dealing with rude doctors

KARRN3 · Aug 25, 2003

I THINK THAT FORMING A COMMITTEE WITHOUT PHYSICIAN REPRESENTATION IS JUST GOING TO END UP BEING A BUNCH OF NURSES TALKING ABOUT HOW BAD THE DOCS ACT AND NOT HAVING ANY AUTHORITY TO PROMOTE CHANGE IN BEHAVIOR.IF YOU WANT CHANGE,YOU NEED A DOC,A REPRESENTATIVE FROM ADMINISTRATION AND PROBABLY SOMEONE FROM RISK MANAGEMENT. A DIFFERENT APPROACH MAY BE TO LOOK HOW YOU WOULD VIEW THIS BEHAVIOR ANYWHERE BUT THE HOSPITAL,IF YOU WOULDN'T TOLERATE IT AT HOME OR ON THE STREET THEN YOU SHOULDN'T BE TOLERATING IT AT WORK. TAKE THE DOC ASIDE WITH AT LEAST ONE WITNESS AS TO WHAT IS SAID, TELL HIM HIS BEHAVIOR IS INAPPROPRIATE AND WON'T BE TOLERATED.WE HAVE STRENGTH WHEN WE STAND TOGETHER. ALSO CONTINUE TO VARIANCE BAD BEHAVIOR BUT KEEP AN EXTRA COPY FOR YOURSELF AS THESE VARIANCES TEND TO GET LOST. GOOD LUCK.

gwenith, BSN, RN · Aug 25, 2003

Perhaps the committees will help you stand together in your own defence.

I always find the cold shoulder works well for the really rude. Best thing is to document carefully at these meetings - keep them focussed otherwise they will degenerate. Allow specifics to be mentioned but do not let it become a forum for mobbing the unpopular.

PS. Karrn - don't type in capitals it "sounds" like you are shouting.

tonchitoRN · Aug 25, 2003

you need a committee to deal with rude md's??!! sounds very childish. how about a class in assertiveness for the nurses. if that does not work how about self-defence / karate.

that md who "fell off his chair" when you spoke w/ him i assume you mean laughing. he told you to form a committe to get you off his back for a while. there are rude people everywhere. learn to deal with them in an appropriate manner. be assertive.

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Aug 25, 2003

Childish would be that an MD is that rude that a commitee needs forms to deal with this, that's bad when rudeness is that prominent for a committee to be formed. If it works then that's great. And i agree with the reports that are filed on this sort of thing, ours magically disappear somewhere between our NM's office and the Human Resources chairman.

Being assertive to an MD can land your butt in a sling. There are a lot of physicians that have this idea that lips-on-butt is the way nurses should act.

purplemania, BSN, RN · Aug 25, 2003

We made it part of the policy that NO ONE is to be rude to anyone else, including MDs who are not employed by the facility but use it for their work. Same for the Coca-cola guy and other vendors. We put it in with sexual harrassment and workplace violence. Violations are written up as "variances", like med errors, and go to the Chief of Staff and Risk Mgmt. Since it is policy, it must be enforced or the facility is subject to whatever rights the victim has regarding safe workplace. This puts backbone in the policy. Rebuttals are allowed and conferences held with key people as needed. What made it accepted was when some docs got suspended from ER or OR (seems to be where events occured most often) for a period of time. Like any other problem, once you identify it address it professionally.

HARN · Aug 25, 2003

Rude Dr.'s = rude nurses!!!! I think a cold shoulder is just . I am not talking about Dr.'s whom are not normally in this manner. However, a Dr whom consistanly puts nurses down, I agree with Tonchito "Karate"

:)

Assertivness is needed......

1 Leg Lance · Aug 25, 2003

Rudeness is one of those grey areas where preception is dominant. The most important point is that actions which are UNPROFESSIONAL should never be tolerated and should be addressed immediately, at the time, in front of whomever and to the degree necessary to maintain professionalism.

Post occurance actions often are ineffective because of time lag and policies. Never tolerate unprofessionalism from anyone in the workplace but always make sure your responses are CALM & PROFESSIONAL, the calmer you remain the more the other party looks the fool.

1 leg lance

SteelTownRN · Aug 25, 2003

Just curious, what is this committee going to be called? Interesting idea!

SmilingBluEyes · Aug 25, 2003

A committee??? REALLY????? I am finding this very humorous. Surely there is a better way than forming yet ANOTHER committee with (likely) time-wasting meetings. I think Assertiveness Workshops/training for staff would be time and money better-spent than some silly committee. Check it out. Sounds like some folks could use it.

Repat · Aug 25, 2003

Actually, I think a committee to work on an formal institutional policy concerning 'rudeness' (read, unprofessional behavior) is a good idea because it will give you formal avenues for redress if the situation warrants it. Make a policy and make it stick - it is a way to be 'professionally' assertive. And, to be honest, whenever I encounter someone inclined that way (if I am face to face with them), I find that a big smile, a 'Thank you, sir (or madam, because I think I've met a few of those, too)' generally gets my message across. Often they are aware enough to realize that I am 'taking the mickey out of them' as they say so well in Britain! If I am cut short on the telephone, I always enter in the progress notes TO: Dr 'Rude', then the unclarified or incomplete order, then an explanation of why the order is unclear (ie:telephone conversation cut short, repeated attempts to contact physician failed). They, and their colleagues who read the progress notes, soon get the idea.

RNMBA · Aug 26, 2003

Rude physicians are the medical equivalent of the playground bully. They will be rude because that behavior gives them secondary gain and is accepted by the nurses. In my experience other physicians are unlikely to defend nurses who allow the behavior.

One solution is to directly confront the rude person (nurses can be just as tactless). My favorite method is a quiet conversation away from the care area where I highlight the offensive behavior and my displeasure with that behavior. I have had such conversations with two different MD's and have good working relationships with both of them.