Advance Practice Preceptorships - Should students find their own preceptors?

Excerpt from letter written to nursing administrators... Specialties Advanced Article

There are several additional points that I would like to make at this time. The concept of students finding and arranging their own preceptorships in advance nursing is an unsustainable and unethical one. For one thing, there is an unequal playing field in the process. Students that have greater access to medical professionals due to their previous experience or background will have a tremendous advantage in securing preceptorships. For instance, the son of an ICU physician would undoubtedly have almost no problems finding all his preceptors due to his father's connections. However, a first generation, aspiring nurse from a disadvantaged inner city that is pursuing an advanced degree will face significant difficulty securing preceptors.

Furthermore, students, in general, have almost no leverage when trying to secure a preceptor. An advance practice student, being one of the lowest in the medical hierarchy, is in essence trying to get a highly paid medical professional (Physician, PA, NP) to teach him/her a skill or profession without any type of compensation whatsoever. The natural question is of course "Why would anybody want to do that?" And the answer to that question is that "hardly anybody" and understandably so. In addition, medicine is practiced in a highly regulated and litigious environment. Even if a student secures a preceptor (most likely due to personal connections), there are nowadays a myriad of institutional regulations by hospitals and clinics that provide significant hurdles. What kind of incentive does a hospital or medical clinic have to allow just anybody to walk through its door and provide that person with the opportunity of becoming a highly skilled professional? In the case of advance practice nursing, they have none. With the increased concentration and buyouts in medicine, many more practice environments are now regulated by big corporations. Mostly gone are the days, when a nurse could walk into the office of the local town doctor and ask him to train her. Now even the local office might be owned by XYZ Inc. which has regulations, and a lot of them.

Certainly, the leaders of physician and PA programs understand this and that is why they arrange clinical experiences for their students. As nurses, we expect the same of our leaders. Unfortunately, our nursing leaders and schools have shortchanged us as students in the past, but this got to change. Most physicians and physician assistants express general satisfaction with their education. I haven't met many nurse practitioners yet that came to the same conclusion.

As NP students we pay the university to provide a service to us - education. One of the most important parts of this education is the clinical experience. It is not sufficient for the university to charge tuition, write a plethora of rules about the clinical experience and to abandon students to find their own preceptors, knowing well that many will not succeed.

Key Element III E of the CCNE Standards for Accreditation of Baccalaureate and Graduate Nursing Programs (2013) states, "To prepare students for a practice profession, each track in each degree program and post-graduate APRN certificate program affords students the opportunity to develop professional competencies in practice settings aligned to the educational preparation. Clinical practice experiences are provided for students in all programs, including those with distance education offerings."

It states, "clinical practice experiences are provided for students in all programs..." It does not say that students shall provide their own clinical practice experience.

I believe that the CCNE should start enforcing this rule. Schools that are not willing or able to provide this most important aspect of NP education should not be accredited by CCNE. Obviously, this accreditation agency has lacked in enforcing its own standard in past times. However, I believe as an officially recognized national accreditation agency by the U.S. secretary of Education, it needs to step up to the plate and do its job. It is unfair towards the schools that follow the rules and provide clinical experiences when other schools skirt their responsibility, getting by with it. Our physician and PA colleagues have shown us that providing clinical experiences for their students is not that difficult and results in a superior educational experience.

I thank you for your time and appreciate any constructive feedback.

Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.
Actually, I doubt that the schools would care about that ...

But over a few years they would lose accreditation and be gone. It's something we can all do rather than sitting around!

Specializes in Family Nurse Practitioner.
Physicians and other clinicians have always had to "network", in order to be successful. If you are a specialist, where do you think referrals come from? Dr. John, PCP in your area, will send referrals to you if he/she likes and trusts your work, and you treat his/her patients with respect. This is not "begging".

Same goes for students looking for preceptors. If you have a natural ability to network, and have plenty of clinician friends, you should have no trouble getting quality clinical hours from people you know. And, if you work it right and provide a great service as a student, those connections will land you a job when you are done.

I agree and although I went to a brick and mortar school that would have lined up preceptors, mostly NPs with minimal experience who just graduated from that program, I was relieved they let me secure my own. As an experienced Psych RN I knew more than a few excellent psychiatrists so I tailored my clinicals to the job I wanted when I graduated. That so few people seem make the effort or recognize the value in networking astounds me because it is the way I have gotten my best jobs. Knowing what other NPs and psychiatrists in my circle were making even before I graduated also also allowed me to negotiate for top wages.

To the self-righteous students who swear they will single handedly educate the entire cohort of Online U when they graduate get back to us after you have spent your valuable time for free attempting to bring some of these students, who probably shouldn't have even been admitted into a graduate program to begin with, up to speed from ground zero all while managing your patient load. As a rule although I don't encourage anyone to go to a university with a crap reputation I'm more focused on the quality of the student and will only precept RNs I have worked with and respect or who come highly recommended by a colleague who I owe a favor to. There is no way I'm wasting my time and risking my reputation by being connected to a new grad NP who is going to be horrible and trust me there are more than a few horrible ones out there.

The schools should contract with about 20 NPs as preceptors and then have the students fight in cage matches for the right to a qualified preceptor. You lose your match then you are out of the program - but they keep your check.

Specializes in Family Nurse Practitioner.
The schools should contract with about 20 NPs as preceptors and then have the students fight in cage matches for the right to a qualified preceptor. You lose your match then you are out of the program - but they keep your check.

Make it MDs and I'm in! lol

Lol If i ever precept ill have them take a short written test first day before all the paperwork goes through that goes over basic need to know stuff and if they bomb it they are out. And also a full H and P.

The test would be pretty easy, just physical exam stuff and history stuff, I wouldnt be Hitler or anything. But it would weed out those discussion board sloths from Walden University of the Feenux.

To the self-righteous students who swear they will single handedly educate the entire cohort of Online U when they graduate get back to us after you have spent your valuable time for free attempting to bring some of these students, who probably shouldn't have even been admitted into a graduate program to begin with, up to speed from ground zero all while managing your patient load. As a rule although I don't encourage anyone to go to a university with a crap reputation I'm more focused on the quality of the student and will only precept RNs I have worked with and respect or who come highly recommended by a colleague who I owe a favor to. There is no way I'm wasting my time and risking my reputation by being connected to a new grad NP who is going to be horrible and trust me there are more than a few horrible ones out there.

Unsure if this was directed toward me, but of course you have every right to cherry pick whom you'd like to precept.

Re the "crap reputation" schools, I too am unsure of why people enroll in these, but somehow they do.

Specializes in Family Nurse Practitioner.
Unsure if this was directed toward me, but of course you have every right to cherry pick whom you'd like to precept.

Re the "crap reputation" schools, I too am unsure of why people enroll in these, but somehow they do.

Sorry no clue, I've been on call since the day before Thanksgiving and my brain is toast. I tend to quote someone if I'm lobbing in their path though. Try as I swear I do subtlety isn't my strong suite. :)

Specializes in Cardiology nurse practitioner.
or c) preceptors refusing to take students without a relationship with the academic program.

That. And for those of us not affiliated with anyone, I think it is or obligation to refuse to participate in this. It's not a matter of remember how you started, give someone else a chance”, it's a matter of making sure our profession continues to provide high-quality.

I worked with a cardiologist years ago who was a trained obstetrician. He wanted to become a cardiologist, so another cardiologist provided him OJT. He actually acquired privileges in 3 different hospitals for cath, intervention and pacemaker implants. His work was mediocre, at best. As new cardiologists came along who were fellowship-trained, his work was called into question. Eventually, the hospitals were forced to rescind all of the privileges except cardiac cath, and he could only do heart caths when an interventionalist was present in the hospital. This stopped his practice, but many, many patients had ill-placed stents before that happened.

Can you message or tell me the name of the program that finds preceptors and have a residency program for PMHNP ?Thanks !

@peacockmaiden,MSN

Can you message or tell me the name of the program that finds preceptors and have a residency program for PMHNP ?Thanks !

Specializes in Pediatrics.

This article is fantastic, and I love the discussion below. I am two months from completely my program that is a mix of brick and mortar and online, and they found preceptors for every single one of our students that not only met their needs but were near their homes. Not to mention that I live near Allentown and Philadelphia, PA, which is flooding with medical schools, nursing schools and PA schools. They had no problem finding preceptors for all 20 of us. That being said, it was 20 of us. A small cohort. Not 3,500, or 200, like some other schools have. With cohorts like that, absolutely, there is no possible way that they can provide preceptors for all of that locally. Nationally, absolutely, there's no excuse.

To become a nurse practitioner is to enter a profession. A profession in which we handle patient's lives, mothers, sisters, fathers, grandfathers and children. Families, communities. We as a profession are shouting that we provide competent, caring care to patients that is the same, if not better than physicians, and yet we fail to provide even the most basic necessities for the students who are going to be taking care of them! It's embarrassing, unprofessional and degrading. My school is also linked with a PA school, and because of our affiliations we work together very well inter-professionally, sending a good message with them about nurse practitioners. However, I have had several friends, as well as NP preceptors who have had students from online schools who had to find their own preceptors, and have had horrible experiences with them. My women's health preceptor, an NP, said that a student in her final semester could barely compile a focused H&P, let alone differential diagnoses. From that experience alone, she now only takes students from my school and one other well known brick and mortar school nearby, who also provides preceptors. Situations like these probably don't help those who are struggling to find preceptors.

While online schools, or probably more appropriately schools who do not provide preceptors to their students, have their place and need, I strongly do not feel they are needed in preparing professional nurse practitioners to care for the population. They certainly aren't providing quality clinical experiences, a requirement of CCNE, nor probably providing a sustainable faculty to student ratio, also a requirement by CCNE. Clinical faculty is also supposed to visit the clinical sites per CCNE

What programs who do not provide preceptors are doing is feeding off of is people who want to be nurse practitioners at a convenience, whether it be a relaxed admission criteria, on-line format, or "finding preceptors near where I live". Like someone said before, those same students will be posting later begging for preceptors because everyone is flooded with requests, and turned off by bad experiences. As someone said before, people are willing to pay for convenience, and then complain later about quality. I highly suggest putting time into researching actual well-known programs (not just ones that tote that they are), who put your hard-earned money to work and actually provide you a quality education.

It's not supposed to be convenient. Not every nurse is supposed to be a nurse practitioner. PAs take off a year or more for their education. Physicians invest immeasurable time and money into their educations. Both of their professions also treat their students well and provide preceptors. Most of their programs pay their preceptors, which is fantastic and well deserved. While we can all say that everyone should give back, the fact is that money talks, money attracts and money keeps people. Wouldn't you be more inclined to precept if you were being compensated?

I noticed most people saying that nothing really will change. This topic couldn't have come at a better time. This link below is to CCNE, the largest accrediting body of nursing programs and the body that accredits most of the programs we are referring to. Right now, they are reviewing comments to their Current Standards for Accreditation of Baccalaureate and Graduate Nursing Programs - basically, all of the regulations that govern nursing programs. Voice your concerns - I already did! Took me 30 minutes (I had a lot to criticize, haha), but so worth it. Hurry, comments close May 5, 2017. Please share!!

CCNE Website (Look under CCNE Initiatives, it's the first one): American Association of Colleges of Nursing | CCNE Accreditation

Let's act like a profession and actually stand up for ourselves!