Our department tutor, who is also in the RN program and highly intelligent, just failed Med/surg II(our srping semester) with a 78%. There were no greviences that he could file, no student reps to talk to and the dept. chair basically said:to bad so sad. If you can't pass our tests, then you can't be in our program.
The reason I am upset is because not only is he a good friend, but also I believe that the system they have at my school is kind of messed up. So I am wondering if all nursing programs are like this:
Must have an 80% to pass. There will be no extra credit given, Clinicals do not count as a grade, so even if you are a fantastic "on the floor student", you still are SOL if you get anything lower than an 80%
Right from the beginning, our questions are N-CLEX style, which makes them more difficult than usual. In fact our instructors make them "harder" than NCLEX questions so that they have a high pass rate. Our school is known for it's pass rate of 98% on the NCLEX, but at what cost? By that time, good nurses have failed the program. Typically, out of 120 students only 20-30 are left to take the NCLEX anyhow, the rest have already failed out,
8-16 chapters on 1 test with only 1-2 weeks study time.
Our clinicals are back to back, we have from the time we leave the first clinical to the time we start the next morning to fill out our 14 page assessment forms, write a 12 page case study, write a diagnostic card, memorize, prepare and label drug cards for ALL drugs given to the client, fill out a lab sheet and write a minimum 1 page, per abnormal lab. Usually we have about 12 hours to do all of that! It;s exhausting!
There is probably a bunch of other stuff I could talk about as well, but I won't go on!
Yeah, I actually know who she's talking about. I agree that he didn't deserve to fail. We only had 2 tests, and the first exam 36 people failed! This fellow is smarter than most of us, and has a really strong medical background. A lot of us would have not made it this far without him helping us study. He pretty much knew the textbooks forward and backward. I guarantee his failing had nothing to do with his studying methods. I would trust my life to this man. Seriously.
Not to take away with what a shame it is that this fellow failed but the truth is that he did not make a passing grade. Apparently you two did so it was doable. Maybe he needed to focus on his own studying more than helping others, I don't know, but the bottom line is his average was not passing.
That sounds really tough. My school is a 70% to pass, just the normal grading system. Im not sure but it seems that the ADN programs are a little more ruthless with the grading system. Hence, Im in a BSN program and we only need a 70%. Sorry about your friend, and good luck to you! :heartbeat
Thanks for posting this! I'm six weeks into an Accelerated BSN program at Samuel Merritt College in Oakland, CA. It seems like everyone is fried already. Our first day of class was on a Wednesday and our first exam was the following Monday, on five chapters. Tuesday we have our last exam for Health Assessment. Six hours of lecture on seven chapters, in one week.
Yup, this is what they were saying it would be like. I'm a former teacher, and I think it's ridiculous as far as the facilitation of learning goes. But it's what it is, and we can do it!
Our passing was 76% with no rounding of grades, so if you have a 75.9% you still fail. On the other hand, we all knew the requirement going in and about 3/4 of our group that started graduated, so it was doable.
exactly...at my program it was 80%, period. No other way to pass. Your friend have may have had only 2 tests....but that's the reality of nursing school. You have to have the balance of knowledge and floor skills. He knew what he had to get going into the 2nd test, right? We were all so anal about our grades we would figure it out after every test what we had to get to keep above an 80%. My thought was that if you consistantly got above an 80% you were ok, if you got a 78, you balanced out with a 82....so you just do what you have to.
NS is not fair. People fail, people move on, and that is life. GL to your friend if he goes through again! and if he wants to be a nurse badly enough, he will find a way to get through the class.
80% to pass (which is only a couple points off from the regular cc classes)
clinicals are pass/fail and don't affect our grade, except for the fact that if you get 3 unsatisfactories in the same behavior or 1 unsafe behavior, you fail the class
NCLEX style questions from 1st semester on, which were hard to get used to at first, but I believe that is the best way to test now. I think it prepares us for the NCLEX and helps us learn to critically think.
Your clinical paperwork sounds like more than ours though. We pick up our assignments the afternoon before clinical and have to have labs, meds, tests, etc filled out, a concept map with abnormal data, 3 nursing dx with 5 interventions, patho, and med sheets filled out and memorized on all drugs we give before clinical the next morning. After clinical, we have a couple days to add our assessment findings and finalize our paperwork, including med evaluations, connecting and prioritizing our concept map data, and noting whether or not our outcomes were met.
Thanks for posting this! I'm six weeks into an accelerated BSN program at Samuel Merritt College in Oakland, CA. It seems like everyone is fried already. Our first day of class was on a Wednesday and our first exam was the following Monday, on five chapters. Tuesday we have our last exam for Health Assessment. Six hours of lecture on seven chapters, in one week.
Yup, this is what they were saying it would be like. I'm a former teacher, and I think it's ridiculous as far as the facilitation of learning goes. But it's what it is, and we can do it!
Peace,
Rob
Rob,
I graduated from SMC last year, it seemed VERY overwhelming in the beginning but you get into the swing of things by Med-Surg II! Good luck and make the most of your time while there! Also, after you are done you will be overwhelmed with free time, so keep that in your sights!!!
Thank you for all of the replies! I guess the reason I am so upset is because he knew the material better than anyone. He could explain the patho inside and out. He could explain anything you wanted to know inside and out. The problem is with the way the questions on the test are worded. You are not exactly sure what they are asking and can be interpreted in different ways. So while 2 answers might be correct, one is better DEPENDING upon your interp. We lost a student last semester who answered according to the book. It was marked wrong. When the student found the answer, word for word, in the book, the instructor still said, oh well to bad, I think my answer is better.
Now I know that sometimes the answers from the book need to be updated, but this was not one of those cases. It's not like he didn't understand the material, he knew it better than anyone. His critical thinking skills are impeccable. He was also a great diagnostician... that was something that I admired in him. He could look at something and know exactly what it was and how to fix it.
So if I can't do that, why should I be allowed to continue. KWIM? I think taking an exam is a poor indicator of learning.
it is....but it's the system that is used. So, you have to go with that system....go with the program. It's like the NCLEX....they have better answers, but there are ones you HAVE to get right....so you might as well get used to it.
I do understand what you mean. I know the material fairly well, but have a hard time explaining it if asked. I often have to think my way through and can't just spit out the answers like others can, but I'm a good test taker. There are a few people in my that are GREAT in clinical and are able to answer questions quickly and explain the rationale behind things, but aren't as good at taking tests so their grades are not as good as mine, but they sure sound alot smarter than I do! lol I also don't have much medical background so I think that hurts me in a way. I count on clinical experiences to help things make sense because when I SEE it, I am able to remember it better. I hate that your friend failed. I hope he's able to come back and be successful!
Our school is known for it's pass rate of 98% on the NCLEX, but at what cost? By that time, good nurses have failed the program. Typically, out of 120 students only 20-30 are left to take the NCLEX anyhow, the rest have already failed out,
Did you know the graduation percentage before you started this school? If so, why are you complaining about it now? I would rather tough it out at a great school and pass the NCLEX than breeze by in another school and fail the NCLEX. Some school can create a good balance and keep most students until the end and still have a high NCLEX pass rate. It just gets on my nerves that some students pick a school with a high NCLEX pass rate and then complain about it being so hard.
Also, is your school a "waiting list" type (that will let almost anyone in if they have been on the list long enough), or a "must have a high GPA" type?
Jules A, MSN
8,864 Posts
Not to take away with what a shame it is that this fellow failed but the truth is that he did not make a passing grade. Apparently you two did so it was doable. Maybe he needed to focus on his own studying more than helping others, I don't know, but the bottom line is his average was not passing.