An Observation...

[HeyHeyitsMaay]

I start school on August 25th.

We had to do BLS with our class at the school this past Wednesday, and I'm kind of shocked.

There were younger girls (I'm 28) who were super catty, openly, to older students. Lots of gossip LOUDLY, and just..I don't know. NOT what I expected.

I feel like I'm being a jerk, like judgmental or something. But I expected a better caliber of people.

We were learning about AED's and how to use them, and I was standing next to the table, not touching it, and some lady who'll be in my class with me started randomly yelling at me, interrupting the demonstration.

'STOP TOUCHING THE TAAAAABLE!'

huh?

I wasn't anywhere near it, so I didn't realize she was talking to me..and she's a student so...

:confusedface:

Finally one of the instructors said 'nobody's touching the table..we need to continue'

I've learned as an adult to keep my mouth shut and have a low profile to avoid trouble, which is the ANTITHESIS of my nature.

But I handle it well.

I just couldn't believe the lack of maturity and so forth that I saw. Is this normal in school?

I'm going to a pretty reputable school too. I just didn't expect this.

[NewStudentGirly]

We actually have a girl in our class who is NOTORIOUS for telling on anyone, for anything, such as wearing flip flops....lol she is always trying to point things out about people that might result in a breach. I am guessing that maybe she is not that confident about herself, and that's why she points out every little thing everyone does ( but herself of course). We actually had a memo today telling "students" to mind their own business and not to engage in "tattletaling" on other students as it is the instructors job to deal with student issues. Adult students do not always act in an adult-like manner, it's almost like jr high all over again......

[Daytonite, BSN, RN]

So, if a nasty, rotten, childish student ends up as a patient and exhibits the same behavior, the nurses can accept it better because they are sick? I've worked on units where behavioral issues with patients had to be addressed because they just can't be ignored all the time. Ask any psych nurse. Assertiveness techniques and understanding the manipulative games that immature people play is essential to working with all kinds of people.

[NewStudentGirly]

I am only in my second year of nursing school and no not know much of well, anything yet but isn't it normal for some people in that environment to be overly emotional, or kind of "moody" sometimes? Such as being diagnosed with a terminal illness, losing a limb, etc.,?

[HeyHeyitsMaay]

"While coddling them and patronizing behavior that isn't conducive to healing shouldn't be an acceptable practice, we are called to higher standards per our instructors and the ethics we agree to abide by as health care professionals in training."

So no, if one of those 'mean nasty students' were my patient and they exhibited the same behavior to me as they did to others in class that particular day, it wouldn't be tolerated, per my previous and above listed response to this question.

What you don't seem to be grasping is that, each group of individuals has their own responsibilities. PATIENT responsibilities, and HEALTH CARE PROVIDER responsibilities. Each one has a separate set of standards that they should be upholding.

So,

Nurse: 'That old lady is a retard'

Patient: 'That old lady is a retard'

Reprehensible statement no matter who says it. But at work, or at school....

It's perfectly acceptable to be shocked that a 'professional' would speak of another human being in that capacity outside of their own home. In a health care setting, I have authority that has been given to me by virtue of my position and given responsibilities and so I can manage the situation and behavior accordingly.

I have dealt with patients whom I've had to family members to come relieve me immediately due to their abusive behavior. Who said ANYONE should tolerate that from another human being?

No one. But seriously. As a 'nurse' (I don't like using that word because I'm simply not a nurse..but for the sake of the conversation I will this time) we don't expect super happy bright shiny faces every day!

:uhoh21:

When I go to school, I'm dealing with someone who is there to do the same thing I'm doing. SO I DO expect some modicum of basic respect for others.

NOBODY has a right to treat another human being in the referenced way. But none of the people I'm in school with are under my direct care or authority, and while I am with a patient to help them get better which can include some assertiveness on my part when they become abusive, I don't have that authority when I'm in class.

And so I asked...is this something other people have dealt with at school as well.

I didn't realize my venting/trying to learn from those who came before me would result in a game of semantics.

[HeyHeyitsMaay]

In short, I respect that you're saying that NOBODY should openly verbally abuse others. But considering that we're paying quite a bit of money for an education and have signed numerous contracts to abide by basic standards of good behavior, and have been through a very long process to ensure that we're emotionally capable and mature enough to focus on our work...

You wouldn't think that entire groups of jerks would pop up and openly assert that sort of crap.

I used to work in a prison, with inmates.

As HUMANS I expect them to abide by general standards of respectable behavior. I don't make allowances for the fact that they're convicted criminals. Don't act like a jerk around me. Bottom line.

Part of my job was to engage in extensive outreach with the homeless, prostitutes, drug addicts...etc. in an urban setting.

I don't care what kind of situation you're in, you'll never get out of it if I coddle you and say 'ohh you're just a dumb homeless guy, I can't expect you not to be a jerk.' If I value you as a human being, I'm going to expect you to behave according to your potential. However, a homeless guy is much more likely to spit on me because he's homeless. An inmate is much more likely to be negative towards me. You don't hold them to the same standards as your co-workers because they haven't agreed to anything but to listen to you talk.

One of my co-workers is my co-worker because they're NOT more likely to spit on me or call me a name because the hiring process should've weeded that out. By virtue of employment, they've agreed to specific standards in order to get paid. If they DID spit on me or call me a terrible name, though human nature shouldn't surprise me, it's going to.

[readytoroll]

I think everyone should just take a step back and breathe. I don't think Daytonite was trying to be condescending, I think she was trying to get the conversation going and get everyone involved in a little critical thinking.

The common thread between patients and colleagues is that they are all human and are going to exhibit human behavior, both good and bad. I do think the behavior of your fellow students was reprehensible but it is just another ugly part of human nature.

I have found that there are two basic types of people in nursing school (I know a BIG generalization) Those that try to get ahead by listening to the instructor and working with their fellow students and those who try to get ahead by squashing their fellow students. Sounds like you have a big group of the latter in your class! It has nothing to do with their age and everything to do with their lack of cofidence. Feel good in knowing that they see you as a potential threat and that one day they will be "old" too! You can't hold them to the standard of a nurse, because they aren't nurses and there is no proof as of yet that they ever will be.

Everyone, please don't lose sight of the questions on the table arguing and taking things personally. I would hate to see a good thread tank becuase everyone is fighting rather than talking. That's my take it or leave it.

Sidebar: Daytonite, I saw in a previous post that you were retraining due too injury? Have you thought about teaching? My lead instructor said there is a huge shortage of qualified teachers for nursing. With your experience, wealth of knowledge, and penchant for asking tough questions :chuckle: I would think you would be a shoe in!

[NewStudentGirly]

In short, I respect that you're saying that NOBODY should openly verbally abuse others. But considering that we're paying quite a bit of money for an education and have signed numerous contracts to abide by basic standards of good behavior, and have been through a very long process to ensure that we're emotionally capable and mature enough to focus on our work...

This hit the nail right on the head I think. If a student yells at another student in my program, ESPECIALLY in a "classroom", it is deemed abusive behavior, unprofessional conduct and is an automatic dismissal if it is witnessed by an advisor. And rightly so I think. If someone cant keep their mouth shut in a classroom why would they be able to in a clinical situation?

[HeyHeyitsMaay]

Sidebar: Daytonite, I saw in a previous post that you were retraining due too injury? Have you thought about teaching? My lead instructor said there is a huge shortage of qualified teachers for nursing. With your experience, wealth of knowledge, and penchant for asking tough questions : I would think you would be a shoe in!

I agree absolutely! Daytonite keeps me on my mental brain toes

[leslie :-D]

In short, I respect that you're saying that NOBODY should openly verbally abuse others. But considering that we're paying quite a bit of money for an education and have signed numerous contracts to abide by basic standards of good behavior, and have been through a very long process to ensure that we're emotionally capable and mature enough to focus on our work...

what really scares me, is that these people are going to be nurses.

i would really like to see some sort of character screening upon entrance to nsg school.

it bothers me to no end that while many possess the intellectual capacity to critically think, many others seem to lack a basic core of decency.

so yeah, i am equally as appalled when nsg students/nurses display such contemptuous behavior.

i maintain there are many nurses out there, who just shouldn't be.

leslie

[Daytonite, BSN, RN]

When students are being mean to each other in the classroom, then it is a problem of the instructor and the school not doing their part in keeping control of the classroom. In cases like that, I would be in the office of the dean making a case about what my tuition was being used for. The school can't do anything about the behavior of people outside class.

[NewStudentGirly]

When students are being mean to each other in the classroom, then it is a problem of the instructor and the school not doing their part in keeping control of the classroom. In cases like that, I would be in the office of the dean making a case about what my tuition was being used for. The school can't do anything about the behavior of people outside class.

I agree. Although it is a shame that people act this way. Such is life I guess.

[HeyHeyitsMaay]

No need for me to complain to the dean. In the end, as I like to say all the time..reciprocity is a sure thing. As long as I'm getting my education and there's no grievous abuse of others that I'm expected to stand around and do nothing about, this kind of stuff is part of life.