CATS AND SCHIZOPHRENIA/ this is so stupid

Specialties Psychiatric

Published

OMG!!! I am really PO'd about this article. IT was on ABC 20/20. I dont agree at all. The public is so uneducated, they may starting putting cats to sleep over this. Toxo has been around a long time. I did some reseach on this Psychiatric MD. I think he is a quack... Please nurses out there spread the word to people that this is just one man's opinion.

I think I am mad because I love cats..... What do you guys think... thank god for Timothy Johnson. I READ this Dr has stolen brains for science.

Terri:angryfire

Nov. 10, 2005-- Can your cat make you crazy?

Dr. E. Fuller Torrey, president of the Stanley Medical Research Institute in Bethesda, Md., has been studying whether a parasite found in cat droppings called Toxoplasma gondii can trigger an onset of schizophrenia later in life.

"Most people have not thought of schizophrenia as being caused by a virus or bacteria or a parasite," Torrey said. "This is a relatively new idea."

It's long been established that the parasites found in cat droppings are a health risk to pregnant women and young children, but whether the cat can be directly linked to schizophrenia remains to be seen.

Torrey's study found a 53 percent increase in risk for schizophrenia if you owned a cat during childhood, but he also found a 51 percent increase in risk if you were breastfed. Statisticians believe the increase in risk has to be above 200 percent for there to be an actual association between something like owning a cat and schizophrenia.

"We haven't proven anything," Torrey said. "Infectious agents, virus, etcetera really need to be looked at very carefully in these cases."

In the meantime, Torrey is still cautious of cats.

"Personally I would not buy a kitten for a small child," he said. "I don't think we know enough to be able to say there's no risk."

ABC medical contributor Dr. Tim Johnson said he is skeptical of the study, but said there are diseases people can get from cats, the most serious being toxoplasmosis. Johnson said millions of people are affected with this parasite, but their immune system fights it off.

Johnson added, however, that pregnant women, women who are about to become pregnant and people with weakened immune systems, including those who are undergoing chemo or have AIDS, should avoid cats and cat litter.

Just a crazy thought... Toxoplasmosis -( toxo is also found in undercooked meat) is "SUPPOSEDLY" the culprit. And it seems that Breast Feeding as well..... would it be absolutely wonderful if

LaLeche, Aspca, The Beef Society ?? all ganged up on the crazy shrink.. Now that would be poetic Justice.

At first I was mad, then I was pissed, now I have to make a joke.

People need to learn about toxo, not getting rid of their felines.

Maybe something good will come out of this, people may keep their cats in.. If the host ( MICE and etc) are not eaten then the cat ( the VECTOR) can not spread disease. I have also heard from many vets and MD's alike ( I was concerned when I was pregnant) that you pretty much have to ingest the feces..............

That gives a who new term to the Eat S*** and D**..... Sorry just got to laugh.

I've read one of the article at

http://www.myrtlebeachonline.com/mld/myrtlebeachonline/news/nation/13149908.htm

which reference the source as Esquire. Now as far as I know, Esquire is not exactly a scholarly journal.

But for people who are familiar with schizophrenia research, this particular theory have been around a long time. It is one of the many environmental theory for the cause of schizophrenia. This one is the virus theory (or other pathogenic theory). This theory has been laughed at until recently when they have more evidence that viral infection during the first/second trimester of pregnacy can increase the risk of schizophrenia. Guess it is like the stomach virus (or was it a bateria?) that caused ulcers, nobody believed it for the longest time until we have hard evidence. We are not there yet in terms of hard evidence for schizophrenia and Esquire kind of blow it out of propotion.

I went to pubmed (www.pubmed.gov) and look up a few articles that are a bit more scholarly. Here are some interesting ones.

If you go to pubmed and enter "schizophrenia cats", you'll get a few hits. The one that are interesting are:

* Number 1 "A decade of discoveries in veterinary protozoology changes our concept of "subclinical" toxoplasmosis", 2005

* Number 4 "Toxoplasma gondii and schizophrenia", 2003

* Number 6 "The schizophrenia-rheumatoid arthritis connection: infectious, immune, or both?", 2001

* Number 8 "[The neuropathogenesis of Borna disease virus infection]", 2001

* Number 10 "The antecedents of psychoses: a case-control study of selected risk factors", 2000

* Number 11 "Clinical investigation of the relationship between Borna disease virus (BDV) infection and schizophrenia in 67 patients in Japan", 1997

* Number 14 "Evaluation of Torrey and Yolken's feline viral zoonosis theory of schizophrenia", 1995

* Number 15 "Could schizophrenia be a viral zoonosis transmitted from house cats?", 1995

As you can see, this has been around a long time and there are not that much research in this area. If you are familiar with schizophrenia research, this is just one of many theories among others.

Here is another indirect article

http://www.schizophreniaforum.org/new/detail.asp?id=1151

It talks about perinatal exposer to pathogens.

A better news at ABC

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/story?id=1299317

is probably a little bit better as it did quote theory's author (Torry) saying "We haven't proven anything..."

-Dan

People need to learn about toxo, not getting rid of their felines.

Maybe something good will come out of this, people may keep their cats in.. If the host ( MICE and etc) are not eaten then the cat ( the VECTOR) can not spread disease. I

This can be solve by having a well-fed cat so they won't go around eating other small mamals :)

-Dan

I've read one of the article at

http://www.myrtlebeachonline.com/mld/myrtlebeachonline/news/nation/13149908.htm

which reference the source as Esquire. Now as far as I know, Esquire is not exactly a scholarly journal.

But for people who are familiar with schizophrenia research, this particular theory have been around a long time. It is one of the many environmental theory for the cause of schizophrenia. This one is the virus theory (or other pathogenic theory). This theory has been laughed at until recently when they have more evidence that viral infection during the first/second trimester of pregnacy can increase the risk of schizophrenia. Guess it is like the stomach virus (or was it a bateria?) that caused ulcers, nobody believed it for the longest time until we have hard evidence. We are not there yet in terms of hard evidence for schizophrenia and Esquire kind of blow it out of propotion.

I went to pubmed (www.pubmed.gov) and look up a few articles that are a bit more scholarly. Here are some interesting ones.

If you go to pubmed and enter "schizophrenia cats", you'll get a few hits. The one that are interesting are:

* Number 1 "A decade of discoveries in veterinary protozoology changes our concept of "subclinical" toxoplasmosis", 2005

* Number 4 "Toxoplasma gondii and schizophrenia", 2003

* Number 6 "The schizophrenia-rheumatoid arthritis connection: infectious, immune, or both?", 2001

* Number 8 "[The neuropathogenesis of Borna disease virus infection]", 2001

* Number 10 "The antecedents of psychoses: a case-control study of selected risk factors", 2000

* Number 11 "Clinical investigation of the relationship between Borna disease virus (BDV) infection and schizophrenia in 67 patients in Japan", 1997

* Number 14 "Evaluation of Torrey and Yolken's feline viral zoonosis theory of schizophrenia", 1995

* Number 15 "Could schizophrenia be a viral zoonosis transmitted from house cats?", 1995

As you can see, this has been around a long time and there are not that much research in this area. If you are familiar with schizophrenia research, this is just one of many theories among others.

Here is another indirect article

http://www.schizophreniaforum.org/new/detail.asp?id=1151

It talks about perinatal exposer to pathogens.

A better news at ABC

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/OnCall/story?id=1299317

is probably a little bit better as it did quote theory's author (Torry) saying "We haven't proven anything..."

-Dan

How do we explain the breast feeding thing then??

How do we explain the breast feeding thing then??

I am assuming you are talking about the possibility of transmiting Toxoplasmosis through breast feeding?

Take a look at http://www.cdc.gov/breastfeeding/disease/toxoplasmosis.htm

and that might answer the question.

However, since it is a possibility in theory, Torrey actually looked at it and did not find any correlation. Look at

http://cogweb.ucla.edu/ep/Schizovirus.html and just do a search on "breast".

-Dan

Ooops! My mistake. I went and looked at the actual abstract (the actual horses mouth) at

Schizophr Res. 2000 Nov 30;46(1):17-23 "The antecedents of psychoses: a case-control study of selected risk factors". I've read the other article too fast.

Five factors are statistically significant:

fever during pregnancy, complications during delivery, city or suburban residence at birth, cat ownership between birth and age 13, and breast-feeding.

So breast-feeding is one of them. At the end of the abstract, it said "Previous research on breast-feeding as a risk factor has yielded contradictory results." That is why this is a hot debated topic because our research data does not point in the general direction, but everywhere.

Remember again just because it is statistical significant, it does not mean it is the cause directly. All these research do is to raise questions in terms of the direction of future research. Also read the research carefully, it is not saying cats is THE cause because there are culture where pet cats do not exists.

If you are a good researcher who is interested in this question, what would you do in terms of the next step? I would personally want to see if I can duplicate it in other culture, say in China, Japan, India, for instance. Or I might want to see if the incident of schizophrenia is higher in cultures or communities where they like to eat raw meat.

-Dan

Stevie and Annie Mae --my 2 cats--say this is not true.

Stevie and Annie Mae --my 2 cats--say this is not true.

Hmmm... this is a bit off topic... I wonder what would dogs say?

-Dan

I looked over the data abit. The highest correlation of serum antibody presence to schizophrenia is 60%. This is much less than a direct causative link. Looks like a pattern indicative of a causative factor that is seen by its indirect effects or of multiple causes of the observed symptom. The later seems more likely to me. Theoreticlly, Schizophrenia being a symptom of a specific class of brain damage that can be caused by a variety of agents. At varience to this is the uniform incidence of 1% world wide. One would expect there to be somewhere where there would be less causative agents and hence a lower incidence of disease. The delay of onset to between 15 and 25 is suggestive of "slow virus" behavior. Which is yet another theory. Statistical analysis ought to be a useful toolin sorting this out.

I agree that the premature airing of this theory is irresponsible journalism.

Hmmm... this is a bit off topic... I wonder what would dogs say?

-Dan

Dogs have a better lobbying group that cats!

My cats ARE schizophrenic.:rolleyes:

Seriously, I have heard that before and I agree, it's a bunch of bunk. Everybody gets their fifteen minutes of fame, I guess. :rolleyes:

What I say... Is don't blame it on an animal... "if there is a connection with toxo...look at the spread and transmission of the microbe" But that doesn't make the news. Must have been a slow news day.

Hmmm... this is a bit off topic... I wonder what would dogs say?

-Dan

Dogs have a better lobbying group that cats!

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

I think the D.O.G.(Dogs on Guard) For A Better America lobby group probably spread these piece of propoganda to undermine the cat lobby!

:rotfl: :rotfl:

+ Add a Comment