BSN not all its cracked up to be

Nursing Students ADN/BSN

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JUST TO LET EVERYONE KNOW, I AM NOT KNOCKING THE BSN PREPARED NURSE. HOWEVER, I AM AN R.N., AND WHERE I AM EMPLOYED THE BSN NURSES MAKE NO MORE WAGE THAN AN ADN NURSE, WHICH I DISAGREE WITH, YOU SHOULD MAKE MORE MONEY WITH MORE EDUCATION, IT JUST MAKES SENSE. I ALSO NOTICE WHEN NURSING STUDENTS COME IN TO CLINICALS ON MY FLOOR THERE IS A HUGE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE ADN AND BSN STUDENTS. THERE ARE TWO MAJOR NURSING SCHOOLS IN MY CITY, ONE AN ADN AND ONE A BSN. THE BSN SCHOOL HAS A 66% PASS RATE ON THE NCLEX RN. THE ADN HAS A 93% PASS RATE. REASON? MOST OF THE BSN STUDENTS ARE RIGHT OUT OF HIGH SCHOOL, HAVE NO OTHER OBLIGATION THAN COLLEGE, MOMMY AND DADDY TAKE CARE OF EVERYTHING ON THE FINANCIAL FRONT, SO IF THEY FAIL IT IS NOT AS MUCH OF HIT. ON TOP OF ALL THAT THEY LEARN THE "THEORY OF NURSING", AND NOT HOW TO BE A NURSE. I SEE COUNTLESS BSN STUDENTS THAT DON'T KNOW HOW TO PLACE A BP CUFF, OR PUT A PATIENT ON A BEDPAN!! TYPICALLY ADN STUDENTS ARE OLDER, FULL TIME WORKERS, AND HAVE FAMILIES, SO A LOT MORE IS ON THE LINE. I FULLY PLAN TO GO FOR MY MSN, HOWEVER, I BELIEVE IT IS A BETTER DECISION TO GET YOUR RN FIRST, GO INTO THE FIELD, AND THEN FURTHER YOUR EDUCATION. NOTHING AGAINST YOUNG STUDENTS EITHER, FOR I WAS 23 WHEN I STARTED NURSING SCHOOL. I HAD TWO CHILDREN, PAID FOR ALL MY SCHOOLING, AND WORKED FULL TIME ON TOP OF NURSING SCHOOL. I BELIEVE NOTHING IN THE WORLD CAN STOP YOU IF YOU WANT SOMETHING BAD ENOUGH. BEST OF LUCK TO ALL IN PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS IN YOUR CAREER.:lol2:

I'd have to agree with LLG and tweety. There's no reason to compare both ADN nurses and BSN nurses it just creates problems in the nursing community, and believe me there are already too many issues in nursing to deal with already. But i'd have to agree that despite the same pay BSN nurses get with ADN nurses, they do have better opportunities than the ADN prepared nurse. I'm not sure why the pay is the same, perhaps BSN should start speaking up for their advanced education they've received.

But since the poster is adament that ADN nurses are sooo much better and want to compare, I guess we should start creating programs in community college to train doctors and pharmacists too since they spit out such "quality" students:nono:.

Yeah I didn't think so.

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Specializes in Geriatrics, Med-Surg..

I wish that here in Canada, we had a choice. The new entry to practice as an RN is a BSN. We no longer have a choice as how to become an RN. Our LPN program is now 2.5 years long and teaches many skills that the hospitals likely will not allow an LPN to use. I am considering doing a BSN in a year because it is required for any reasonable opportunities and I am concerned that I may not be able to keep up with the heavy lifting when I am in my 60's as our hospitals here in Ontario do not hire aides any longer.

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Not sure what you mean by a tech school?

Two-year colleges are also called "technical schools" because they teach technical/vocational things. In other words..."training" vs. "education" in the true sense of the words. Not dissing 2-year colleges...those are commonly accepted descriptive words for the two types of colleges. :)

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Specializes in Med-Surg, Trauma, Ortho, Neuro, Cardiac.
Two-year colleges are also called "technical schools" because they teach technical/vocational things. In other words..."training" vs. "education" in the true sense of the words. Not dissing 2-year colleges...those are commonly accepted descriptive words for the two types of colleges. :)

The school I went to was "Fayetteville Technical Community College"....how confusing is that.

I recieved an ADN from an NLN approved program. I don't really mind if one thinks I have "technical" degree or not. I'm not wrapped up in descriptive words.

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The school I went to was "Fayetteville Technical Community College"....how confusing is that.

I recieved an ADN from an NLN approved program. I don't really mind if one thinks I have "technical" degree or not. I'm not wrapped up in descriptive words.

I was answering a specific question, not making a judgement. ;) As far as actual nursing practice goes, an RN is an RN.

However, I do have to comment on your last sentence. Words mean things. They matter. :) Nurses of all people should know that. :uhoh3:

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Specializes in Telemetry/Med Surg.

Actually, the diploma grads have the highest pass rates.

https://www.ncsbn.org/1237.htm

®

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Specializes in NICU Someday, I Hope.

Perhaps I'm not qualified to render an opinion since I don't even start NS until January. However, my life experience gives me a perspective that I choose to share, anyway.

...an RN is an RN.

That's precisely the issue. To practice, you need to earn an RN which means you have a certain number of clinical contact hours, an education in the nursing scope of practice, and the ability to pass the NCLEX.

However, the license really doesn't mean squat about your education. It's just a license. It's akin to an ATP, the license held by the jet jockeys flying for the airlines. Their ATP, which is very tough to earn and keep, means that their skill and knowledge as pilots is deemed minimally acceptable for their scope of practice. Likewise, the RN license means that the holder has the minimally acceptable skills to practice the nursing scope of practice.

A college degree (AA/S, BA/S, MA/S, PhD, etc) means a certain level of competence in areas of thought outside of ones specialty. It means a minimum level of educational proficiency in communications, computational skills, and critical thinking.

A college degree also signifies a minimal level of educational proficiency in major-specific topics (the level of which is proportional to the degree level) and the opportunity to study more ancillary topics (again, the higher the degree, the more this is true).

Whether one values the education beyond that required to attain the license probably depends on their point of view.

Personally, all other things being equal, I would choose to hire people with more education rather than less in any line of work.

Certainly, university education does not make a good nurse. On the other hand, a nurse who has a baccalaureate or advanced degree, is probably more able to adapt to new situations, independently learn new subject matter, or develop an appropriate course of action in a case for which they've not been specifically trained.

I think all nurses should be encouraged to pursue as much education as they're willing. On the other hand, during those months my daughter was in the NICU, I never checked which degrees the good nurses held. I knew they were RNs, skilled in neonatal care, and I knew the ones that were good.

Offering a perspective from outside of nursing (I start my DEMSN in January), though, I do think that, in the long run, the nursing profession would benefit by having a higher educational requirement for entry.

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if you're going to work bedside, it doesn't make one iota of difference which degree you've got. heck, i've got a b.s. in accounting and an asn, and my hospital hired me as though i were a bsn. all they cared about was a bachelor's degree.

let's be honest... there are lpn's who are better nurses than most rn's. they've been doing this a long time, and there is simply no substitute for time in the saddle

... so the adn/bsn argument doesn't make any sense. no program graduates the "best nurses".

as far as nursing education and nurse manager jobs, i've reached the very end of the road in my nursing education. the last thing i want to be is a nurse manager! :devil:

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I simply don't get it.

I go to school because I'm interested in learning, not because I'm going to get more money.

Now, I an pursuing my RN but that's largely because I am not a contented subordinate, and I want more options and a broader scope of practice than an LPN in NYS proffers. But should I go on for the BSN afterwards - what could possibly be wrong with gaining more knowledge?

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Perhaps I'm not qualified to render an opinion since I don't even start NS until January. However, my life experience gives me a perspective that I choose to share, anyway.

That's precisely the issue. To practice, you need to earn an RN which means you have a certain number of clinical contact hours, an education in the nursing scope of practice, and the ability to pass the NCLEX.

However, the license really doesn't mean squat about your education. It's just a license. It's akin to an ATP, the license held by the jet jockeys flying for the airlines. Their ATP, which is very tough to earn and keep, means that their skill and knowledge as pilots is deemed minimally acceptable for their scope of practice. Likewise, the RN license means that the holder has the minimally acceptable skills to practice the nursing scope of practice.

A college degree (AA/S, BA/S, MA/S, PhD, etc) means a certain level of competence in areas of thought outside of ones specialty. It means a minimum level of educational proficiency in communications, computational skills, and critical thinking.

A college degree also signifies a minimal level of educational proficiency in major-specific topics (the level of which is proportional to the degree level) and the opportunity to study more ancillary topics (again, the higher the degree, the more this is true).

Whether one values the education beyond that required to attain the license probably depends on their point of view.

Personally, all other things being equal, I would choose to hire people with more education rather than less in any line of work.

Certainly, university education does not make a good nurse. On the other hand, a nurse who has a baccalaureate or advanced degree, is probably more able to adapt to new situations, independently learn new subject matter, or develop an appropriate course of action in a case for which they've not been specifically trained.

I think all nurses should be encouraged to pursue as much education as they're willing. On the other hand, during those months my daughter was in the NICU, I never checked which degrees the good nurses held. I knew they were RNs, skilled in neonatal care, and I knew the ones that were good.

Offering a perspective from outside of nursing (I start my DEMSN in January), though, I do think that, in the long run, the nursing profession would benefit by having a higher educational requirement for entry.

Awesome answer. Ditto everything. :D

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I think that the most important thing is that nurses of all levels of education come together and work as a team in the clinical setting! It doesn't matter how you became an RN, just that you did it and you had the skills to get through school and pass that NCLEX! There are some nursing jobs that require different levels of education of course but if those are not of interest then who cares? We all know that it is about the patients and making them feel cared for and keeping them safe anyways... As for the whole nursing school rivalry comment... I think it depends on the school. The particular BSN program from which I graduated had a 100% NCLEX pass rate and we all know how to use a bedpan!! However, there are some other BSN programs in the area which have lower pass rates... it really depends on the teachers and the group of students. There are also ADN programs with 100% pass rates... so who needs to compete? We all share the same passion to care for the sick and to help people when they need us the most!

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Specializes in Med-Surg, LTC, Rehab, HH.
Perhaps I'm not qualified to render an opinion since I don't even start NS until January. However, my life experience gives me a perspective that I choose to share, anyway.

That's precisely the issue. To practice, you need to earn an RN which means you have a certain number of clinical contact hours, an education in the nursing scope of practice, and the ability to pass the NCLEX.

However, the license really doesn't mean squat about your education. It's just a license. It's akin to an ATP, the license held by the jet jockeys flying for the airlines. Their ATP, which is very tough to earn and keep, means that their skill and knowledge as pilots is deemed minimally acceptable for their scope of practice. Likewise, the RN license means that the holder has the minimally acceptable skills to practice the nursing scope of practice.

A college degree (AA/S, BA/S, MA/S, PhD, etc) means a certain level of competence in areas of thought outside of ones specialty. It means a minimum level of educational proficiency in communications, computational skills, and critical thinking.

A college degree also signifies a minimal level of educational proficiency in major-specific topics (the level of which is proportional to the degree level) and the opportunity to study more ancillary topics (again, the higher the degree, the more this is true).

Whether one values the education beyond that required to attain the license probably depends on their point of view.

Personally, all other things being equal, I would choose to hire people with more education rather than less in any line of work.

Certainly, university education does not make a good nurse. On the other hand, a nurse who has a baccalaureate or advanced degree, is probably more able to adapt to new situations, independently learn new subject matter, or develop an appropriate course of action in a case for which they've not been specifically trained.

I think all nurses should be encouraged to pursue as much education as they're willing. On the other hand, during those months my daughter was in the NICU, I never checked which degrees the good nurses held. I knew they were RNs, skilled in neonatal care, and I knew the ones that were good.

Offering a perspective from outside of nursing (I start my DEMSN in January), though, I do think that, in the long run, the nursing profession would benefit by having a higher educational requirement for entry.

To hire someone because they have more education over someone who has more experience in a certain area is not something I would do.

I will say this, there are some people that make wonderful students, they are career students. They get wonderful grades, or maybe not so wonderful grades, but they stay in school and keep on going. Just because someone is booksmart, or financially able to continue with higher education, does not always make a better nurse. Or pilot, or accountant, or doctor.

I had a clueless clinical instructor with a masters, but the best clinical instructor was the instructor with an associates degree from the community college. So how short sighted to dismiss someone for their level of education. Thank goodness my school hired the associate nurse, the one who taught us the most.

I respect the nurses with a masters, and with the bachelors degree. I am responding to your comments.

But you in your life experience you would hire someone solely on their level of education. I would much better have a nurse that has worked for years on the floor, than a nurse who solely who was hired because of her level of education.

What a recipe for disaster and disapointment if everyone thought like you. Thats a real morale booster. Right.. Other nurses end up picking up the slack for the higher paid less productive, much more thought of(by your opinion) team player. That makes alot of sense.

Good luck in your nursing studies. It is a long road. One that you will find very educating.

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