Anyone attended previous Nurse anesthesia school and withdrawn

[suarc]

Hello,

I recently made a difficult decision to withdraw from my anesthesia school because it just was not the right fit for me, I felt like I would be doing myself and my future patients a deservice if I continued. The environment just was not conducive to learning, without going into details.

My gpa is great and I left in good standing. I was wondering if any one has made this decision and reapplied to a different school and if so, what was the outcome.

Thanks,

[wtbcrna, MSN, DNP, CRNA]

Hitting, pushing, slapping are not the normal for SRNAs and should not be tolerated. I have never had any of my preceptors physically abuse me in anyway. The closest I have ever come is GI doc that pushed out of the way of the view screen, and it was all I could do not to hit him. There are going to be total jerks that you have as preceptors. There are going to be preceptors that will tell that they are the only ones that do anything the right way and you must do it their way or you are doing it wrong. I have also never had any my preceptors really verbally abuse me either....I have been told I am doing something wrong, I should have known whatever (even if it was all of Morgan & Mikhail etc.), pimped until I couldn't remember the answers etc., but this crap you guys are talking about is Bull and shouldn't be tolerated. I would recommend reporting all this behavior to the AANA if you are afraid to report it to your program director, even if you have to wait till after you have graduated/moved to another program etc. This type of thing will continue at some clinical sites as long as you let it go on.

This type of high stress envirnoment that some of you are describing is not conducive to learning. The Army posted a study in the AANA journal a few months ago showing that high stress among SRNAs only inhibits the amount of learning an SRNA can absorb not enhance it.

[jls189]

Hitting, pushing, slapping are not the normal for SRNAs and should not be tolerated. I have never had any of my preceptors physically abuse me in anyway. The closest I have ever come is GI doc that pushed out of the way of the view screen, and it was all I could do not to hit him. There are going to be total jerks that you have as preceptors. There are going to be preceptors that will tell that they are the only ones that do anything the right way and you must do it their way or you are doing it wrong. I have also never had any my preceptors really verbally abuse me either....I have been told I am doing something wrong, I should have known whatever (even if it was all of Morgan & Mikhail etc.), pimped until I couldn't remember the answers etc., but this crap you guys are talking about is Bull and shouldn't be tolerated. I would recommend reporting all this behavior to the AANA if you are afraid to report it to your program director, even if you have to wait till after you have graduated/moved to another program etc. This type of thing will continue at some clinical sites as long as you let it go on.

This type of high stress envirnoment that some of you are describing is not conducive to learning. The Army posted a study in the AANA journal a few months ago showing that high stress among SRNAs only inhibits the amount of learning an SRNA can absorb not enhance it.

Thanks so much for your response. I just couldn't believe that abuse was/is the norm. I have a lot of good friends who have either graduated or are attending anesthesia school right now, and they all deny being abused. Or course, they are told when they are wrong or reprimanded if they weren't preparred for the case, but that is about it.

Again thanks for you r reply,

julie

[Skip219, BSN, RN]

Hi fellow student,

I was horrified to here about those unimaginable conditions for learning. This type of student abuse needs reporting to the director and AANA. Those abusers need to get their own stress under control-obviously not preceptor personnel. You should not have to tolerate this garbage. I understand this sounds great but you're in tough spot-how are your classmates doing? Are there any support people with the organization you can talk to without fear of retribution? I feel lucky that my treatment has been mild.

Best wishes,

Skip219

[Skip219, BSN, RN]

could you please write, what did you have to do to return back to school.Did you reapply?

Hi,

I took a voluntary leave with condition of a seat in the next year's class. I would have been required to reapply, if not taking leave voluntarily. If you are in the condition of reapplying, get recommendations for improving chances for selection. Extra courses in chemistry, physiology etc. Have a plan of action for improvement. Be able to show how you have changed things to be more successive. Don' take it a defeat, just a temporary roadblock.

Best wishes in your success,

Skip219

[shang36]

Hi skip,

Is there anyway I can PM you

[darne20]

The word "hazing" caught my eye. My undergraduate training was at West Point (long ago) and hazing was an art form there. Physical and mental. It was phased out in the 1970's because it was mean-spirited and degrading. Why anyone would tolerate hazing in a CRNA program, I do not know. Up until recently, I thought CRNA's were nurses posing as MDA's with a very watered-down education; I always wanted an MDA for my own surgeries. I now understand that the CRNA's have an important role in anesthesia. My suggestion to any medical professional who is being hazed: notify the authorities. It's illegal. If anyone hazed the CRNA doing my case, I would offer to apply my size 10 combat boot to the offending person's butt.

[Skip219, BSN, RN]

Sure, feel free to PM me.

[Hopeful17]

I have a friend who attends Barry University & I heard they are really nurturing. I think you can get a good feel about how friendly/unfriendly a program is during the interview process.

[bendover]

I withdrew from my program several years ago. The SRNA's in the region where I went to school were definitely hazed. If you consider the purpose of hazing is to test you, and establish how loyal you'll be to the profession; you'll come to realize that there is a huge political rationale as to why they do it, and why hazing continues to be perpetuated withn the nurse anesthesia profession. Not to mention that if they keep their numbers low, they can claim a shortage of anesthesia providers, and keep their salaries high.

I agree with the person in this discussion who stated that they tend to target anyone who stands out as different. And god forbid you should speak out!!!!! The saying "Fly below the radar" also encourages students to keep their mouths shut and furthermore reinforces bystander apathy. No wonder the attrition rate, substance abuse rates, overdose/suicide rates are so high among SRNA's/CRNA's.

I have heard the abuse student nurse anesthetists experience has been compared to the Catholic Church sex scandal; only this time it isn't sexual;but it's still mental, emotional, psychological and physical. And the higher ups know its going on, but they continue to sanction it by looking the other way. Consider the AANA/COA policy on having a grievance with your school. . . You must first exhaust all attempts to resolve your issue at the program level. By that time YOU"RE probably exhausted and/or ready to seek legal advice.

Consider for a moment the article published by the AANA on Nurse Anesthesia Students with Disabilities. (It's in the AANA Journal if you Google it). Talk about discrimination. By the way, their need to discriminate against others "less than perfect" or "different" in truth reflects their own inability to accept their own inadequacies, and accept the fact that they are not MD's. The region where I went to school also seemed to "target" older females as the rates of dismissal/withdrawal seemed unusually squewed toward women over the age of 40. When I started nurse anesthesia school, I thought I was joining a profession not a "sorority".

If you truly want to make a difference a keep this from happening to others, by all means SPEAK UP. If this happened to you contact your state board of nursing, your legislators, the state board of education, the U.S. department of education, or even the Joint Commission (JCAHCO). The trail of this blog definitely demonstrates a pattern. Anyone ever consider a class action Lawsuit? Standard #1 by the COA regarding the accreditation of anesthesia programs states "Provides an environment conducive to student learning"; now is that a breech of contract? Check out the article on lateral violence in nursing "Calling Out the Elephant in the Room" One of the authors was a former SRNA.

Good Luck to all. I feel your pain. I thought the anger would get better in time. Somedays it's actually worse.

[bendover]

Is this forum closed?

[bohica11]

Yup the hazing stuff is real. I know this has risen to the level of a number of students taking legal action against their program in the circuit court of Raleigh County West Virginia.

[Class2011]

I'd be interested in the facts of the case.

Does a public document exists?