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ANA discriminates against LPN/LVN

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NO JT WE ARE NOT JOINING YOU!

I didnt mean join the organziation. I meant join in the activity. Lots of people keep complaining that "no one" is DOING anything. Theres at least one thing already set up......all you have to do is show up & tell your stories to the media & your own states legislators to help get some solutions put into gear. But if you dont want to do that because WE will be there too, thats your choice. While youre cutting your nose to spite your face, dont sit back & say "No one" is taking any action to solve the problems.

have a nice day.

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NO JT WE ARE NOT JOINING YOU!

I didnt mean join the organziation. I meant join in the activity. Lots of people keep complaining that "no one" is DOING anything. Theres at least one thing already set up......all you have to do is show up & tell your stories to the media & your own states legislators to help get some solutions put into gear. But if you dont want to do that because WE will be there too, thats your choice. While youre cutting your nose to spite your face, dont sit back & say "No one" is taking any action to solve the problems.

have a nice day.

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Here is an advocate of LPNs being admitted to the ANA, even if it is in a "limited capacity"! This post was made by tim,acnp. Lpn/vn, read it carefully, and see if you wish to be included in an organization with those who think like this!

ACNP

Veteran

Member # 10664

posted May 06, 2001 09:44 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Okay, look. I have not the time, the will, nor the desire to argue

Yet, I find hilarious the number of LPNs who THINK they have what it takes to be an RN. Everyone wants to be considered a professional, BUT VERY FEW are willing to put forth the effort to reach that level. There are DISTINCT DIFFEERNCES in the education of an LPN vs. an ADN. And the BSN? The differences in education are incomparable. Okay, okay…..so you are better at making beds, inserting foleys, or other “technical” duties. So is a highly trained monkey. But can you think critically? Let me answer that for you….NO. 90% of LPNs don’t know the meaning of critical thinking, much less have the ability to apply it. I think that it is safe to say that 99.9% of LPNs CANNOT take a critical situation and apply knowledge learned from physiology, pathophysiology, pharmacology etc. and apply it to that situation. It’s possible to memorize a ton of information, but NOT UNDERSTAND ANY OF IT. That is precisely the reason why your scope of practice is limited, as well as why advanced practice nursing requires the BSN as a prerequisite.

Yet, as always, nursing continues to seek the least common denominator – that which is easiest. What is the easiest and fastest way I can obtain my AND? That is no different than me stating, “How many classes can I skip in medical school? After all, I have eight years of full-time college education (and every prerequisite for medical school). I hold a BSN (4.0 G.P.A.) as well as a Masc. (3.95 G.P.A), in conjunction to years of VALUBLE experience. Don’t forget!!! I already have prescriptive privileges, and I’ve tutored many of your medical students over the past two years in physical assessment skills! That should count for something!!!!! Pu-leeeaassseeee. Do you think they give a damn? Of course not. It is called S-T-A-N-D-A-R-D-S. Get it? One more time…

S-T-A-N-D-A-R-D-S. By all means…pursue an AND (or whatever) in the fast track, but please…PLEASE – don’t whine and moan because you aren’t deemed a professional.

Furthermore, the longstanding conviction that the BSN should be the entry level into nursing will never be adhered to. Thus, I am an advocate of having LPNs join the ANA in a limited capacity. There clearly needs to be unity within this field. But make no mistake. While unity is imperative for nursing to progress, there is a reason for the hierarchy. All nurses ARE NOT the same.

As always, this is not meant to be construed as insensitive or rude. However, the issue has apparently become cloudy, and the need for clarification is quite evident. I am done with this issue. Take care.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posts: 63 | From: | Registered: Apr 2001 | IP: Logged

:mad

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Here is an advocate of LPNs being admitted to the ANA, even if it is in a "limited capacity"! This post was made by tim,acnp. Lpn/vn, read it carefully, and see if you wish to be included in an organization with those who think like this!

ACNP

Veteran

Member # 10664

posted May 06, 2001 09:44 PM

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Okay, look. I have not the time, the will, nor the desire to argue

Yet, I find hilarious the number of LPNs who THINK they have what it takes to be an RN. Everyone wants to be considered a professional, BUT VERY FEW are willing to put forth the effort to reach that level. There are DISTINCT DIFFEERNCES in the education of an LPN vs. an ADN. And the BSN? The differences in education are incomparable. Okay, okay…..so you are better at making beds, inserting foleys, or other “technical” duties. So is a highly trained monkey. But can you think critically? Let me answer that for you….NO. 90% of LPNs don’t know the meaning of critical thinking, much less have the ability to apply it. I think that it is safe to say that 99.9% of LPNs CANNOT take a critical situation and apply knowledge learned from physiology, pathophysiology, pharmacology etc. and apply it to that situation. It’s possible to memorize a ton of information, but NOT UNDERSTAND ANY OF IT. That is precisely the reason why your scope of practice is limited, as well as why advanced practice nursing requires the BSN as a prerequisite.

Yet, as always, nursing continues to seek the least common denominator – that which is easiest. What is the easiest and fastest way I can obtain my AND? That is no different than me stating, “How many classes can I skip in medical school? After all, I have eight years of full-time college education (and every prerequisite for medical school). I hold a BSN (4.0 G.P.A.) as well as a Masc. (3.95 G.P.A), in conjunction to years of VALUBLE experience. Don’t forget!!! I already have prescriptive privileges, and I’ve tutored many of your medical students over the past two years in physical assessment skills! That should count for something!!!!! Pu-leeeaassseeee. Do you think they give a damn? Of course not. It is called S-T-A-N-D-A-R-D-S. Get it? One more time…

S-T-A-N-D-A-R-D-S. By all means…pursue an AND (or whatever) in the fast track, but please…PLEASE – don’t whine and moan because you aren’t deemed a professional.

Furthermore, the longstanding conviction that the BSN should be the entry level into nursing will never be adhered to. Thus, I am an advocate of having LPNs join the ANA in a limited capacity. There clearly needs to be unity within this field. But make no mistake. While unity is imperative for nursing to progress, there is a reason for the hierarchy. All nurses ARE NOT the same.

As always, this is not meant to be construed as insensitive or rude. However, the issue has apparently become cloudy, and the need for clarification is quite evident. I am done with this issue. Take care.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posts: 63 | From: | Registered: Apr 2001 | IP: Logged

:mad

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"I am an advocate of having LPNs join the ANA in a limited capacity."

I can see what you mean about the unity thing on the surface of things but I think limited capacity would be creating a 2-tier system within the organization & cause DISunity. The LPNs might end up feeling like 2nd-class citizens & that would just cause division within the ranks. While LPNS & RNs are both nurses & have common ground, they do have different issues of concern too. Thats nothing to be ashamed of or defensive about. LPNs already have their own national organziation (do they join that???) & are unionized by the other healthcare unions. We can all work together on the common ground & maintain our own organizations for our own separate needs - and thats just what is happening through the ANA affiliation with the AFL-CIO, so Whats wrong with that?

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"I am an advocate of having LPNs join the ANA in a limited capacity."

I can see what you mean about the unity thing on the surface of things but I think limited capacity would be creating a 2-tier system within the organization & cause DISunity. The LPNs might end up feeling like 2nd-class citizens & that would just cause division within the ranks. While LPNS & RNs are both nurses & have common ground, they do have different issues of concern too. Thats nothing to be ashamed of or defensive about. LPNs already have their own national organziation (do they join that???) & are unionized by the other healthcare unions. We can all work together on the common ground & maintain our own organizations for our own separate needs - and thats just what is happening through the ANA affiliation with the AFL-CIO, so Whats wrong with that?

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Brownsm46,

Wow this is harse, I agree that you have a great amount of education but some of us can not afford to attend college for BSN. Personally I don't see the need to have to take all those English, Speech, etc course to become a nurse. I don't think any of the non-nursing courses except maybe Math, or Psych. are necessary in the working world. I don't think that most of us as LPN's want to be treated like a BSN nurse, but I do think we would like to be treated like a nurse who has education and skills to accomplish the work that we have to do. I have respect for all nurse whether they are an LPN, ADN, or BSN. I respect those that respect me for what I do. I do, however, believe that BSN nurses are basically trained for management, which is fine, but I believe that LPNs, and ADNs are more trained for technical and skills, most the the nurses that I have worked with are mainly LPNs and ADNs and most want to work hands-on and not managment, that's why we choose what we choose. Not to mention that most of us that are LPNs or ADNs are family oriented and do not have the time or money to pursue the BSN degree. I personally think that what you said is very hurtful, we are all trying our best to provide for our patients in a professional manner, no matter what the degree. An I personally don't think anyone would like a monkey to insert a foley. I appreciate you, you should try to appreciate and respect others less educated then you, but that may have the skills to get the job done. :(

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Brownsm46,

Wow this is harse, I agree that you have a great amount of education but some of us can not afford to attend college for BSN. Personally I don't see the need to have to take all those English, Speech, etc course to become a nurse. I don't think any of the non-nursing courses except maybe Math, or Psych. are necessary in the working world. I don't think that most of us as LPN's want to be treated like a BSN nurse, but I do think we would like to be treated like a nurse who has education and skills to accomplish the work that we have to do. I have respect for all nurse whether they are an LPN, ADN, or BSN. I respect those that respect me for what I do. I do, however, believe that BSN nurses are basically trained for management, which is fine, but I believe that LPNs, and ADNs are more trained for technical and skills, most the the nurses that I have worked with are mainly LPNs and ADNs and most want to work hands-on and not managment, that's why we choose what we choose. Not to mention that most of us that are LPNs or ADNs are family oriented and do not have the time or money to pursue the BSN degree. I personally think that what you said is very hurtful, we are all trying our best to provide for our patients in a professional manner, no matter what the degree. An I personally don't think anyone would like a monkey to insert a foley. I appreciate you, you should try to appreciate and respect others less educated then you, but that may have the skills to get the job done. :(

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Greetings fellow Nurses,

First I would like to wish all of us a Happy Nurses Day! I take extreme prediduce at this persons post (Until I reread it and noted you were not the one who said it)! I am not a "Trained Monkey" although you, all humans beings, and I desend from the Great Apes! And I am skilled ty for noting that!

Now to the issue of critical thinking! I have been told, it was I who saved a pt live on more than one occasion! Why because I noted something and would not let it go or for the sake of the client I continued to get the Attending/Surgeon into the clients room! Seriously if it had been up to my charge nurse on 2 occasions I would have had a D/C'd client, instead I advocated to get what they needed!

As a LPN we are not allowed to apply our critical assessment skills just document and pass on the observations and our thoughts to the Charge or Attending Physician. So do not say we do not have them. We are mandated to allow someone else to apply thier skills! But I have been known to continue up the chain of command to get the response I want! That is called pt advocay if you recall!

I see by the post you were/are frustrated and settled for being a nurse and not a MD? [QOUTE]“How many classes can I skip in medical school?"[/QOUTE] "Not deemed a professional" by whos standards? Yours and the ANA?

[QOUTE]Furthermore, the longstanding conviction that the BSN should be the entry level into nursing will never be adhered to. Thus, I am an advocate of having LPNs join the ANA in a limited capacity. There clearly needs to be unity within this field. But make no mistake. While unity is imperative for nursing to progress, there is a reason for the hierarchy. All nurses ARE NOT the same. [/QOUTE]

NO, THANKS, ABSOLUTELY NOT! They tried as activley as legally posible to abolish us LPN's, Who do think think they are and who do they think they are dealing with trained monkeys?

Peace,

Have a Blessed Day,

Jami

PS Where did you find this? :eek:

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Greetings fellow Nurses,

First I would like to wish all of us a Happy Nurses Day! I take extreme prediduce at this persons post (Until I reread it and noted you were not the one who said it)! I am not a "Trained Monkey" although you, all humans beings, and I desend from the Great Apes! And I am skilled ty for noting that!

Now to the issue of critical thinking! I have been told, it was I who saved a pt live on more than one occasion! Why because I noted something and would not let it go or for the sake of the client I continued to get the Attending/Surgeon into the clients room! Seriously if it had been up to my charge nurse on 2 occasions I would have had a D/C'd client, instead I advocated to get what they needed!

As a LPN we are not allowed to apply our critical assessment skills just document and pass on the observations and our thoughts to the Charge or Attending Physician. So do not say we do not have them. We are mandated to allow someone else to apply thier skills! But I have been known to continue up the chain of command to get the response I want! That is called pt advocay if you recall!

I see by the post you were/are frustrated and settled for being a nurse and not a MD? [QOUTE]“How many classes can I skip in medical school?"[/QOUTE] "Not deemed a professional" by whos standards? Yours and the ANA?

[QOUTE]Furthermore, the longstanding conviction that the BSN should be the entry level into nursing will never be adhered to. Thus, I am an advocate of having LPNs join the ANA in a limited capacity. There clearly needs to be unity within this field. But make no mistake. While unity is imperative for nursing to progress, there is a reason for the hierarchy. All nurses ARE NOT the same. [/QOUTE]

NO, THANKS, ABSOLUTELY NOT! They tried as activley as legally posible to abolish us LPN's, Who do think think they are and who do they think they are dealing with trained monkeys?

Peace,

Have a Blessed Day,

Jami

PS Where did you find this? :eek:

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jt-I am a member of the ANA by virtue of my SNA as my collective bargaining agent. I am also a member of my local chapter. AND I am an ADN. I attempted to become active in my local chapter. It is made up of mostly administrative and exec RNs-there were NO bedside nurses at the meetings I went to. When I attempted to be recognized to speak at one meeting, I was basically ignored until it was suddenly "no time for more questions". I have heard people I know descibe the same scenario at the state level. I admit I do not know anyone at the national level personally.

Now, it's possible that it was the fact that i am a stranger, not because of my ADN, that i went unrecognized. But from discussing it with others, I think it's because I was recognized as a bedside nurse. I hope the attitude will change.

BTW, I do advocate a BSN as the minimum for licensure. I hope I would be grandfathered in as well. And i would match my critical thinking skills against any other nurse anyday-and do believe I would frequently come out ahead, as I have in several instances in my career!

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jt-I am a member of the ANA by virtue of my SNA as my collective bargaining agent. I am also a member of my local chapter. AND I am an ADN. I attempted to become active in my local chapter. It is made up of mostly administrative and exec RNs-there were NO bedside nurses at the meetings I went to. When I attempted to be recognized to speak at one meeting, I was basically ignored until it was suddenly "no time for more questions". I have heard people I know descibe the same scenario at the state level. I admit I do not know anyone at the national level personally.

Now, it's possible that it was the fact that i am a stranger, not because of my ADN, that i went unrecognized. But from discussing it with others, I think it's because I was recognized as a bedside nurse. I hope the attitude will change.

BTW, I do advocate a BSN as the minimum for licensure. I hope I would be grandfathered in as well. And i would match my critical thinking skills against any other nurse anyday-and do believe I would frequently come out ahead, as I have in several instances in my career!

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