A&P without Bio and Chemistry????

Jules A, MSN · Dec 18, 2006

Of course your opinion counts every program of study has their pre-reqs etc. so I'd guess this is a universal issue. Hopefully others will write in because I can only speak for my own reasons but fwiw I graduated tied with one other gal for top of the class so therefore would have to say I wasn't crippled in the slightest. Since you took the time to write I thought I would address your thoughts:

* Financial constraint. If you're so hard up that you're trying to find ways around what are pre-requisites at every four-year program I've seen, skipping bio/chem is the least of your problems. It's only two classes and they will form the basis of your future scientific knowledge.

It wasn't that I was "hard-up" just that I didn't feel like spending an extra $1,000+ and 8 hours a week of my time if I didn't have to. From what I've seen, these are only undergraduate requirements at most schools to allow you to register for Micro and the A&Ps.

* Eager to finish pre-reqs. If you're that impatient, won't it be hard to finish a 2-4 year course? College isn't a race; the spoils go to the persistent, not the eager.

Lol, you got me on this one and yes, college is a race for me. I'm totally about doing things in the most efficient manner possible but don't believe that translates into a problem finishing a longer committment.

* Weak in either/both subjects. If you're weak in biology and/or chemistry and are concerned about your ability to earn a high grade in either entry level class, then healthcare probably isn't the best industry for you.

I would think that if someone was weak in the subjects it would be in their best interest to take the basic course and brush up on their skills but thats just me. I would totally agree that if you can't pass biology, skipping chemistry is going to be the least of your worries.

Bottom line is that if you are happy with the way you are doing it, thats great it wouldn't suit me if I can circumvent some things. Since the original poster posed the question I think its only fair to include both sides. Best wishes, Jules

lady_db_programmer · Dec 18, 2006

Of course your opinion counts every program of study has their pre-reqs etc. so I'd guess this is a universal issue. Hopefully others will write in because I can only speak for my own reasons but fwiw I graduated tied with one other gal for top of the class so therefore would have to say I wasn't crippled in the slightest. Since you took the time to write I thought I would address your thoughts:
* Financial constraint. If you're so hard up that you're trying to find ways around what are pre-requisites at every four-year program I've seen, skipping bio/chem is the least of your problems. It's only two classes and they will form the basis of your future scientific knowledge.
It wasn't that I was "hard-up" just that I didn't feel like spending an extra $1,000+ and 8 hours a week of my time if I didn't have to. From what I've seen, these are only undergraduate requirements at most schools to allow you to register for Micro and the A&Ps.
* Eager to finish pre-reqs. If you're that impatient, won't it be hard to finish a 2-4 year course? College isn't a race; the spoils go to the persistent, not the eager.
Lol, you got me on this one and yes, college is a race for me. I'm totally about doing things in the most efficient manner possible but don't believe that translates into a problem finishing a longer committment.
* Weak in either/both subjects. If you're weak in biology and/or chemistry and are concerned about your ability to earn a high grade in either entry level class, then healthcare probably isn't the best industry for you.
I would think that if someone was weak in the subjects it would be in their best interest to take the basic course and brush up on their skills but thats just me. I would totally agree that if you can't pass biology, skipping chemistry is going to be the least of your worries.
Bottom line is that if you are happy with the way you are doing it, thats great it wouldn't suit me if I can circumvent some things. Since the original poster posed the question I think its only fair to include both sides. Best wishes, Jules

No probs, Jules...I can see where you're coming from. The junior colleges in Dallas allow you to take A&P without bio or chem, but I think it would be a mistake to dive into microbiology or pharmacology (required courses at every nursing program I've ever looked at) without taking general, entry-level bio/chem classes...unless you took some advanced ones in high school and remember a lot from them.

Sure, some people can just jump right in...but not everyone can. I think if someone's having any doubts about their ability to handle it, they should get their hands on the texts for A&P, microbiology, and pharma in the program they plan to apply to, and they should read the first couple of chapters. If they feel that the texts are going too fast for them, it's probably a good idea to take bio/chem. A D in microbiology because you were unprepared hurts a lot more than getting an A in a biology class that you thought was perhaps a little too easy. It's better for your cumulative GPA too; and if someone has a local CC, bio/chem classes can be taken for a lot less than $1000. A lot of non-major bio/chem can be taken online, too; they're better than nothing.

Just my $0.2.

Multicollinearity, BSN, RN · Dec 18, 2006

That's the whole point....you want to understand the why instead of just memorizing. I personally do better if I understand why something happens, it all just makes a whole lot more sense to me and I will retain the information better.
I know this is off topic but I am trying to give an example...It's the same with dissection....if I see the real thing it will stick better than just seing pictures.
I know a lot of people oppose dissection but I tell you that I am impressed forever and will always know where the internal organs are, what they look like....the same for the bloodvessels. You just walk away with a complete different relationship to the material.

Since I didn't have chem before A&P I, things like action potentials and depolarization didn't make 100% sense to me. Now that I've taken chem I understand better. I guess what I was trying to say is it would have been better to take chem first, but it wasn't essential. Nobody understands every topic in A&P with 100% certainty, and that's ok. A slight weakness in one area can be balanced in another to still equal a fantastic final grade. Perfection not required.

stpauligirl · Dec 18, 2006

Since I didn't have chem before A&P I, things like action potentials and depolarization didn't make 100% sense to me. Now that I've taken chem I understand better. I guess what I was trying to say is it would have been better to take chem first, but it wasn't essential. Nobody understands every topic in A&P with 100% certainty, and that's ok. A slight weakness in one area can be balanced in another to still equal a fantastic final grade. Perfection not required.

I guess I am just such a notorious perfectionist :lol2:

Multicollinearity, BSN, RN · Dec 18, 2006

I guess I am just such a notorious perfectionist

I'm perfectly happy with the 96% and 97% final grades I received in A&P I and A&PII. Perfectionism can be good and bad IMHO.

Soundgirl, are you getting the info you need?

Hope2Be · Dec 18, 2006

Thank you all for your input..I already got accepted in the school (NMTC) , the nursing course and pre-reqs do not show chem or bio listed, I would presume that I need to just sign up to take at least Bio course before I taking A&P I....I feel it would be in my best interest to do so...especially I am a returning student after 13 years...

stpauligirl · Dec 18, 2006

I'm perfectly happy with the 96% and 97% final grades I received in A&P I and A&PII. Perfectionism can be good and bad IMHO.
Soundgirl, are you getting the info you need?

I guess I outright need perfectionism to look as good as you....don't forget I am operating in a foreign language and I am the three-legged horse in the Kentucky Derby and I am trying to catch up with everyone else and at least "show" if not outright win the race ....I need to crank everything up a notch and take extra precaution...do your hear me panting behind you :lol2:

Multicollinearity, BSN, RN · Dec 18, 2006

I guess I outright need perfectionism to look as good as you....don't forget I am operating in a foreign language and it's like I am a three-legged horse hobbling along catching up with everyone else ....I need to crank everything up a notch...do your hear me panting behind you

I think I'm usually panting behind you!

stpauligirl · Dec 18, 2006

I think I'm usually panting behind you!

:lol2: No, I think we are going head to head.... :lol2:

It's gonna be a tie :lol2:

lady_db_programmer · Dec 18, 2006

Thank you all for your input..I already got accepted in the school (NMTC) , the nursing course and pre-reqs do not show chem or bio listed, I would presume that I need to just sign up to take at least Bio course before I taking A&P I....I feel it would be in my best interest to do so...especially I am a returning student after 13 years...

Course materials sometimes don't show pre-requisites. Check the university's course catalog; that should have definitive answers on pre-requisites; you may find that biology is required.

stpauligirl · Dec 18, 2006

Course materials sometimes don't show pre-requisites. Check the university's course catalog; that should have definitive answers on pre-requisites; you may find that biology is required.

Sorry to butt in here....I am wondering if soundgirl had a meeting with a degree counselor or even better, the director of the nursing school. I had the opportunity to share my unofficial transcript and took the director's advise where to start (she told me to start with Chemistry.... :lol2: ).

I had put school on hold for a number of years and I am older, too. I've been following her suggested plan and it is working out great for me.

lady_db_programmer · Dec 18, 2006

Sorry to butt in here....I am wondering if soundgirl had a meeting with a degree counselor or even better, the director of the nursing school. I had the opportunity to share my unofficial transcript and took the director's advise where to start (she told me to start with Chemistry.... ).
I had put school on hold for a number of years and I am older, too. I've been following her suggested plan and it is working out great for me.

I'm just speaking from experience. For example, UTA lists Anatomy and Physiology I & II as pre-requisites for its BSN nursing sequence but neglects to mention that biology is a pre-requisite. It also lists biology and one year of chemistry as pre-requisites for its microbiology class, and it doesn't mention that college algebra is a pre-requisite for both its introductory chemistry class and its statistics class. Its BSN brochure doesn't tell you that; I had to look up each and every class in its course catalog to figure out what those courses' pre-requisites were.