BSN to PA?

jdc6773 · Oct 21, 2015

I've looked into both in the past. Just to address your question about if they accept BSN... Trevecca will put favor to those with ANY experience in the medical field. There are usually a few BSN nurses accepted each go around. I would agree with the others though, NP is the way to go. Time in program is usually less, price is much less. I work with both PA and NP in the ED I work. They do the same exact job. One PA was a nurse for 20 years before getting his PA. Other areas may be different but this is my experience.

I just saw ICUMANs post and he is very right about the generalist/primary care comparison between the two. Also PAs get much more clinical hours.

guest769224 · Oct 21, 2015

I just saw ICUMANs post and he is very right about the generalist/primary care comparison between the two.

Eh? I didn't post here. Just here for reading. You mean ixchel or dranger.

jdc6773 · Oct 21, 2015

Oops yea Dranger. My bad.

AuDDoc · Oct 21, 2015

I would do an FNP. Why? Well you already have an RN so you could complete an FNP master's program and still be able to work while you earned your masters. There is no working your way up. PA's and NP's are mid level practitioners and will never be physicians. IF you want to be a doctor then medical school is where you should go. If you are OK with being a mid level provider then I would suggest FNP master's. Unless you've already taken all the pre-med requirements for PA programs. Yes nurses have a chance at getting into PA programs, but they also look at your coursework and your GPA and also at your healthcare experience. Most of the PA's I know had several thousands of hours working EMT or some other type of job that required a lot of independent quick triage. I know several combat medics who went to PA school.

I was someone who could have done PA or NP. I chose to start to get my RN to get my FNP. Why? Because the hospital I worked for would pay for my RN education and with all the generals being done I could have just taken the nursing courses and performed clinicals and still worked full time until I got my RN, then switched over to being a nurse at the hospital, and then work while I got my MSN FNP. If I didn't need to work and didn't already have student loan debt I would have probably did a PA program because I like the medical model of education as it was what I was used to in pre-med and I had all the pre-med courses done, a decent GPA, and thousands of clock hours as an independent audiologists with a clinical doctorate. The downside would have been I would have had to pay out of pocket for my PA program and could not have worked during the program like you can for most nursing programs.

So if you already have an RN or BSN then go get your MSN FNP as you'll do a lot of the same stuff if you want to do more general practice. Now if you want to do more specialized stuff (ortho, ENT, derm, etc.) then usually PA's are the better route.

I won't get into the whole PA vs NP peeing match because I respect both for what they do. They are two completely different educational approaches. I think PA's get a much more in depth and hardcore clinical foundation with rotations in OB, peds, ER, and usually a couple specialties of the student's choosing whereas NP's get more courses in pharm, nursing theory, and a decent amount of clock hours. That's not to say NP's can't specialize because they can. I know several ENT practices that have PA's and NP's both working with them.

I just know from my experience nursing school was the big picture of X disease has Y symptoms. PA programs being the medical model are X disease has Y symptoms because of V and W underlying processes which result in X and shown as symptoms Y. I remember many times explaining to other nursing students why we would see clinically many of the things we see because they had not had genetics, cell biology, microbiology, physics, etc.

klone, MSN, RN · Oct 21, 2015

I'm all in favor of NPs, but comparing the clinical education of NP vs PA is apples and oranges. PA clinical requirements are FAR more intensive than NP clinical requirements. I think it's something like 2000 hours vs. 600 hours.

meganec17 · Oct 22, 2015

I am currently only a BSN student, but I know that I want to go to school to be a FNP - it has been my goal all along. Basically the deciding factor for me for NP over PA was that after four years, I could have a job in the medical field (RN), and if I decided I did not want to get my masters, I would still be set for a job. For a PA, I believe the normal track in to get a bachelors in a science, such as Biology, and then you would have to be accepted into a PA school. Though I know it is possible to get a job with a Biology degree, it did not seem as appealing to me as already having my RN.

Hope this makes sense to you! Good luck!

Dranger · Oct 22, 2015

I am currently only a BSN student, but I know that I want to go to school to be a FNP - it has been my goal all along. Basically the deciding factor for me for NP over PA was that after four years, I could have a job in the medical field (RN), and if I decided I did not want to get my masters, I would still be set for a job. For a PA, I believe the normal track in to get a bachelors in a science, such as Biology, and then you would have to be accepted into a PA school. Though I know it is possible to get a job with a Biology degree, it did not seem as appealing to me as already having my RN.
Hope this makes sense to you! Good luck!

Just like med school you can major in anything including nursing provided you do the pre reqs.

I have quite a few friends who majored in history or political science and went to med/PA school.

ixchel · Oct 22, 2015

I am currently only a BSN student, but I know that I want to go to school to be a FNP - it has been my goal all along. Basically the deciding factor for me for NP over PA was that after four years, I could have a job in the medical field (RN), and if I decided I did not want to get my masters, I would still be set for a job. For a PA, I believe the normal track in to get a bachelors in a science, such as Biology, and then you would have to be accepted into a PA school. Though I know it is possible to get a job with a Biology degree, it did not seem as appealing to me as already having my RN.
Hope this makes sense to you! Good luck!

Megan!!! I thought about you the other day, couldn't remember your screenname and got bummed when I realized I didn't save our PMs from earlier this year. I've been wanting to check in and see how you're doing, how you've come along with your back and making it all work. PM me!

Forgive the hijacking, please continue. :)

JMed18 · Oct 22, 2015

I know many nurses who went to medical school. There isn't a bias against RNs (with a bachelor's) or BSNs in admissions.

Dranger · Oct 22, 2015

I know many nurses who went to medical school. There isn't a bias against RNs (with a bachelor's) or BSNs in admissions.

Look, we all have anecdotes. I also know a guy who got into a top tier MD school with a 22/23 MCAT and 3.1 GPA. In no way am I denying that nurses go to med school.

A few years ago I made a thread on SDN regarding nursing to MD and if there was any advantage. My thread garnered responses from ADCOMS (admission committee) who without using the exact words such as bias or discrimination said that nursing could be a disadvantage. For one the applicant is grilled more on "Why medicine?" and the reasoning for jumping ship from nursing to medicine. One stated that if a person hopped from one career quickly after graduation (within a few years) there is reason to believe that the same thing could happen with medicine. There was also a statistics chart floating around from AMCAS showing allied health/nursing as having the lowest or second lowest acceptance rates into med school of any major.

One again not my words but their guidance made sense.

AuDDoc · Oct 22, 2015

My guess is they still had to take all the pre-reqs (might as well get the degree at that point) and had a lot of healthcare experience prior to being accepted to PA school.

allnurses Guide · Oct 22, 2015

As a NP student currently there are actually several reasons to favor PA over NP. People get so worked up about independence, but what does independence truly mean when you working a collaborative field.

Independence is actually very important financially. I don't want to go into to much detail here and derail the original topic, but even in a collaborative model independence is a very important factor in NP practice over PA practice. It is also an important factor in NP preparation.

PAs have a more generalist education and learn from the medical model like a physician. NPs are specialized (even though FNPs think they can do everything...) and can not seamlessly move from one area to another without another certificate in that specialty area. In general PAs have a stronger background in science and their schooling is set up like an abridged version of medical school. Admission standards are tough, much tougher than NP, and one can argue that the 2 years of schooling are tougher than any educational programs out there. Most students are advised not to work.
The areas of surgery, ortho and ED are common areas for PAs.

There may be some confusion with this statement and I think it is important to clarify. PA preparation is "more generalist" because of their block model and exposure to (nearly) every specialty. The truth is that more PAs work in specialty practice than NPs because of their brief exposure to a particular specialty rather than their "generalist" preparation. There is a bit of irony there: the generalist do more specialist work then the specialists.

FNPs are "generalist" trained within the notion that their training spans throughout the lifespan. However, within that spectrum of a lifespan how much training can you get in each area when most schools have 600-700 clinical hours and that's being generous. If you believe a FNP can just waltz into an ICU, NICU or even a acute care/psych area without significant prior experience of advanced practice in that area you are wrong.

If you think a PA can you are wrong too. Or a novice physician. The truth is that NPs have between 600-1000 hours of provider level training, and for example, PMHNPs have that all in psych while a PA may have 2000 hours of training and only 100-200 hours of psych.

RN experience mostly doesn't count.

RN experience often does count, particularly in specialty practice. NPs have an average of about 10 years of experience prior, though that number is falling. In specialty practice, like psych, that experience is very important.

FNPs are primary care providers across the lifespan, period.

This just shows how little you know about primary care. Have you ever worked in a primary care office? Shadowed a PCP?

Online PA schools do not exist and there is no tomfoolery of begging someone to precept you in whatever specialty you can get that qualifies for the class. Why? PA schools are competitive and limit the ebb and flow of students coming in and out like medical schools. NP schools admit and admit until everyone is accepted.

There are online PA schools, and many current PA programs have moved a significant portion of their curriculum online, as have some medical schools. NOt that I think this is a great trend with NP programs, I haven't seen data to show that isn't not effective if done in a quality manner.

PA students don't "beg for preceptors" because preceptors are paid.

I actually do know what I am talking about as I compared both for a long time as well as working with a myriad of both PAs and NPs. Look, I respect NPs and I am in school to become one but it's delusional to think that we have a leg up on education versus PAs. The cards are all laid out. We do lobby better I suppose but it is inconsequential to the OPs question.

Theory and practice are a lot different and transitioning into the role will give you a different perspective. If you finish your program and get out into practice you may see things differently.

And FWIW, lobbying has nothing to do with things; the medical lobby is far larger than any nursing lobby (in 2014 the AMA alone spent 19 million compared to the ANA which spent $500k).