The Circumcision Discussion

Specialties Ob/Gyn

Published

I know this can be a HUGE debate, and I'm not looking to start any arguments. I was just wondering as you are OB nurses. I'm expecting a boy in July and not sure if we should circ. or not. My husband says yes, it's better medically in the long run. My gpa who just turned 70 had to have a circ. due to endless complications lately.

As nurses in this area, is the medication that they use good? And what are some questions to ask my Dr. about it. I already know that my hospital i'll be at uses a med. when they perform it, I"m just wondering what you all think.

Thanks

Jen :)

I see what you are saying. There is some truth to the idea that it is a cultural norm, but I respectfully disagree with equating infant male circumcision with either foot-binding or labial suturing/removal.

Both of the practices you mention have subjugation of the female as a primary goal. They result in severe ongoing pain and crippling of normal function. Foot binding is a lengthy and excruciating process designed to keep girls and women hobbled and subservient. Labial suturing/removal is done without anesthesia or sterile technique (not that either of those would make it acceptable), and is meant to instill a subordinate attitude toward male domination and eliminate any possibility of female sexual pleasure.

Male circumcision is not done for the purpose of crushing the male spirit and rendering men unable to enjoy sex. It isn't meant to exercise crippling gender-based authority and domination. Some may say that it disfigures, but others would challenge that view. At any rate, it doesn't cause the extreme (and ongoing) suffering that females endure with the above-mentioned "procedures."

Yes, circumcision is a controversial practice, and it's doubtful that there will be a meeting of the minds any time soon. But putting male circumcision on the same level as foot binding or labial suturing/removal does not acknowledge the vast difference in intent or results, and it introduces an element of emotional manipulation that doesn't play fair.

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Male circumcision is not done for the purpose of crushing the male spirit and rendering men unable to enjoy sex.

Agreed...but why is it done? Nowadays I would suspect the main answer is "tradition" which, to me at least, isn't a good enough reason to undergo surgery...especially on a member.

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Specializes in NICU.

I think the onus is on the ones who want it done to explain why it is done.

There is definitely a cultural shift occurring with regards to circ. It will no longer be the norm with the cultural mixing that is occurring in this country. People in most of the developed world, aside from the US, do not practice routine infant circumcision.

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i think the onus is on the ones who want it done to explain why it is done.

what onus? why do people of either persuasion have to answer to someone outside their own family circle and their own conscience?

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Specializes in Community, OB, Nursery.

So, if I want to take a needle and pinprick my baby girl's labia, is anyone going to come to my defense at the trial that is going to inevitably ensue ? Even if it's a cultural norm? Even if my intent is only to welcome my daughter into my cultural community?

I have a friend who is a surgeon in Finland. The operation of choice in Finland for phimosis is preputiotomy. Most of the time it works. They work to preserve the foreskin, because they really believe that it has a purpose. My German friend asked me, "Why in the hell do you all do that?" My answer: Ummmm....:confused:

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The foreskin DOES have a purpose, protection, lubrication, sensation.....and the reason most people have a real problem with routine infant circ is because it is a human rights issue.....that baby boy has a RIGHT to decide what happens to HIS body....we're talking autonomy, informed consent, etc....I have seen some pretty horrible things that have happened as a RESULT of the circumcision.....and I also know men who have had ongoing/lifelong problems as a RESULT of the circ....it just sickens me that we continue to do this to our children....I will never understand why, especially when the information shows that it is unnecessary, and unwarranted....people do it because it is aesthetically pleasing...it is a cosmetic surgery plain and simple...it has little to no actual medical benefits.

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Specializes in ER.

Excellent Posts RN/Writer! I agree it should be a private family decision whatever they decide.

I could retype your entire post substituting foot binding or labial removal/suturing and it'd be as true for those in such cultures.

This line of logic is incredibly silly and could be used to justify...damn near anything. Sorry couldn't resist the temptation to fit that line in here since it is appropriate. Touche'

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Specializes in ER.
the reason most people have a real problem with routine infant circ is because it is a human rights issue.....that baby boy has a RIGHT to decide what happens to HIS body.....

So are we not to vaccinate our children because they have the RIGHT to decide what happens with THEIR bodies? I see that as no different. I have seen tragic things happen as a result of children being vaccinated. Just as tragic things can happen from not being vaccinated. Boys who are not cir'd are at a higher risk for STD's, infection, etc...yeah if they clean themselves there's not much of a risk, but who's going to go around checking their son to make sure they cleaned under their foreskin? Not I.

The US is the only country in the world that generally accepts circumcision as a medically necessary practice. Why that is I have no clue? In England they do make a slit in the foreskin at birth so that the foreskin will retract more easily and removes the chance of phimosis.

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So are we not to vaccinate our children because they have the RIGHT to decide what happens with THEIR bodies? I see that as no different. I have seen tragic things happen as a result of children being vaccinated. Just as tragic things can happen from not being vaccinated. Boys who are not cir'd are at a higher risk for STD's, infection, etc...yeah if they clean themselves there's not much of a risk, but who's going to go around checking their son to make sure they cleaned under their foreskin? Not I.

The US is the only country in the world that generally accepts circumcision as a medically necessary practice. Why that is I have no clue? In England they do make a slit in the foreskin at birth so that the foreskin will retract more easily and removes the chance of phimosis.

Vaccination and amputation are COMPLETELY DIFFERENT!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't even believe that people...especially nurses actually would say that "It is cleaner" AND ESPECIALLY "Uncirc'ed are at higher risk for STD's" that ISN'T true....that is unfounded and simply untrue, and is what is said to persuade people to circ.

As far as the "checking" you son's member....that is ridiculous!!! If you teach him properly...and it isn't hard to do...there will be no subsequent problems in the future.

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Specializes in Critical Care.
Excellent Posts RN/Writer! I agree it should be a private family decision whatever they decide.

This line of logic is incredibly silly and could be used to justify...damn near anything. Sorry couldn't resist the temptation to fit that line in here since it is appropriate. Touche'

Repetition does not an argument make. I was aiming at your platitude (paraphrasing: It may be rare, but if happens to you, your probability is 100%!).

The fact of the matter is that most people in the U.S. that support circumcision do so due to traditional cultural and/or religious norms and not for any other reason. Their support of it is equivalent to other cultures' support of practices our culture finds unsavory- be it female genital mutilation, foot binding, infant tattooing, body piercing, neck-ringing, or what have you. Our culture's support of this practice blinds most people from objectively realizing the practice is no better than the very things we deem unsavory or unethical in other cultures.

Separately, from a professional nursing standpoint, it violates the principle of patient autonomy.

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Specializes in Critical Care.

The US is the only country in the world that generally accepts circumcision as a medically necessary practice.

We're also one of three countries that refuses to standardize its measurements to SI, the other two being Burma and Liberia. The fact that the rest of the civilized world takes a different path should be a big red flag to most people.

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Separately, from a professional nursing standpoint, it violates the principle of patient autonomy.

I agree 100%, I have said this several times. Thanks!!! :yeah:

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