Any ADN-BSN programs without ridiculous papers?

Nursing Students Online Learning

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Taking my 1st ADN-BSN class. Thinking of dropping it with only 1 week left.

1st class and already a 6 to 8 page paper. A concept analysis of 1 of the following 4 words: Caring, Hope, Trust, or Fear.

This is absolutely ridiculous. I have absolutely no idea what to say.

The structure of these programs MUST change.

I don't want to write papers every 5 weeks. I want to read a book and take a test.

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
PMFB-RN, there is no evidence there is a problem with the quality of BSN programs in general, and several people on this thread have spoken out in support of the quality of the ADN-BSN/BSN programs they are attending/have attended.

*** Thank you for your opinion. If BSN is going to be required, as many people advocate for and many nurse employers already do, and nurses are going to spend so much of their money and time earning the degree, they should get more IMO.

There isn't anything special about the BSN. It is not rigerous like some other areas of study, and from what I can see does not make better nurses, and no evidence I have seen demonstrates it does. The argument that it makes one a more well rounded individual is debunked by the fact that the many ADN prepared RNs with undergraduate and graduate degrees in other fields are not considered the same as the ADN + bachelors or masters degree RN.

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Specializes in critical care.

*** Thank you for your opinion. If BSN is going to be required, as many people advocate for and many nurse employers already do, and nurses are going to spend so much of their money and time earning the degree, they should get more IMO.

There isn't anything special about the BSN. It is not rigerous like some other areas of study, and from what I can see does not make better nurses, and no evidence I have seen demonstrates it does. The argument that it makes one a more well rounded individual is debunked by the fact that the many ADN prepared RNs with undergraduate and graduate degrees in other fields are not considered the same as the ADN + bachelors or masters degree RN.

I keep trying to walk away, and then you pull me back with these generalizations. My BSN absolutely HAS made me more well rounded. More so than the ADN because I have taken many non-nursing classes that have opened my eyes to a world far beyond nursing.

Also, you absolutely cannot say that the BSN is not rigorous. That is a generalization with no basis in fact. It is based on anecdote and personal experience after you have completed a program that is, by your own admission, not that great.

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.

I keep trying to walk away, and then you pull me back with these generalizations. My BSN absolutely HAS made me more well rounded. More so than the ADN because I have taken many non-nursing classes that have opened my eyes to a world far beyond nursing.

Also, you absolutely cannot say that the BSN is not rigorous. That is a generalization with no basis in fact. It is based on anecdote and personal experience after you have completed a program that is, by your own admission, not that great.

^This. Unless you have been in the basic BSN program..Health Assessment was far more detailed than what I learned in health assessment in the top-quality ADN program I went to, as another poster replied.

It is up to the individual to be invested in their program that they choose. Before I entered a BSN program as an LPN, I researched 15 programs before I selected a program. I looked at programs, people who were already in the programs, etc, before selecting one. My research and my choice was the BEST for me, and allowed me to be excellent and well rounded while being able to still work and make a living.

I think if one wants to post on their unsatisfactory of their program, by all means do, but don't generalize a "waste" of a BSN because a program is not up to par.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I keep trying to walk away, and then you pull me back with these generalizations. My BSN absolutely HAS made me more well rounded. More so than the ADN because I have taken many non-nursing classes that have opened my eyes to a world far beyond nursing.

*** Oh I don't doubt it did that for you but that doesn't have anything to do with my point. Makeing you a more rounded person and opening your eyes to a world beyond nursing is not the reason for the push for BSN required. As I said before if that was the motovation them people who degrees in international relations, or english, or whatever plus and an ADN would also be rounded and there would be no reason for them to need a BSN.

I had my eyes opened to a wide world by spending 18 months traveling around the world with a back pack and almost no money. I gained a unique education about the rest of the world but I don't think everybody should have to do it to be a qualified nurse.

I am not saying nobody should get a BSN. Many people should. I just don't think it should be required for RN practice.

Also, you absolutely cannot say that the BSN is not rigorous. That is a generalization with no basis in fact. It is based on anecdote and personal experience

*** Nurisng just isn't that hard. Especialy compaired to some other fields like chemical enginering or any of many other fields. Yes as I made clear a number of times that is my informed opinion. I never pretended what I was saying was anything other than my opinion on the subject.

after you have completed a program that is, by your own admission, not that great.

*** Uh, What? I never said any such thing. I went to a very good BSN program. Ranked in the top 25 nursing schools by US News and World Report. To me it is telling that such a highly rates and respected program was like that. I wonder what other programs are like, in particular the high cost, for profit online only programs.

To me saying a program is among the best is like saying one is among the best surfers in all of North Dakota. It might well be true but you haven't said much.

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The BSN isn't about becomeing a better nurse. I think I got dumber getting a BSN as compaired to the training I could have used that time for. There was little nursing related content in my BSN program and absolutly no content related to my area of nursing. The level of discourse was pathetic. In particular the portion of the program aimed at teaching cultural awareness was pathestic. Maybe OK for a kid who never left their little all white small town but for a man who has spend years living abroad it was supeficial. Not just me either. My friends and co-workers complain about the same thing and we didn't all go to the same school. I didn't go to a fly-by-night online school either. I went to a well respected state university with a real school of nursing offering a variety of advanced practice programs at the MSN and DNP level.

The above is your own post where you complained about the quality of your program, i.e. "... little nursing related content ...,"; "... absolutely no content related to my area of nursing."; "The level of discourse was pathetic. In particular the portion of the program aimed at teaching cultural awareness was pathetic."

Your own negative experience in your program plus the move towards BSN does not mean ADN-BSN/BSN programs are generally of poor quality. I refer to your statements from posts you made on this thread below:

"*** No, I have complained about the qualiety of BSN programs in general, not my program in particular. Besides I want to a highly rated and respected program."

"*** Oh I don't doubt it did that for you but that doesn't have anything to do with my point. Makeing you a more rounded person and opening your eyes to a world beyond nursing is not the reason for the push for BSN required."

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Specializes in critical care.

The BSN contains different classes than the ADN. There IS a difference in the degrees. My BSN has leadership, research methods, and required electives. I don't know if this is just a local thing but I have not seen any ADNs with those classes.

As for the rest, the previous poster addressed it well.

On a side note, I can't tell if you are calling me an idiot for feeling my program is hard. I'm glad you found your program easy. I will just leave it at that because you are very much in the minority with that feeling and you are not coming across very nicely.

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Specializes in critical care.

*** Uh, What? I never said any such thing. I went to a very good BSN program. Ranked in the top 25 nursing schools by US News and World Report. To me it is telling that such a highly rates and respected program was like that. I wonder what other programs are like, in particular the high cost, for profit online only programs.

To me saying a program is among the best is like saying one is among the best surfers in all of North Dakota. It might well be true but you haven't said much.

This is one massive contradiction. You tell me you never said your program was bad, and then you say it's pointless to say it was good. Can you simply admit that your own personal experience has tainted your opinion if BSN and admit you may be wrong in your assumptions? You have multiple people on this thread sharing their experiences that are contrary to your own and you insult them by saying nursing isn't hard and the BSN is a waste in the grand scheme of things.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
The above is your own post where you complained about the quality of your program, i.e. "... little nursing related content ...,"; "... absolutely no content related to my area of nursing."; "The level of discourse was pathetic. In particular the portion of the program aimed at teaching cultural awareness was pathetic."

*** Yes! And that program is rated among the better programs.

Your own negative experience in your program plus the move towards BSN does not mean ADN-BSN/BSN programs are generally of poor quality.

*** OK.

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Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.

On a side note, I can't tell if you are calling me an idiot for feeling my program is hard.

*** I don't think you are an idiot and didn't mean to imply that. I apologize.

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Specializes in Hospice, corrections, psychiatry, rehab, LTC.
Also consider that many community colleges offer part time and evening and weekend program options that I have never heard offered in an accelerated BSN program. This makes it possible for working people, people who might not be able to devote 100% of their lives to nursing school to become nurses.

This is precisely why I went the ADN route. There were several BSN programs in the area where I lived at the time. I ruled out the private universities due to cost (I paid out of pocket). The ones at public universities expected me to be available basically all day every day, and I was not independently wealthy or living with my parents, so quitting work was not an option. An ADN program in my area developed a program especially for people like me, people who had to work while attending school. Our classes and clinicals were held on evenings and weekends. It is the only practical way I could have gone to nursing school.

Time-wise it would have been about the same one way or the other, because I had a BA in psychology before I went to nursing school, so I wouldn't have needed filler credits to get my degree. Had I been able to go the BSN route, I would likely have attended the same university where I got my BA, so acceptance of credits wouldn't have been a problem either.

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Specializes in ER trauma, ICU - trauma, neuro surgical.

I think the studies that show better clinical outcomes with BSN's vs ADN's is hog wash. Of course, the people that are conducting the study are going to say that BSN's are better than ADN's. There's no ADN's who are conducting studies, so the idea of a ADN being inferior is completely biased. Nurses look down on the other nurses that don't have the same degree as them. BSN's think ADN's should have BSNs, Masters think BSNs should have their masters, and now, by hearing all of the recommendations from the board of nursing, doctorates are saying that a masters should be a doctorate. My BSN will help me with a managerial role, but it has not improved me at the bedside. I got better with experience and by testing myself with standardized exams and certifications. So, when I hear that a bunch of suits conducting a study that shows ADN's are inferior to BSN's with clinical outcomes, I laugh. Really...there's no bachelor prepared nurses that suck at the bedside? It's just the ADNs who bring it down for the rest of us?

For years, people have been saying that ADN's and BSN are the same at the bedside. Now, it's changing all of a sudden. I hear the same complaining between DNP's and ARNP's. Education does not equal competency. I know LPN's that can run circles around BSN's.

The issue is not better clinical outcomes. The issue is better patient satisfaction. That's what is driving this. We have moved away from caring for patients and become a business with clients. A BSN is not going to stabilize the sick better than an ADN. A BSN is not going to care for a trauma pt better than an ADN. But, the public does like hearing that a hospital only has nurses with a bachelors. Everybody is happy and the reimbursement flows in. If I was a pt, I don't care if the practitioner has an ARNP or a doctorate. What I want to know is can you do your job? It seems the best thing for a pt is not saving lives, but whether or not they have a smile on their face as they go down hill. If I am dying, you can give me a mean nurse... if you can do your job well and save me, then we are good.

It also has to do with how nurses are prepared. The reason a bachelors does not improve clinical outcomes is this...Jean watson is not going improve my ability to care for a pt with a head injury. If nursing was more medically based, then I would have a completely different opinion. If I went back for my BSN and they prepared me with differential diagnosis, advanced assessement (not just stick me in with first year assessment, but real advanced assessment), and in-depth medical training, imagine how much better nurses would be at the bedside. But, we learn jean watson and write papers on "evaluation perspectives across cross cultural spectrums within opinions that favor conflict resolution." Ethics was great, research was great, the electives were great, but they have to float in the nursing theory world and just side track and side track. Thats why ADN's are sour with the idea of going back to school. It's not going to do anything at the bedside. I went back because I wanted to. I like school. But if I didn't have the time or money, I wouldn't be happy. But patients will be satisfied...I guess that's more important than saving the life of your family member.

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Specializes in Hospital Education Coordinator.

anyone receiving a baccalaureate degree in any field should be able to communicate their thoughts. Nursing is so much more than tasks. Writing helps us learn to sort of the important concepts that need to be explored. Emotional intelligence requires the ability to apply all sorts of communication skills. I am ashamed of some of the things I read that nurses have documented.

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