when we tranport a resident that is urgent but not an emergency, we call a private ambulance for transport) and basic emergency care --'least that's been my experience where we work

:heartbeat:heartbeat:heartbeat:heartbeatthank you all for your wonderful advice,suggestions,and comments:bow:.i really love this site:heartbeat:heartbeat:heartbeat:heartbeat

pagandeva2000, LPN · Sep 8, 2008

News Flash: Nursing is a dirty job, also. In addition to cleaning poo, we are drawing blood, doing dressings, being splashed with body fluids and a million other invasive things. Maybe in time, RNs have the advantage of going into other areas that are not as 'poo-concentrated' such as case management, etc... but the beginnings of any nursing career will include poo. Don't pay attention to this person.

pagandeva2000, LPN · Sep 8, 2008

Well, I've been a "butt-wiper" for 20 years! To heck with that lady!!
I also hold a lot of hands, give hugs and make my pts comfortable.
I also feed, bathe, do EKGs, vitals, accu-checks, run activities and help nurse with treatments. Oh, and observe observe observe!!!
No, it doesn't require the vast knowledge of a nurse, but I have to think on my toes, prioritize and do all the things I have to do with finesse.
I never ever let anyone diminish my role in any way. I cannot tell you what a worthy job being a CNA/PCT is.
I remember I was in between jobs once and I needed a job NOW.
It takes a while to get the job you want sometimes and so, doing what I HAD to do, I applied for jobs ANYWHERE to bring in money until I got another job in healthcare.
I filled out an application and the same day I was hired at a dollar store.
While I was there, I was saddened by my co-workers. Here were some people with no goals and, seemingly, no means to do better for themselves. Most of them had missing teeth and no health insurance! They slaved away, trying to cram in hours just to make ends meet (made me realize how lucky I am!).
One gal seemed fairly sharp and I could see her in a better place. I suggested she go back to school and get out of the dollar store.
I told her she could get her CNA and the doors would be open to get a job somewhere with tuition reimbursement... she could get a nursing degree... and help people (and not just help the big guy at the top of this shoddy dollar store chain put money in his pocket!) and get paid MUCH better than $6/hr AND have health insurance.
Well, she crinkled up her nose and said, "I don't want to wipe butts!"
I was floored.
Here is a gal who was toiling long hours in a hell-hole with no benefits and no opportunities and she was too good to "wipe butts!".
It's not all about wiping butt and one has to be able to look at the larger picture.
I also figure, one day, I might need a caring aide or nurse to clean me up. If no one steps up to plate and wants to do the job, how horrible for those who need that type of care.
While I don't enjoy that aspect of my job, I see it as something I must do to help people and also to achieve my goals.
Anyone who turns their nose up at it now, won't be so quick to do so when they are old, sick or whatever and they need that CNA or nurse to wipe their butt!
It takes a strong (mentally and physically) person to do CNA work and do it well and with TLC.
NO ONE diminishes my job.
Don't listen to people who say junk like that. They are truly ignorant and have no clue.

:yeah: :yeah::yeah:I loved how you worded this and applaud you!

KdnRN2B · Sep 8, 2008

well, i've been a "butt-wiper" for 20 years! to heck with that lady!!
i also hold a lot of hands, give hugs and make my pts comfortable.
i also feed, bathe, do ekgs, vitals, accu-checks, run activities and help nurse with treatments. oh, and observe observe observe!!!
no, it doesn't require the vast knowledge of a nurse, but i have to think on my toes, prioritize and do all the things i have to do with finesse.
i never ever let anyone diminish my role in any way. i cannot tell you what a worthy job being a cna/pct is.
i remember i was in between jobs once and i needed a job now.
it takes a while to get the job you want sometimes and so, doing what i had to do, i applied for jobs anywhere to bring in money until i got another job in healthcare.
i filled out an application and the same day i was hired at a dollar store.
while i was there, i was saddened by my co-workers. here were some people with no goals and, seemingly, no means to do better for themselves. most of them had missing teeth and no health insurance! they slaved away, trying to cram in hours just to make ends meet (made me realize how lucky i am!).
one gal seemed fairly sharp and i could see her in a better place. i suggested she go back to school and get out of the dollar store.
i told her she could get her cna and the doors would be open to get a job somewhere with tuition reimbursement... she could get a nursing degree... and help people (and not just help the big guy at the top of this shoddy dollar store chain put money in his pocket!) and get paid much better than $6/hr and have health insurance.
well, she crinkled up her nose and said, "i don't want to wipe butts!"
i was floored.
here is a gal who was toiling long hours in a hell-hole with no benefits and no opportunities and she was too good to "wipe butts!".
it's not all about wiping butt and one has to be able to look at the larger picture.
i also figure, one day, i might need a caring aide or nurse to clean me up. if no one steps up to plate and wants to do the job, how horrible for those who need that type of care.
while i don't enjoy that aspect of my job, i see it as something i must do to help people and also to achieve my goals.
anyone who turns their nose up at it now, won't be so quick to do so when they are old, sick or whatever and they need that cna or nurse to wipe their butt!
it takes a strong (mentally and physically) person to do cna work and do it well and with tlc.
no one diminishes my job.
don't listen to people who say junk like that. they are truly ignorant and have no clue.

news flash: nursing is a dirty job, also. in addition to cleaning poo, we are drawing blood, doing dressings, being splashed with body fluids and a million other invasive things. maybe in time, rns have the advantage of going into other areas that are not as 'poo-concentrated' such as case management, etc... but the beginnings of any nursing career will include poo. don't pay attention to this person.

:redbeathe:redbeathe:redbeathethank you so much ladies..im really looking forward to this:redbeathe:redbeathe:redbeathe

Murse901, MSN, RN · Sep 9, 2008

hello, thabk you for your reply. i do understand where you are going with this, but i am not going into emt or cna to do more training. i wanted to get a "job" for the learning experience while i study to become a rn. taking the pre-req and going to cna or emt training is not a problem. i find it doable and im unemployed so it works out for me...again thank you for you help i do appreciate it.

in that case, i still stand by what i said and recommend the ems route. you will gain much more experience in making decisions on your own, reading patients, interacting with patients, not to mention the technical skills.

we had many cna's in my lpn class. at first, i thought, "darn, i really should have gone to cna school. they know so much, and i don't know jack!". after about a month into the program, however, the field was pretty much level across the board. people can preach about how much cna is nursing 101 and all, but the hard reality is that unless you spend a hefty amount of time in the cna role, it won't prepare you for nursing.

on the other hand, if you get on with a busy ambulance company, even doing nothing but bls runs all day, you will learn a lot. i was an lpn for almost 2 years before i got my emt certification, and i still manage to learn quite a bit in my part-time ems gig.

on top of all of that, if you get on with a large ambulance service, you can basically make your own hours. you're not stuck with the traditional 7-3, 3-11, 11-7, or 7-7 of the hospital. if you want to come in for 6 hours, there's a shift for you. if you want to work a 24-hour shift, it's there.

Katy-NursingStudent · Sep 18, 2008

Hey Guys, thanks for taking the time to read this. I am feeling sick to my stomach trying decided between CNA/PCT or EMT-B. I am currently in school doing my pre-req for nursing I have a quiet a while to go and I need a job. I wanted a job in healthcare field so at first I decided to be a PCT/CNA hopefully to get a job in the hospital. A few days ago I went to a school to get info on there Nursing assistant program and the lady told me they stop offering that program because if the lack of work and it was hard to find jobs thier students. She then continued to tell me that CNA is not for me its a dirty work and she classified them has "Butt Wippers" I have heard more and more people say that CNA/PCT is not a good job,and that the nurses work and let u do everything they dont want to do but some say its a great experience. I dont want to work in any LTC because its just not for me. After our descussion she asked me if I was intrested in EMT training and she told me that I could get a job as a ER Tech in the hospital, and that there is lots of jobs and they will help place me in a job and the pay rate is good. I started to get excited but then I feel confused and now I doubt all of this I just dont know what to do and my family are getting tired of me changing my mind because its there money paying for this. Please anyone,someone I could use some help with my decision :crying2::cry::(I feel so depress:(

I took a CNA course a few years ago and I knew immediately that that wasn't the area of nursing that I wanted to go into. I think If you were intending to be in LTC or geriatrics then CNA would be the way to go. I am like you and am thinking about becoming a EMT-B while I go through nursing school. I think, especially since I am heavily considering ER, that this will give some real insight into what I will be dealing with. But you have to go with whatever you think suits you best, for me, its EMT-B....

rockytopRN2b · Sep 18, 2008

I took a CNA course a few years ago and I knew immediately that that wasn't the area of nursing that I wanted to go into. I think If you were intending to be in LTC or geriatrics then CNA would be the way to go. I am like you and am thinking about becoming a EMT-B while I go through nursing school. I think, especially since I am heavily considering ER, that this will give some real insight into what I will be dealing with. But you have to go with whatever you think suits you best, for me, its EMT-B....

EMT's are great and I'm happy you found something that suits you. But the thing to keep in mind is, not all CNA jobs are created equal. Even though a lot of programs concentrate on LTC, there are many opportunities for CNA's in a hospital setting that are very different than what you will find in LTC, and the responsibilities vary depending on the position (and state). For example, CNA's working in an ED may be able to do blood draws and other general med tech duties (most hospitals will hire either CNA OR EMT-B as ED techs). Rehab CNA's also have expanded duties. Being a nurse aide isn't sentencing yourself to geriatric care, anymore than being an EMT-B will prevent someone from having to do 'dirty work' (guess who gets to clean the dirty ambulance when someone vomits or bleeds all over the back of it?). Both are good choices...but just know there are multiple options either way you go.

Best of luck!