Anyone heard of any NP to MD programs?

Specialties NP

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A girl I go to school with said that there is a school in Missouri that has a bridge program for NPs to become MDs.

Have any of you heard of a program like this?? :confused:

Thanks!

Kitty

Hi all,

I'm new to this site but I'm also interested in becoming an MD. I am a psych NP for 2 years now and have always wanted to become an MD but as someone else stated, I have a family, etc. What im finding is that an advanced degree doesn't mean anything these days. You still need to take all of the chemistries, physics, biologies, and calculus's. If anyone is like me, i obtained my degree through the traditional nurse setting and core corriculum which means I didn't take the 2cd year or chemistry, no physics, no calculus, and the bio and micro bio I took for the nursing program are really no good in terms of preparing for the MCAT. I did apply to and got accepted at Oceana but they require alot. #1 you must find a supervising Doc and with bias towards online MD programs, how hard will that be #2 you need $6,000 up front to attend a 6 week "transitional" course at a college near you and I don't have that with all of my children in private school, etc. They offer financial aid for 1/2 the cost of the total tuition which is $100,000 but not for that 6 wek course and #3 you work at your own pace, so what does that mean? I didn't persue it, and now I don't know what to do...any suggestions???

I second David Carpenter's (core0) advice - proceed with extreme caution. The last thing you want is to spend time and money (lots of money) and end up having a "Doctor of Medicine" degree but no residency or even worse ... no medical licensure. Caveat emptor!!!!!

Medical education/training/licensure is extremely complicated and involves many hoops ... understand the system well before you jump into the pool

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Specializes in ICU, ER, HH, NICU, now FNP.

You would probably be better off applying to traditional medical schools in the U.S. in all honesty.

I know 2 of those types who went to foreign med schools and never could find a residency program here which would accept them - and the schools they went to were far more recognized than this one! Niether of them are practicing as physicians because they couldn't get licensed. Go figure. One of them works in medical device sales and will be paying back loans and his mother for the rest of his life. I don't know what the other individual is up to these days - it's been a few years since I've heard from her.

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Hi everyone,

Thanks so much for all of yall's advice. I will be persuing a traditional medical degree. I had always planned on doing so I just wanted an easier way to do it because I feel a masters degree (psychiatric and mental health nurse practitioner, practicing in an out patient clinic) should matter. But....it does not. I have to take some other core courses first to meet the med school pre req's of which I will start in September then I plan on applying to schools in Massachusetts. It;s unfortunate that there are no programs for those of us who already practice in the provider sector of healthcare. It's almost as if we are unrecognized by our peers.

Anyway, thank you all...

APRN;)

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Hi everyone,

Thanks so much for all of yall's advice. I will be persuing a traditional medical degree. I had always planned on doing so I just wanted an easier way to do it because I feel a masters degree (psychiatric and mental health nurse practitioner, practicing in an out patient clinic) should matter. But....it does not. I have to take some other core courses first to meet the med school pre req's of which I will start in September then I plan on applying to schools in Massachusetts. It;s unfortunate that there are no programs for those of us who already practice in the provider sector of healthcare. It's almost as if we are unrecognized by our peers.

Anyway, thank you all...

APRN;)

I dont understand. As a psychiatric NP, you can already do anything and everything that a psychiatrist MD does. ARe you trying to become a surgeon or what? Because unless you want to be a surgeon, med school is worthless. The only thing NPs cant do is become surgeons. Anything else they are absolutely equal to MDs.

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Specializes in ICU, ER, HH, NICU, now FNP.
I dont understand. As a psychiatric NP, you can already do anything and everything that a psychiatrist MD does. ARe you trying to become a surgeon or what? Because unless you want to be a surgeon, med school is worthless. The only thing NPs cant do is become surgeons. Anything else they are absolutely equal to MDs.

We may do a lot of the same things but we don't do EVERYTHING by any means.

In addition - I would love to have more in depth clinical trianing, a residency and more knowledge about embryology, pharmacology, anatomy, physiology, and so much more that I become more and more acutely aware every day that I could really use.

Don't get me wrong - I love being an NP and have NO desire to be an MD, but I do wish our programs were more in depth on the biology and clinical side - and less so on the philosophical and theoretical side.

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Specializes in Peds, PICU, Home health, Dialysis.
I dont understand. As a psychiatric NP, you can already do anything and everything that a psychiatrist MD does. ARe you trying to become a surgeon or what? Because unless you want to be a surgeon, med school is worthless. The only thing NPs cant do is become surgeons. Anything else they are absolutely equal to MDs.

"Absolutely equal to MD's"

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Hi,

In terms of seeing, diagnosing, and treating patients MD's and NP's are equal. However, as a background,nurses are taught to care for a patient in a holistic sort of way, we look at the entire patient, not just what is wrong for that particular visit. MD's on the other hand are taught to treat the immediate illness and move on to the next. Nurses are taught the value of therapeudic touch and I have personally only worked with a handful of physicians who even have "ok" bedside manner. Although we can both open private practice, I still must have an MD over me, as if I don't know what i'm doing and need a chaperone to be able to care for my patients effectively. Also, in terms of reimbursement, it's not 100% unless an MD signature is there (at least in Ma) We get somewhere between 70-90% without the MD sig. For me, I want to be at the top of my game so to speak and right now (again soley my opinion of myself) i'm at the bottom of the food chain relative to practitioners. In medical care there is a heirarcy it goes from the bottom to the top........CNA, medical assistant, LPN, RN, RN-specialty, RN-specialty, certified, NP/PA, MD........I personally feel that MD's are still "over me" if that makes any sense. In a hospital setting, like when I worked in telemetry as a nurse, I was typically in charge of the unit and delegated responsibilities to the other staff (CNA's, LPN's, etc). Even though i'm not in the same practice forum now, I still feel like I don't want to have to "answer" to someone who because I am an NP (sometimes) doesn't treat me like a peer because he/she is an MD, like we aren't on the same playing field. Can anyone relate?

APRN

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In terms of seeing, diagnosing, and treating patients MD's and NP's are equal. However, as a background,nurses are taught to care for a patient in a holistic sort of way, we look at the entire patient, not just what is wrong for that particular visit. MD's on the other hand are taught to treat the immediate illness and move on to the next. Nurses are taught the value of therapeudic touch and I have personally only worked with a handful of physicians who even have "ok" bedside manner. Although we can both open private practice, I still must have an MD over me, as if I don't know what i'm doing and need a chaperone to be able to care for my patients effectively. Also, in terms of reimbursement, it's not 100% unless an MD signature is there (at least in Ma) We get somewhere between 70-90% without the MD sig. For me, I want to be at the top of my game so to speak and right now (again soley my opinion of myself) i'm at the bottom of the food chain relative to practitioners. In medical care there is a heirarcy it goes from the bottom to the top........CNA, medical assistant, LPN, RN, RN-specialty, RN-specialty, certified, NP/PA, MD........I personally feel that MD's are still "over me" if that makes any sense. In a hospital setting, like when I worked in telemetry as a nurse, I was typically in charge of the unit and delegated responsibilities to the other staff (CNA's, LPN's, etc). Even though i'm not in the same practice forum now, I still feel like I don't want to have to "answer" to someone who because I am an NP (sometimes) doesn't treat me like a peer because he/she is an MD, like we aren't on the same playing field. Can anyone relate?

APRN

OUCH!

Sorry I can absolutely NOT relate!

First of all 'therapeutic touch' and having a bedside manner cannot compare to each other! I do know some nurses who have attrocious beside manners and some docs who are incredible with their patients. I have not seen enough evidence that therapeutic touch is of any more benefit to a patient than compassionate care.

As far as being 'under' a doc and 'over' a CNA or LPN I truly feel that we all have a job to do that is equally important. We all have different jobs and that no one is 'better' than I am. I do not have the same training as a physician and I do feel that it gives me a different way of looking at a patient. Bottom line is, if we all work together to improve our patients health then we are all 'equal' in that patients eyes.

Let's stop trying to catigorize ourselves along some kind of imaginary continuum and focus on our patients health.

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First of all,

My opinion is my own and I am entitled to it and whether you agree or not is of no importance to me. Secondly, bedside manner and therapeutic touch can definately be intertwined. When I see a patient and they are havind a particularly difficult time.....understanding, comforting, a reassuring voice, and the power of a hand on the shoulder can go along way, so I don't follow what your talking about

"As far as being under a Doc and over a CNA"....It's not about that, however, no matter what you do there is always a heirarchy. I don't think that i'm any better than any one else or visa versa. I want to be an MD because for me it puts me at the "top of my game" and opens doors that are closed to me as an NP no matter how idealistic you are about what goes on in the healthcare profession in terms of equality "in the patient's eyes". What about equality between practitioners? I don't know where you live or practice, but there is most certainly not "equality" amongst alot of healthcare practitioners for one reason or another.

Opening up a private practice is an option I want to pursue at the MD level mostly because of less hassel in terms of supervision and insurancr reimbursement

This conversation was never about a patient and what kind of care they receive so please don't attempt to turn it into that!

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Specializes in Education, FP, LNC, Forensics, ED, OB.

Let's stay on topic of NP to MD programs and keep the posts from becoming personal.

We can agree to disagree without making it personal for we are all professionals.

Thank you.

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Sounds good to me. In your earlier post, i felt like I was being attacked....so keeping the focus on what it should be on is wonderful

Thank you..

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Hi,

In terms of seeing, diagnosing, and treating patients MD's and NP's are equal. However, as a background,nurses are taught to care for a patient in a holistic sort of way, we look at the entire patient, not just what is wrong for that particular visit. MD's on the other hand are taught to treat the immediate illness and move on to the next. Nurses are taught the value of therapeudic touch and I have personally only worked with a handful of physicians who even have "ok" bedside manner. Although we can both open private practice, I still must have an MD over me, as if I don't know what i'm doing and need a chaperone to be able to care for my patients effectively. Also, in terms of reimbursement, it's not 100% unless an MD signature is there (at least in Ma) We get somewhere between 70-90% without the MD sig. For me, I want to be at the top of my game so to speak and right now (again soley my opinion of myself) i'm at the bottom of the food chain relative to practitioners. In medical care there is a heirarcy it goes from the bottom to the top........CNA, medical assistant, LPN, RN, RN-specialty, RN-specialty, certified, NP/PA, MD........I personally feel that MD's are still "over me" if that makes any sense. In a hospital setting, like when I worked in telemetry as a nurse, I was typically in charge of the unit and delegated responsibilities to the other staff (CNA's, LPN's, etc). Even though i'm not in the same practice forum now, I still feel like I don't want to have to "answer" to someone who because I am an NP (sometimes) doesn't treat me like a peer because he/she is an MD, like we aren't on the same playing field. Can anyone relate?

APRN

I want to weigh in with my opinion. (It is just an opinion, not an attack.) You pointed out the differences between NPs and MDs. To me, the differences in day to day practice seem trivial. You have already worked so hard for your RN and your psych NP, and that is great. Now you are going to give up 8 years of your youth and hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loans and hundreds of thousands in lost income to become an MD. For what?

You will never get those 8 years back. You will probably not even make up the income over the course of your career. When you graduate, if you choose psychiatry, your typical work day will probably not change very much. I usually support educational advancement, but this move does not seem worth it. Again, this is just an opinion. Please do not take it personally.

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