Are anti-vaccine people conspiracy theorists generally?

Nurses General Nursing

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I have an old friend from years ago who I now keep in touch with on Facebook. Her posts are fascinating in the amazing variety of conspiracy theories, some outrageous, some maybe partially true. She's a big believer that cannabis oil will cure just about anything and that information of course is being suppressed by the drug companies and the government.

She blames many, if not all, health problems on vaccines. She also subscribes to some disturbing anti-Semitic ideologies, blaming the network of high powered Jews, led by the evil Rothschild family.

I swear, the internet has turned slightly eccentric people into extremists. 30 years ago this woman was into macrobiotics, native Americans, and New Age philosophies.

Recently in Australia, parents lost their rights to receive goverment child support subsidies if they refuse vaccinations. It worked as a miracle. Parents of 200000+ kids suddenly forgot about their personal views and their uncompatible incongruencies with scientific facts and/or magically overcame their concerns and fears when they just got to know a simple, unambigous thing: no jab, no muneys on account, period.

2, More Children Have Been Vaccinated In Australia Following New Policies | IFLScience

How do you expect people to react when they are threatened with the loss of subsidies that, for some, literally make the difference between providing food for their kids or having them go hungry?

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Specializes in ICU, LTACH, Internal Medicine.
How do you expect people to react when they are threatened with the loss of subsidies that, for some, literally make the difference between providing food for their kids or having them go hungry?

I f people REALLY feel so hard for an issue, they usually do not bend that easy. They find jobs, they move, they immigrate, they fight, after all. Look what is going on in Ontario, Canada and their sex ed program in public schools.

If they prefer to get kids vaccinated instead of doing any of that, it means that the holy issue was not an issue.

BTW,

There was so far ONE precedent when a family got $$$ for pretty much temporary association of vaccination and discovery of ASD. Temporary association doesn't imply causation. If there were more such cases, please provide evidence.

Please provide evidence of "many" health care professionals refusing vaccines for their children as well. Otherwise, the same "highly educated" population believes in stuff about GMO killer foods, naturopathy for everything, raw veganism, flat Earth, holographic Moon and the government organizing 9/11. Having a diploma doesn't equal having critical thinking, you know, and I'll be silent about how an average college grad understands everyday math and statistics, leaving alone the level needed to understand basic epidemiology.

If you personally are against vaccines, that's your right. But it is not your right to risk lives of others, especially most vulnerable and weak ones. If a young child or an immunodepressed adult "just catches" something from an uncaccinated kid and dies, the mom of that kid is not "just a non-believer in vaccines". She is a killer.

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I f people REALLY feel so hard for an issue, they usually do not bend that easy. They find jobs, they move, they immigrate, they fight, after all. Look what is going on in Ontario, Canada and their sex ed program in public schools.

If they prefer to get kids vaccinated instead of doing any of that, it means that the holy issue was not an issue at all.

I'm sure that at least some of those who CAN do what you suggested, have. But you are making the leap that none have, and you are also assuming that everyone can, which is not logical.

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Specializes in OB-Gyn/Primary Care/Ambulatory Leadership.
Not necessarily true. Gardasil doesn't even claim to protect against all viruses that can cause cervical cancer.

I was positive for 16. That and 18 cause about 75% of all cervical cancers. And Gardasil protects against 16 and 18, in addition to several others.

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I was positive for 16. That and 18 cause about 75% of all cervical cancers. And Gardasil protects against 16 and 18, in addition to several others.

When it is effective. I'm sorry you had to lose your uterus, but it also isn't 100% effective for everyone either, so there's no way to know with 100% certainty that you would not have gotten cancer if you'd gotten the vaccine.

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Specializes in OB-Gyn/Primary Care/Ambulatory Leadership.
When it is effective. I'm sorry you had to lose your uterus, but it also isn't 100% effective for everyone either, so there's no way to know with 100% certainty that you would not have gotten cancer if you'd gotten the vaccine.

Okay, fine. You really want to argue with me about my hysterectomy? Really?

If Gardasil had been available 30 years ago, I would PROBABLY still have my uterus. Better?

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Specializes in ICU, LTACH, Internal Medicine.
I'm sure that at least some of those who CAN do what you suggested, have. But you are making the leap that none have, and you are also assuming that everyone can, which is not logical.

Get your passport, go to Toronto science centre, sit there for a while. I recommend the hands-on room near temporary exhibitions' wing. Listen what parents there say and do if the problem seems that important for them. Then we will get together and chat about what people do if they feel THAT affected.

Also see work, migration and immigration stats for Australia so that you can see that your conclusions have nothing to do with reality.

Life gets full of discoveries, my friend, once you get out of where you firmly planted yourself.

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Specializes in Anesthesia.
"Highly uneducated and paranoid," hmmm!

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and guess that you have no idea how educated your so-called "anti-vaxxers" are. But lets say for discussions sake that some--not many--are not as well educated as you. How do you account for the many nurses, doctors, scientists, and other very highly educated people--many that are more educated than those on this board--that refuse to vaccinate their children/families and stand somewhere on the side of the fence as the "anti-vaxxers?"

The highly educated luckily are few and far between. These anti-vaccine proponents deny the evidence and hence why these same people are more likely to believe in conspiracy theories.

As far as the courts awarding vaccine injury cases: the courts are not trained in medicine and often a jury trial will rule in the favor of the plaintiff even if they don't believe that the vaccine or drug etc was the cause of injury because they feel sympathy for defendant.

I don't know of any recent court cases in the US where the court has ruled vaccines as the cause of autism. That link has been completely debunked.

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I'm sure that at least some of those who CAN do what you suggested, have. But you are making the leap that none have, and you are also assuming that everyone can, which is not logical.

If they truly believed it would harm or kill their child, yeah they probably would have found a way. And I can say that as someone who has stood in line trying to figure out how to buy food for my kids. If it involves your children you will find a way.

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If they truly believed it would harm or kill their child, yeah they probably would have found a way. And I can say that as someone who has stood in line trying to figure out how to buy food for my kids. If it involves your children you will find a way.

That's quite the judgement there. As the mother of a child currently fighting brain cancer, I can relate to doing what CAN be done to keep their child alive, but sometimes it isn't possible. The most likely form of treatment for my son's cancer costs minimally $250,000 out of pocket, and while I'd do most anything to get him that treatment, it just isn't within my reach. That's reality for many people.

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That's quite the judgement there. As the mother of a child currently fighting brain cancer, I can relate to doing what CAN be done to keep their child alive, but sometimes it isn't possible. The most likely form of treatment for my son's cancer costs minimally $250,000 out of pocket, and while I'd do most anything to get him that treatment, it just isn't within my reach. That's reality for many people.

Sorry, wasn't implying that in your case. This was in regards to the vaccine issue. If someone truly believed that a vaccine would harm or kill their child they wouldn't just give in so quick. It is totally reachable for people to change their circumstances in life to avoid having the gov't tell them what to do. Coming up with $250k is whole other story. Even at my level that would be impossible. Again sorry and hope I didn't make you feel like you weren't doing all you could.

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Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.

Interesting blog addressing many of the common arguments we see on the issue.

Another Excuse from Anti-Vaxxers? | Medpage Today

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