What do I do? (long) - page 2

I have been a charge nurse on my unit for quite a while now. There is a particular nurse who has been there for many years. She is very knowlegdeable, has very good clinical skills and interacts well... Read More

  1. by   leslie :-D
    i too, would do a 1:1 w/her, giving her fair warning and letting her know your intentions, should you witness this offense again.
    it will be her choice.
    also make sure that no other employees are guilty of this particular offense.
    if you do see others doing it, you need to keep it fair and unbiased.
    best of luck.

    leslie
  2. by   icugirl33
    Hi,

    If you are the charge nurse and someone is breaking the rules, you need to do your part and reprimand her. What should it matter that she has been a nurse at the facility since creation. I'm sure the other employees who are not following this rule are reprimanded. Set in your ways or not, times change. If you don't like the rules, then move on. It's not fair to the other employees who are following this "rule" and this old nurse is getting away with not following it. That is how management loose respect, when you allow a few to get away with something.

    I would give her a verbal warning, let her know the consequences, then whatever happens next IS HER CHOICE...
  3. by   nickola
    I agree w/RebeccaJeanRN. It seems harsh to fire a good nurse for an infraction that has been overlooked to this point. Doesn't leave much trust for you as the charge person. Maybe you'd rather have a nurse that does sloppy patient care & adheres to some rule that even you say doesn't warrant firing? Why not a warning? or probation? What is the REAL reason admin. wants her gone?? Is it attitude? morale? Some things are directly traceable to poor management. I'm guessing even you don't know the real reason, which brings up another point someone else made-- you're doing their dirty work for them. It would be helpful to know WHAT the issue is, & why admin. doesn't wish to help this good nurse in the interest of retention. As charge nurse, your staff should be able to trust you enough to keep them abreast of problems, & work towards solutions, and you should be presenting BOTH sides of the issue to admin. Furthermore, your unwillingness to be upfront w/this nurse (who by your own admission helped YOU out of a sticky situation in the past) shows that you're more worried about your a__ than fairness.
    Last edit by nickola on Oct 14, '06
  4. by   HappyNurse2005
    Why does it matter what the infracton is? She says it has nothing to do with patient care/safety?

    Maybe she's taking a nap on her break, (supposing someone is watching her patients)

    Maybe she's smoking in the breakroom

    Maybe she's stealing company band-aids

    Maybe she's on the internet at the desk chatting on myspace (but still answering her call bells)

    Does it matter? I think the point is that it's not an obvious issue, like narc stealing, leaving people in wet beds, etc that could hurt a patient.
    THe issue itself shouldn't matter to the heart of the discussion
  5. by   pyrolady
    DusktilDawn is correct - please ask management if they have spoken with the nurse involved. Have they given her proper warning (ie: verbal, 1st and 2nd notice?) and does she have a copy of the policy and procedure related to the infraction? Once these steps have been put in place if the nurse is still going against policy then yes, she needs to go. Fair warning is needed though to build a good case and not have it come back onto administration. Also the nurse may possibly be able to collect unemployment if there were not disciplinary steps followed and the infraction was not cause for immediate dismissal. Administration should be making sure THEY are following policy as well - people in glass houses should not throw stones
  6. by   smk1
    if it is a written rule in a handbook. Have a quick staff meeting reiterating the importance of following the employee guidelines and handbook. If that doesn't work send out a memo stating that it has come to managements attention that _____ is being done which is in direction violation of ______ and is a dismissable offence. Or you can quietly pull the nurse aside and let her know that what she is doing is against the rules and give her a copy of the rules and let her know that you wouldn't want to see a valued employee such as her disciplined for _____. If she doesn't correct the infraction after these very blantant reminders then I guess she really doesn't care to keep her job. The key is to let her know what is at stake.
  7. by   ChrgRN
    The rule is something similar to what Happynurse2005 suggested, but if I reveal it, it will be obvious who I am to anybody (particularly management) from my hospital who may read this. I have probably already done or said too much by starting this thread, but I needed advice from somebody.
    The rule is something that people don't pay attention to anymore. This nurse is not the only guilty person, but seems to do it the most. Management has seen this rule violated, and nothing was ever said to employees or to charge nurses about not enforcing it. Personally, I think management is after her because she does things one way and one way only.
    To my knowledge, she hasn't been warned or reprimanded, but she is aware of policy and refuses to abide by it. As Rebecca Jean suggested, the only fair thing to do might be to warn the employees (in writing) that this rule will be enforced henceforth, and anyone who refuses to abide by it may face dismissal. DusktilDawn is right on the money. They are getting me to do their dirty work. I have been in charge for about six months now and I am starting to regret it. I am not scheduled to work with her for the rest of the week. Maybe it will give me time to reevaluate. Thank you for your help. Goodnight.
  8. by   DusktilDawn
    Rebecca Jean has a point, management can't just enforce this rule and apply it to one person. Meet with management and discuss this issue, unless they are willing to discipline ALL who break this rule, they really are leaving themselves open to legal action by this individual. Put the ball in their court: they need to clarify with all staff that if this rule is broken the perpetrator will be dismissed. Chances are they are not willing to terminate all who break this rule.
  9. by   TallGirlAni
    If I caught the said nurse breaking the rule, I would give her a verbal warning letting her know that she will be written up next time. If management does not like this, then they can try to catch the said nurse in the act and write her up. Management likes when nurses write each other up because they can act without dirtying their hands. Isn't the point of management to have dirty hands? Aren't they managers so that they keep a clean house? The writing up of other nurses by their co-workers is necessary, especially in regards to patient safety and well-being. I think the management has seen a way to get others to do their jobs. If they want you to do their jobs, then you must decide if you want to do it, and how it will be handled. Just remember that you have a conscience and you must decide if the punishment fits the crime. How would you like this to be handled if the roles were reveresed? I think a verbal warning would be fair, and if the said nurse still did not comply, then your conscience would be clean, as you did above and beyond for this person. If this resulted in the said nurse losing her job, then you have to decide if this is something that you will not lose sleep over (in how you decided to handle this). I can't imagine what rule is being broken, but if others are breaking this too, then they should be punished equally as the said nurse.

    I also feel as if we are working in an atmosphere of nurses ratting on each other by writing each other up. I see that in some instances, it is dire, especially when patients are in danger. Unfortunately, on my floor, nurses are writing each other up over the smallest things. It has created an animosity of some nurses against others and the teamwork atmsophere is glum and suspect.

    There may be other covert reasons why they are targeting this nurse for this particular rule. Has the manager given the nurse a verbal or written warning? Maybe they are trying to fire her for other reasons? And if you found out that you were a pawn in getting her dismissed, you would regret it.

    Maybe you could generate a discussion with her and other nurses about how serious this policy is and how important it is to follow it to the tee. I suspect that if you do not write her up over this, management will come to you again with another thing they want you to catch her doing. And if you do write her up, you will be the first they come to when they want another person fired. Hopefully, the next one they want won't be you.....
  10. by   goats'r'us
    what about mentioning that admin are after her for breaking this rule? i would have no qualms about taking her aside and letting her know that admin are watching her, especially since she's helped you out in the past.
    let her know that you've been asked to watch her, and that you think it's fair to warn her that you will have to act if she doesn't change her habits.

    choose your actions - choose your consequences. in the end, it's up to her.

    ps, am curious as to what said rule is, but understand if you can't say
  11. by   Quickbeam
    I remember reading something in a law article once that if a violation of a rule has been accepted repeatedly, without any enforcement of the rule, that one can argue that the tacit understanding is that the rule no longer was in force.
    This is absolutely the case in my state in matters of work place discipline as well as work related injuries. I once had the opportunity to be a night charge on a brand new unit. The policy against staff sleeping was written and enforced. It was very easy to then fire people for this as we could show a paper trail of policy/enforcement. However, the day shift nurse routinely left the building for personal reasons. The day manager never wrote her up or enforced that policy. When they wanted to fire this nurse they could not on this basis because the behavior had been tolerated.
  12. by   CseMgr1
    Quote from ChrgRN
    The rule is something that people don't pay attention to anymore. This nurse is not the only guilty person, but seems to do it the most. Management has seen this rule violated, and nothing was ever said to employees or to charge nurses about not enforcing it. Personally, I think management is after her because she does things one way and one way only.
    To my knowledge, she hasn't been warned or reprimanded, but she is aware of policy and refuses to abide by it. As Rebecca Jean suggested, the only fair thing to do might be to warn the employees (in writing) that this rule will be enforced henceforth, and anyone who refuses to abide by it may face dismissal. DusktilDawn is right on the money. They are getting me to do their dirty work. I have been in charge for about six months now and I am starting to regret it. I am not scheduled to work with her for the rest of the week. Maybe it will give me time to reevaluate. Thank you for your help. Goodnight.
    You are dealing with the same problem I had when I was a Manager and for which I quit. Upper Management cannot make rules then turn around and not have them apply to everybody. If they are not going to enforce them, they don't need to be making them to begin with.
  13. by   marybethm
    You have to decide what kind of person you are. Then you know what is right for you to do.

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