NY State may require nurses to obtain 4-year degrees - page 5

But some worry that an already severe shortage will become worse. New York is mulling over a requirement that would force all RNs to earn a bachelor's degree in order to keep their RN... Read More

  1. by   stbernardclub
    There is no doubt registered nurses need continued education, and we all know those who wish to never pick up a book ,unless its a romance novel,gain.This is deadly! Now, here goes my neighbor New York. I see where your coming from, but you have to make it easy.It would first have to be free,and it would have to be on site classrooms(hospitals),and it would have to allow for some time off for test studies.Why must it be easy?Because we as a society need nurses ,they are the true healers in the healthcare field.My hats off to all those who obtained dergees with families and jobs.You are a special group! peace! sandy
    Quote from brian
    But some worry that an already severe shortage will become worse.

    New York is mulling over a requirement that would force all RNs to earn a bachelor's degree in order to keep their RN certification-a step that critics worry could serve as a body blow to a profession already facing a severe shortage.

    Under the state Board of Nursing proposal, RNs with associate's degrees would have to earn bachelor's degrees within 10 years, or their RN certifications would be downgraded to that of licensed practical nurse. That would make nursing somewhat like teaching in New York state; certified K-12 teachers need master's degrees or must obtain one within three years of starting a job. It would also add years and thousands of dollars to the difficulty of becoming an RN...

    Full Article: http://www.rochesterdandc.com/news/0...IOG_news.shtml
  2. by   JennieJenRN
    Quote from Mel D
    As a BSN student I take offense at that. There are no "management" classes in our curriculum. We do clinical rotations in Peds, OB, Psych, Adult Health, Community Health, and our senior practicum.
    I am in a BSN completion program and guess what my first two classes were management. My next two are leadership and management!!!
  3. by   JennieJenRN
    Quote from beth07
    Hi everyone, i'm a first time user here and I'd just like to give my opinion on this. I know this is a common misconception among a lot of individuals, and it really at times, gets on my nerves. We have one management class yes, but we also have a lot more clinical time required than other nursing degrees. Right now, I'm in my last semester and I have 24-32 hours of clinical a week and they have ranged from critical care to going along and doing medical assessments on CPS cases. A good BSN program is NOT lacking in hands on. We actually have more clinical hours than other programs. I'm not at all trying to put down people who have worked hard for their degree, but two more years is nothing to sneeze at. It is hard work. Glad to be here!
    Good for your school but, one of the top 3 nursing schools in the country is lacking in clinical rotations compared to the ADN program that is down the street from it. So your school is rare!!
  4. by   Alnamvet
    Quote from lizz
    Yes, but the study they cite in the article concerned BSNs. I read it. Isn't that the reason for this requirement?

    It seems contradictory, to say the least, to allow some other bachelor's degree, when the primary justification is a study based on BSNs.

    Not to mention, the whole argument has always been about ADN versus BSN, not ADN and some other bachelor's degree.

    I think you are, like many bsn advocates, missing my point; take a bsn and compare it to, say, a BS, or BSW. Now take away the nursing courses in the bsn, and take away the sociology courses in the BSW, and what do you have left?...the same 2 years worth of requirements...the english, the math, the social sciences, the foreign language, the sciences, ad nauseum. Now lets put these 2 degrees back together again, and you have bsn (nurse) and a BSW (Social Work). Now the BSW adds an ASN to be a nurse, and now lets compare the two...a bsn who has 2 years of nursing (like the ASN) and 2 years of pre=reqs (like the BSW), AND, the BSW has one more advantage....he has a second major in Social Work. SO, if there is any difference, the BSW with a ASN is infinitely more broadly prepared than a straight bsn. So why not any bachelors? As I stated earlier, any bachelors + an RN license is all that's needed to get into a graduate nursing program. So the requirement for nurses to ultimately get a baccalaureate is not a bad thing...what is bad is to think that only a bsn qualifies as baccalaureate degree, and that all other education, whether it be a BA, BS, MA, MS, PhD, etc, if not in nursing, is not valid, therefore disqualifying an RN for continued licensure. Who makes up these stupid rules, you ask? STUPID NURSES...that's who...you know what I say about who your enemy is......
  5. by   teeituptom
    Keep your friends close to you
    keep you enemies even closer
  6. by   orrnlori
    Quote from Alnamvet
    I think you are, like many bsn advocates, missing my point; take a bsn and compare it to, say, a BS, or BSW. Now take away the nursing courses in the bsn, and take away the sociology courses in the BSW, and what do you have left?...the same 2 years worth of requirements...the english, the math, the social sciences, the foreign language, the sciences, ad nauseum. Now lets put these 2 degrees back together again, and you have bsn (nurse) and a BSW (Social Work). Now the BSW adds an ASN to be a nurse, and now lets compare the two...a bsn who has 2 years of nursing (like the ASN) and 2 years of pre=reqs (like the BSW), AND, the BSW has one more advantage....he has a second major in Social Work. SO, if there is any difference, the BSW with a ASN is infinitely more broadly prepared than a straight bsn. So why not any bachelors? As I stated earlier, any bachelors + an RN license is all that's needed to get into a graduate nursing program. So the requirement for nurses to ultimately get a baccalaureate is not a bad thing...what is bad is to think that only a bsn qualifies as baccalaureate degree, and that all other education, whether it be a BA, BS, MA, MS, PhD, etc, if not in nursing, is not valid, therefore disqualifying an RN for continued licensure. Who makes up these stupid rules, you ask? STUPID NURSES...that's who...you know what I say about who your enemy is......
    Alnamvet: Explained beautifully. This would make perfect sense to anyone outside of nursing but folks such as the ANA are left scratching their heads in confusion because for all the critical thinking skills they espouse in the profession of nursing, they themselves are unable to get it.
  7. by   casper1
    I really don't see how taking a few more liberal art classes better prepares you for Nursing. Many of the student who went to school with me ( a two year program)
    also had 4 yr degrees in another field. Many were single mothers who were balancing
    school with work and raising a family alone. These women have already demonstrated
    their problem solving skills as evidenced by their ability to juggle so many roles sucessfully. I work in New York my facility is always short staffed I'm asked routinely to come in early of work my day off.
    By the time most students have graduated from high school they have a good liberal arts background. I think courses in Physical therapy,speech pathology and Respiratory
    theraphy would be more beneficial. If a nurse is planning to go the administrative road
    classes in accounting or business administration would be beneficial.

    If you are going to require me to have a 4 yr degree. I weant to take classes more relevant to nursing. I've been a hospital Nurse for 15 years I really don't see how more liberal arts classes would better prepare me to be a Nurse.
  8. by   nursebonkers
    Wait a minute, you think having a bachelors degree means you will be treated like a professional? How many people with those degrees are working at your local restaurants as waiters, how many are working as lawn and garden caretakers. Well all I know is that when I am wiping someones soiled behind I dont feel like a professional behind wiper; when I am pushing a stretcher I dont feel like much of a professional; when I am being screamed at by over-privileged brats and yuppie suburbanites because they want to be seen now!!! for a hangnail?! in an overcrowded ER - I dont want to be a professional - I want to tell them to sit down, shut up and wait your turn you ******. Face it! if your a nurse providing primary care in a hospital setting the public thinks you are blue collar. If you sit at a desk in administration you are percieved as white collar. Get a union !!! or Join an agency and command top dollar for now as demand is exceeding supply for your services!!
    Thats right maybe nurses should bill fee for service rendered!!!!! I am sorry I cant answer your call bell unless you've got cash!! $20 for a answering a call bell. $200 for an IV start. Calling your doctor when the S+++ hits the fan FEE FOR Critical Care Service for 30 minutes $1000. How do you like them apples!
  9. by   angel337
    Quote from nursebonkers
    Wait a minute, you think having a bachelors degree means you will be treated like a professional? How many people with those degrees are working at your local restaurants as waiters, how many are working as lawn and garden caretakers. Well all I know is that when I am wiping someones soiled behind I dont feel like a professional behind wiper; when I am pushing a stretcher I dont feel like much of a professional; when I am being screamed at by over-privileged brats and yuppie suburbanites because they want to be seen now!!! for a hangnail?! in an overcrowded ER - I dont want to be a professional - I want to tell them to sit down, shut up and wait your turn you ******. Face it! if your a nurse providing primary care in a hospital setting the public thinks you are blue collar. If you sit at a desk in administration you are percieved as white collar. Get a union !!! or Join an agency and command top dollar for now as demand is exceeding supply for your services!!
    Thats right maybe nurses should bill fee for service rendered!!!!! I am sorry I cant answer your call bell unless you've got cash!! $20 for a answering a call bell. $200 for an IV start. Calling your doctor when the S+++ hits the fan FEE FOR Critical Care Service for 30 minutes $1000. How do you like them apples!
    sounds like a plan to me!!!
  10. by   Hellllllo Nurse
    If they really want a BSN requirement, they should grandfather in anyone who is currently an ADN or diploma RN. THEN require NEW RNs to be BSNs. How can you be an RN one day, then an LPN the next? It doesn't make sense.

    Most foreign nurses are BSNs. I've heard that NY is pushing to obtain tons of foreign nurses. Maybe this is why.
  11. by   Jailhouse RN
    Mel you should be offended. I passed the same board as you and hold the same license. I have spoken to makny BSNs and looked into at least six. Yes here in NY the focus is not the bedside. It is mangaemant. I am offended at the fact I am expected to teach on the job, nursing tasks for the real world that many BSNs did not get in their programs. Yes you do your rotations, but I know for a fact the bedside aspect is not as intense as what an ASN gets. Mind you I can back up what I say. I am offended at the fact that you seem to think you have some form of superiority. My friend I will debate you on any aspect of nursing you care to come up with. Believe me I will not be underguned. Remember this, most of this job is learned after you pass the board.....
  12. by   Jailhouse RN
    Right on nursebonkers.
  13. by   texan
    FYI...nurses are the least educated health care professionals...they are also the most abundant...

    to be a hospital social worker one needs a masters degree, a physical therapist also needs a masters degree as does a speech therapist, etc.

    Something to think about...the nursing shortage comes from the lack of interest in nursing as a profession. Students look for a career with prestige and that often comes with the amount of education needed. How will nursing gain the prestige it needs to attract students if it is the least educated profession? By furthering the educational requirements the profession will progress (hopefully then we will all make more money).

    I certainly promote a required BSN though I believe those already practicing should be grandfathered.

close