CDC rec to counsel all males about benefits of circumcision

Red Kryptonite · Dec 9, 2014

I can walk and chew gum at the same time. And standing against injustice includes all injustice.

ONLY positive effects? What a load of horse crap. You're really flashing your bias now. At least I was honest enough to admit my bias right off the bat.

allnurses Guide · Dec 9, 2014

Like I said before, no man likes to think that maybe there was a better way in regards to his member.

So, now as woman you can speak for all circumcised men. I think that is far leap to make to say you know how what circumcised males think about having their sons circumcised.

allnurses Guide · Dec 9, 2014

you have just lost your argument, for it doesn't have ONLY positive effects, even the lit. that you love to quote doesn't say that.

Okay, I am game show me the literature then. There has been no statistical long-term negative effects from male circumcision that I remember seeing in the literature, if there is then you should have no problem pointing them out from a reputable source.

macawake, MSN · Dec 9, 2014

Out of all the issues surrounding health care and human rights, what is it about male circumcision that has elicited such passionate feelings

I can only speak for myself, but I'll answer your question as best I can. I am passionate about many human rights issue and yes, I believe that the circumcision of infants fall into that category.

I think that the reason I feel strongly about this subject stems from the fact that children are vulnerable. In most societies they they are one of the groups that most people feel are "extra worthy" of protection. Children depend on adults for their survival and are at the mercy of the benevolence.

As a parent you will have to make many decisions for your child, it's a part of parenting. You can't ask an infant what their preferences are, they can't express themselves and they aren't yet developed/mature enough to know what their future feelings, needs, values, opinions and preferences will be.

Children are individuals in their own right, who as they grow up should have the right to decide who they want to be. Therefore I feel that it's an important principle that the individual is allowed to decide for themselves, whenever it is feasible. The decision to circimcise or not, is one that I feel should be left to the individual it concerns. It is after all a part of their body we're talking about.

I place a very high value on the autonomy of individuals. Their body, their decision.

I hope that I've been able to shed some light on why this is a subject that I feel strongly about. It touches on some very fundamental principles which defines much of who I am.

Don't be mad...I'm being sincere. I think much of my concern stems from my desire to have my first baby soon, and I can tell already that, if I have a boy, I will agonize over making the right decision (the right decision being the one that my baby will have wanted one he's older). The information I have received so far hasn't made a case overwhelming for, or against, either one (in my opinion). I'm hoping that some statements explaining why it's being debated so intensely (debated intensely, not just debated at all) might help me come to some sort of conclusion.

I wouldn't dream of being mad. I applaud the fact that you or anyone else takes the time to reflect and actively look for input in order to get a better understanding of how other people think and believe.

Of course I can't and shouldn't make your decision for you. The only advice I can offer (and of course the way I personally feel on the subject has a large impact on the advice I give), is this:

An eighteen-year-old uncircumcised male can have a circumcision if he decides that he wants one.

An eighteen-year-old circumcised male can't have his foreskin back if he'd want to.

My 0.02

I wish you luck with your decision and hope that you arrive at one that gives you peace of mind, whichever decision you end up making.

~PedsRN~, BSN, RN · Dec 9, 2014

So, now as woman you can speak for all circumcised men. I think that is far leap to make to say you know how what circumcised males think about having their sons circumcised.

Did that say circumcised or intact? That goes for all men, regardless of their foreskin. And while I have no scientific evidence to back that statement, I would like to think that's a generalized fact. ? Every man I have ever known has been pretty protective over the status of their manhood. Not many of them would enjoy a sit down discussion of all the ways their member could be better.

allnurses Guide · Dec 9, 2014

I can walk and chew gum at the same time. And standing against injustice includes all injustice.
ONLY positive effects? What a load of horse crap. You're really flashing your bias now. At least I was honest enough to admit my bias right off the bat.

Then prove me wrong! What long-term statistically significant effects from male circumcision has been reported in peer-reviewed scientific literature? I am always game to debate the scientific literature. Everyone has an opinion, but few people can back up that opinion with scientific literature.

It is your opinion that newborn male circumcision is an injustice the majority of people in the U.S. do not agree with you though.

klone, MSN, RN · Dec 9, 2014

I just cannot fathom with all the injustices in the world why someone would pick this one to demonize that has been shown to have only positive effects.

I find this argument tactic quite odd. Do you not have pet topics or issues that you feel more passionately about than others? Why does it have to be either/or? Why does a person have to passionate about All The Things? How would one find time to be vocal about All The Things?

I think it's odd that you think it's odd.

And no, it hasn't been shown to have ONLY positive effects. Infection, hemorrhage and death can occur. Does it happen often? No, of course not. But I bet if it were your child who died as a result of a botched elective circ, the fact that it doesn't happen often would be of no comfort.

~PedsRN~, BSN, RN · Dec 9, 2014

Then prove me wrong! What long-term statistically significant effects from male circumcision has been reported in peer-reviewed scientific literature? I am always game to debate the scientific literature. Everyone has an opinion, but few people can back up that opinion with scientific literature.
It is your opinion that newborn male circumcision is an injustice the majority of people in the U.S. do not agree with you though.

Just curious, when did the United States become the end all be all of scientific research or opinion?

Just because the U.S. Says, doesn't make it so.

Our healthcare system is so broken... If you work in it you know that - but we are pretty willing to nod our head and agree with our "experts".

Our system has become so much about the money that hospitals are vaccinating their nurses with a vaccine with questionable positives just for Medicaid reimbursement. I'm hard pressed to see how circumcision is really any different.

allnurses Guide · Dec 9, 2014

Did that say circumcised or intact? That goes for all men, regardless of their foreskin. And while I have no scientific evidence to back that statement, I would like to think that's a generalized fact.  Every man I have ever known has been pretty protective over the status of their manhood. Not many of them would enjoy a sit down discussion of all the ways their member could be better.

The point is you cannot speak for men. You cannot even give an opinion from a male's perspective. You believe this or that, but that is only your opinion.

IMO fathers are much more objective about circumcision then mothers. Mothers tend to think of how this is going effect my son's image, is it going to hurt etc. before considering any medical and health benefits. Fathers seem to think circumcision is practical (easier to clean and take care of) and has positive medical benefits. That is my opinion as male HCP.

Red Kryptonite · Dec 9, 2014

It is your opinion that newborn male circumcision is an injustice the majority of people in the U.S. do not agree with you though.

Majority opinion in the United States used to favor slavery, stealing land from Native Americans, Japanese internment, and neutrality with regard to Hitler. Pardon me if I don't find it an impressive moral guideline.

klone, MSN, RN · Dec 9, 2014

Majority opinion in the United States used to favor slavery, stealing land from Native Americans, Japanese internment, and neutrality with regard to Hitler. Pardon me if I don't find it an impressive moral guideline.

I snorted.

allnurses Guide · Dec 9, 2014

Just curious, when did the United States become the end all be all of scientific research or opinion?
Just because the U.S. Says, doesn't make it so.
Our healthcare system is so broken... If you work in it you know that - but we are pretty willing to nod our head and agree with our "experts".
Our system has become so much about the money that hospitals are vaccinating their nurses with a vaccine with questionable positives just for Medicaid reimbursement. I'm hard pressed to see how circumcision is really any different.

Did you just throw the vaccine conspiracy in with a discussion on male circumcision?. There are lots of research on male circumcision from the U.S. and other countries.

You cannot refute the evidence so you deny it. Yes, this is all just capitalistic conspiracy, because the scientific literature disagrees with your personal opinion. That is way to sway people.

How in the world with your opinion on research would you ever decide on how to adopt EBPs? Do you only consider medical advances in the literature if they agree with personal opinions?