At what point are employers asking TMI?

Nurses General Nursing

Published

I know this has been touched on in a few threads, but I think this offers a different perspective..

I just got a new job. (DREAM JOB, so excited!) I've been doing my new hire paper work, doing the drug screen, nicotine test (which is a TOTALLY different thread), and next week I'm scheduled for a pre-employment physical.

I've had these done for jobs before.... even had to do this physical therapy session one time where you lift up to 50 pounds with proper body mechanics and such, but I thought the "physical" was going to be like, check ROM, BP, BMI, ect.. just make sure I am healthy enough to work.

I get this packet via email that I have to fill out before I go, and HOLY COW! It's more in depth than my PCP paperwork. Wants to know my medical history, if I have any pain or injuries that are untreated, what medications I am taking, when I have been in the hospital and what for, IF I HAVE GENTIAL HERPES!, I mean, the list goes on and on and on. EIGHT pages of medical history I have to fill out.

I have no problem filling it out. That's not the point. I just want to know.... at what point is it too much information?! Why do I have to disclose my entire medical history to my employer? What do you think about it?!

Specializes in FNP.

It is a part of the physical exam, period. She is held to the same standard of care, regardless of your reason for making the appointment. She should commit malpractice because patients are ignorant of her responsibilities? No, I disagree, lol.

Obviously I meant a collective "you." :rolleyes: If you (singular, meaning anyone to whom it may apply) don't like the result, you better get busy working with moveon dot org or the like.

And who says they don't have the right? Well you and I may say that, but what we say doesn't mean squat. The courts have ruled that they can obtain that information and use it how they please, unless you are a protected class (ADA, etc). Don't like that, campaign for different judges, or different folks to appoint judges (as may apply in your district).

Seriously folks, what did you (general again) think a for profit health care system in a plutocracy was going to look like?

I didn't mean that you meant "me" in particular. However, by saying "you" generic or not you (as in yes, YOU) are implying that you are assuming that anyone that has a problem with it doesn't vote, get involved, or try to stand up for what is right. YOU (yes, YOU again) are implying that we (anyone that has a problem with it) is too lazy, uneducated, or "stupid and ignorant" ( to use your exact words) to attempt to do anything.

Employer benefits account for a significant portion of the overall income from our employers. What YOU are suggesting is that if someone is sick they should either do without a job at all or to not only give up a benefit afforded to healthy employees but also take an additional loss by paying for the benefits out of pocket.

This all goes without mentioning that employers will use this information not only for insurance, but simply to discriminate. Also, how long do you think before the gossip mill gets ahold of the "juicy disease Jenny has" and spreads it all over the workplace.

Should employers not hire black people because they might have sickle cell? Or Jews because they might have a baby with Tay-Sachs?

Specializes in FNP.

Lol. I implied nothing of the sort. You inferred this understanding on your own, and are completely incorrect, as a matter of fact.

My point is this: the circumstance alluded to in the OP is a natural consequence of the health care system that has evolved, and been reaffirmed. I hear a lot of bellyaching about it. I am tired of it.

I have personally donated thousands of hours and dollars to organizations that try to make a difference at both the policy and individual level. Based on your post Artic, you have as well. I'm glad to hear it. However, you realize of course, that most people do not out their money -or their time- where their mouth is. They just complain.

"It's not fair, it's not right, those big bad guys are out to get us!"

Well you know what, if THEY (not you, obviously) aren't out there campaigning, letter writing, advocating, they should just shut up. YOU are, you say, so you may continue to complain all you wish, lol. If their legislators haven't heard from them on this issue, if they haven't done the research, challenged candidates, and worked for change, they have lost my sympathy. I am sick and tired of all the whining.

Work for something better, or suck it up and deal with what you've got.

The end.

I believe, the point of the discussion is: should the provider who works for the employer pass/share personal health information of a new hire with the new hires's employer, HR dept who passes it on to the nurse manager, who passes it on to the administration and up the food chain. IMHO- No.A healthcare provider is : a NP, DR. PA not the CEO. The CEO is not licensed to wipe poop, just spuew it out of their corrupt mouths. There needs to be guidelines placed as to when to draw the line on medical infor for employment. Where is HIPPA in this mix? HIPPA has a part that describes"malicious intent" and if that is proven, carries higher fines and jail time, which in my opinnion, not hiring someone based on their PMHX does indeed fall under this catagory. That health information is being negatively used against that person. If a new hire is deemed able to perform the job funtions and than let go because of thier past medical hx( which is never said to the person's face again very covert)- that is using personal protected medical information for malicious intent- someone loosing their income. And who has the privilege of "right to know"? Some employee from the HR dept? I don't think the nurse recruiter in the HR dept is someone who should legally have the privilege of "right to know"- They are not providing and contribution to the treatment of that disease. Unless I'm wrong- that nurse recruiter is not there to provide patient care. I'm under the impression the nurse recruiter should be concerning them self with - does the person have the appropriate nursing license, is the resume demonstrating the appropriate qualifacations/experience, in their best judgement can this potential candidate perform the job? Medical hx is none of HR's business, nor is it the business of the nurse manager or the CEO. I don't think it should ever come down to being 'perfect we love you', 'become ill aka flawed- kick you to the curb'.

Newsflash for the HR dept's(probably why they are in HR and not direct patient care): Chronic diseases aren't only in the older nurse exclusively. They also occur in the young- asthma, juvenile diabetes, HTN (also occurs in people in their 20,s and 30's) sickle cell (something a person is born with) and HIV, seizures, depression, cancers(breast, cervical, uterine, testicular etc). Is that to say that these young people who have these chronic diseases are not employable? Then we best not cut funding for social security and unemployment because there's going to be alot of people out there who will be depending on these programs to eat!! Can't have this both ways. Unless these employers are planning on these afflicted "Tiny Tims' left to starve to death so they don't have to look at them, cut into their profits and salaries, just cast them aside and forget about them or may be the healthcare system movers and shakers will bring back the leper colonies for a fee of course. With out the provision of medical care, of course- It will cost too much.

If the physical exam/medical hx paper work is concerning- send a copy with a letter of concern to the Dept of Human Services-attn: complaint dept!! The ruling on insurance companies excluding people based on pre existing conditions came from letters of complaint sent to the DHS. DHS also has the responsibilty to over see HIPPA- look on their website.

Specializes in ER.

Woooww! What wonderful posts! I would've weighed in sooner, but it seriously took me a while to read inbetween my weekend at work!

I agree that if this was my PCP, I WOULD expect these questions. But, I dont feel like it's an employers business to know what my birth control practice is, or if I have genital herpes. I think if it doesn't have to do with my job duties, it's really not any of their business.

I understand it's an insurance thing. Still... eh, it feels like an invation of my privacy. Asking "Have you ever had professional counseling" or "do you have 'family issues'", among others... eh!! Thin line!!

But, I disagree with the people that say this hospital must be a nightmare or whatever. Without giving too much information, this hospital has been on the Top 100 places to work for, everybody I have EVER heard work there or has been there as a patient says it's nothing but wonderful... it's hard to believe I'm walking into a nightmare.

Keep the comments coming. Love reading all the opinions!

:lol2:

How would they even know if you are telling the truth about the herpes??? Do they check??? :confused::confused::confused::confused::confused::confused:

a nicotine test? oh boy....i'm pretty sure the next push will be for everyone to be caffine free....and then i will be soooooooo busted.

Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.

I can understand a nicotine test if their is a no nicotine policy. The downside to that would be how long nicotine can stay in your system though. So someone wouldn't be able to smoke at home either. I can also understand Ins. companies testing for it if people are trying to get the non smokers rate.

Specializes in M/S, Travel Nursing, Pulmonary.
When I had my physical for my current job the NP who did my exam asked me what my birth control method was. I informed her I was not using any (We are trying to conceive) and she proceeded to ask me why I wasn't using any, was I in a monogamous relationship, was I aware of the risks. I was highly offended and proceeded to tell her what happened in my bedroom with my HUSBAND and I was between us and not her.

Mine asked me what position I do it in. Then she asked me to remove my clothes and flex my muscles for her................................

<_>

>_>

Oh, N/M, that was the adult movie I was watching last week, N/M, very sorry to interupt the conversation. This is so embarassing.

Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.
Mine asked me what position I do it in. Then she asked me to remove my clothes and flex my muscles for her................................

<_>

>_>

Oh, N/M, that was the adult movie I was watching last week, N/M, very sorry to interupt the conversation. This is so embarassing.

You know what is funny about this post. I was seeing a NP a few months ago. She asked how often I have intercourse. (it was a relevant question) when I answered she cocked an eyebrow and said DANNNNNNG what's your secret.

Now that was embarrassing, I turned beet red and that is not easy for me to do.

Specializes in M/S, Travel Nursing, Pulmonary.
You know what is funny about this post. I was seeing a NP a few months ago. She asked how often I have intercourse. (it was a relevant question) when I answered she cocked an eyebrow and said DANNNNNNG what's your secret.

Now that was embarrassing, I turned beet red and that is not easy for me to do.

OMG!!!!!:eek: I had exactly the same thing happen to me.

<_>

>_>

:oNot really. :crying2:

You know what is funny about this post. I was seeing a NP a few months ago. She asked how often I have intercourse. (it was a relevant question) when I answered she cocked an eyebrow and said DANNNNNNG what's your secret.

Now that was embarrassing, I turned beet red and that is not easy for me to do.

LOL it must be a NP thing... Mine said... So the question is not are you sexually active, it's just how sexually active are you? :chair:

Specializes in FNP.

firstly, i assume of course, that you have evidence of this (alleged) corruption you accuse unnamed (better keep it that way too) ceos; accusations of malfeasance without proper evidence would be grossly unethical. i suggest you take said evidence to the state attorney general.

re: this sentence:

i believe, the point of the discussion is: should the provider who works for the employer pass/share personal health information of a new hire with the new hires's employer, hr dept who passes it on to the nurse manager, who passes it on to the administration and up the food chain.

i will limit my comments to this sentence only. the answer is most likely no, but one would be wise to read the fine print of the release they are asked to signand modify it as necessary.of course, doing so may disqualify you from hire, but individuals seeking employment with institutions with these policies will have to decide for themselves where their comfort level lies, and what sacrifices they are willing to make. if they don't want to work there, they are certainly under no obligation.

this is simply how modern health care policy is implemented. health care is a business. they are doing legal business. we have the option of not entering into business with them and going solo, so to speak. it's a dumb move, lol, but a perfectly legal one as well. everyone should weigh their options and make the choice that suits their circumstances. personally, i have no problem submitting to the physical and they can print the h&p in the ny times for all i care. there is nothing of interest, concern or shame, in my medical record: "45 y/o nontoxic caucasian female, appears approximately stated age....." and gets less interesting from there.

of course i am a left wing progressive (formerly called liberals, but i am told we are not supposed to use the l word anymore) and would never support that legislation, lol. if it were law and i wanted the job, i'd suck it up and deal, whilst simultaneously trying to be an 'agent of change' as they say, and work the system to change the policy. oh wait, i already do that.

to your health~

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