Those Darn Diabetics

Difficult diabetics present some of the biggest challenges in health care today. Many docs and nurses dislike this population and view them as "problem children." What they don't realize is that patients need time to process their feelings about the diagnosis, and when they don't get that time, they can easily see the professionals as the enemy. Nurses Announcements Archive Article

Those Darn Diabetics!

Do you ever wish difficult type 2 diabetics weren't your headache? Your wish has been granted. They aren't your problem anymore.

You read that right. They are not your problem. They are your patients who have a particular problem. Such a distinction may seem fussy, but it actually represents a pivot point for changing old attitudes and responses toward people who are used to feeling like perennial problem children.

Under the established system, as soon as tests confirm the diagnosis of type 2 diabetes, we lead patients to a conveyor belt. Most hop on by themselves. If they don't, we're happy to give them a nudge (or even a shove). Members of the healthcare assembly line then outfit the patients with armloads of widgets, gadgets and instructions.

But what about the ones who don't go peaceably? You've seen them. They test once a day (if that) when the order is for four times. They don't get their prescriptions filled, or if they do, they don't take the meds. They think they're dieting when they settle for a two-scoop cone instead of a banana split. They lie, even when their HA1c levels rat them out. And some of them simply leave and don't come back for years.

We often fuss about having to respect patient autonomy, but with this crowd we're secretly thankful for such a broad and convenient excuse to hide behind. If they choose to be noncompliant, we can't very well arm wrestle them, can we?

If this stubborn bunch were a tiny percentage of all the diagnosed type 2 diabetics out there, we might have a non-amputated leg to stand on. But it's not a small group, by weight or by numbers. And even among the "good" patients, there can be serious gaps and lapses. We can throw in the towel and continue to absolve ourselves of responsibility, or we can take a look at how we as healthcare providers might be influencing--or even provoking--these less than satisfactory outcomes.

For starters, we need to change the amount of time patients are given to process such a life-changing diagnosis. Many patients will want to begin treatment immediately, and by all means, we should help them to do just that. But some will need a couple of weeks, or even a couple of months, to deal with their shock, anger, grief and resistance.

But isn't waiting dangerous?

For all but the handful who wake up in the hospital after a diabetic coma, the risk of delaying has to be measured against the drawbacks of pushing people who simply aren't ready to make momentous changes in their lives in the blink of an eye. Remember, we're talking type 2 diabetes here--a glacier rather than an avalanche. Some of these folks have been diabetic (without their knowledge) for years. Giving them enough time to become invested in their own health care could avert far lengthier periods of "noncompliance" down the road.

Assessing our patients to see if they're eager or reluctant is a crucial step in deciding what comes next. Those in the "teacher's pet" group will need little more than guidance, tools and affirmation as they follow the program laid out for them. But if treated prematurely, the heel-draggers will see guidance as imposition. Tools will feel like shackles. And there probably won't be a whole lot to affirm.

Why? Because they won't have had a chance to willingly board the good ship, "Sugar-free Lollipop."

Think about a cardiac patient who needs serious but non-emergent surgery. If we give him the diagnosis and then whisk him off to the OR a few hours later, without ever asking what he wants and without obtaining his consent, he could very well end up feeling assaulted. Should this resentment carry over into his recovery period, we can expect him to rebel every chance he gets. He'll complain about having to ambulate in the hallways, fuss about the tasteless new diet, and rail at having to take meds--some right now for the pain and others for the rest of his life. And who can blame him?

If unnecessarily rushing a patient into surgery seems absurd, why can't we see the similarities in our treatment of diabetics? We may not use the general anesthesia implied in the above scenario, but after we lay out the bad news, do we give the patient time to think about the information? Do we ask what his goals and priorities are? Do we present our resources and our knowledge as an offer with the clear recognition (both in us and in the patient) that he is free to walk out the door to seek a second opinion or even do nothing at all? Let's be honest--our sense of urgency on the patient's behalf hardly ever allows that to happen.

Speaking of second opinions, surgical patients are often encouraged (and sometimes required by insurance companies) to obtain a validating (or dissenting) assessment. Not so much with diabetes. After all, the numbers don't lie. And the treatment is pretty straightforward. So, why not skip that option and quick-march those rascally diabetics into treatment?

What do you think would happen if we went at a slightly slower pace? What if we did encourage a second opinion or at least a second appointment a month or so after the initial diagnosis so that the patient could work through the bad news and figure out what he wants? What if we sent him home with factual, non-emotional information about the systemic nature of the disease and explanations of the different treatment choices? We know that patients (and their family members) Google every ache and sniffle, so why not provide a list of trustworthy websites to help them see the big picture. We could even give him a couple of down-to-earth questionnaires to help him organize his priorities, identify areas of struggle, and zero in on where he wants to direct his energy.

When we jump the gun and bypass the patient's the need to internalize this knowledge, we communicate that we don't trust him with his own life. But if we give him solid information and offer our resources as consultants, we ditch the typical tug-of-war rope and make ourselves available to collaborate against a common foe.

If we demonstrate this much respect--nothing more than a potential surgical patient is routinely accorded--we'll appear more like allies rather than enemies to be lied to and avoided. The glucometer, the meds, the exercise and even the diet will look like ammunition to fight a disease rather than punishments from the mean medical folks.

Once we're willing to see our patients as people who need our help with their problem, they won't be our problem anymore.

But what if our approach and our judgmental attitudes are taking a bad situation and making it worse? What if we could make changes in the way we educate new diabetics that would increase their willingness to become more invested in their own health? What if we found out that our best and most well-intentioned efforts were actually contributing heavily to the negative behaviors of our patients? Shouldn't we want to know what we're doing that's such a turn-off and change it if we can? Or is it enough to say, "Oh well, you're making bad choices, so, no more care for you!"

Participating in self care is not an all-or-nothing proposition. It's a contiuum. A little is better than nothing. And a little more is better than just a little. And a little more than that is better still. Most people are not receptive to huge changes at one time. Unwilling change causes stress and a lot of unwilling change causes a lot of stress. Even the most highly motivated individuals can only take on so much at one time. If we are willing to meet people where they are and pick something that seems doable, they can build one small success on top of another.

If we hit them with the whole shebang and they become overwhelmed, what good does that do?

Meeting people where they are (in the hopes of taking them someplace better) isn't caving in or enabling. It's being willing to listen to them and earn their trust so that some good things can happen.

If you woke up with a chronic health problem tomorrow would you want to see someone who gave you a list of things to do and told you to just do it all or you'd be ineligible for further care? Or would you rather see someone who gave you information and then listened to your reactions and helped you work through your choices to find things you thought you could realistically start with and progress from there?

We might need something similar to a 12-step program for diabetics for constant encouragement. Anyone who thinks instantly adhering to a diabetic plan (diet, exercise, finger sticks, meds, etc.) is a "just do it!" proposition doesn't get it.

And hearing people suggest threatening folks with withdrawing care absolutely floors me. Maybe there's time to speak of that after we undo some of the damage we in the business have done over the years.

I agree that many times we have to work with people in getting them to accept their treatment. Not disagreeing with you there. I don't know.... Maybe this area falls more under the realm of counseling and psychology. Why do some people accept medical advice and treatment while others fight it or circumvent it?? Why are some people able to change their behaviors while some people seem to be slaves to them?? Maybe in this respect some time should be given for these types of people and this (counseling, psych issues, things like addictive personality disorders etc) could be considered as part of the treatment. Mental/emotional problems ARE one gray area in our society that really isn't covered well by insurance etc. As far as "threatening" goes, well, there are ways of presenting the facts in a matter-of-fact way without being threatening about them IMO. Something like this could actually be used to gently coax people into gradually complying - sort of like they may not be doing everything immediately but if it can be shown that at least they are trying, but they also have mental/emotional issues they are dealing with at the same time, they can at least get credit for doing what they've done so far. I don't think anyone has the intent of using non-coverage as a sort of club to hold over people's heads to threaten them with. But we live in such a "me" society here in the United States now that no one thinks of the bigger picture and how their non-compliance helps bring up the cost of healthcare for everyone. I could just ignore any and all warnings, do as I please, and then wait until my condition deteriorates so much that I am brought into the ER via ambulance, and then let the government pick up the tab for it all if I could not pay, but then that wouldn't be fair to everyone else who tries to live healthy and that pays taxes. Lots of things to consider here.

Specializes in Med Surg.

Families need time to adjust as well. You can't expect an entire familiy to make drastic changes to their lives because one member walks in the door and announces "I have diabetes and things have to change around here starting now!" Ever made an annoucement like that to YOUR family? Let me know how it worked out.

Another consideration is cost. Anybody tried to pay for test strips, insulin, or medications lately? Not everyone has insurance, medicare, or medicaid. Most insurance requires a copay, some of them are pretty stiff. How would you like for some doctor making a couple of hundred large per year to tell you that starting today, you have to cough up maybe 300 dollars a more each month and if you don't your insurance will no longer cover you?

Some people are seeing this as a black and white, do it or suffer the consequences type of issue. I for one don't see how you can expect to dictate to a person that they must make drastic changes in their lifestyle, their family's life, their finances, and expect them to be a good little robot, go forth and obey without question.

Specializes in Critical Care, Med-Surg, Psych, Geri, LTC, Tele,.

RE: "But what if our approach and our judgmental attitudes are taking a bad situation and making it worse? What if we could make changes in the way we educate new diabetics that would increase their willingness to become more invested in their own health?"

Thank you for saying this, Miranda.

I am the kind of person who "prides myself" on taking pretty good care of my health. My spouse (who I'm currently separated from) has diabetes and is "non-compliant" with regard to diet and meds. He has even been hospitalized as a result of these conditions. I've pleaded, cried, threatened, provided written literature, attended Dr. appts, left him alone, pushed the issues, and nothing has worked to get him to become compliant with the things that will fix his health. I think there are some people who are wired differently with regard to self care. I don't understand it but it is a real problem.

While I think the posters have a point about these non-compliant people being a drain, IF our goal as a society or as health care workers is to help them to get healthy, then we have to consider what Miranda said. Especially if we want to fix their health problems and not just "punish" them, which may not ever make them healthy.

These are complex issues and it was enlightening to read the various view points.

Although I understand that many Type 2s may be that way due to their own issues, this is not true for everyone.

Diabetes goes back at least 4 generations in my family. My dad kept logs and diaries for himself, and kept amazing control of his sugars. Despite his efforts, he had open heart surgery with multiple complications, and later developed neuropathy that was never controlled.

My brother took insulin but never really minded his diet. He had an accident when a heavy object fell on his foot and he needed surgery, and developed mrsa in the wound. Multiple surgeries and IV vanco regimens followed. He was never the same, and ate whatever he wanted. He died at age 59 from all of his various issues.

Now it is my turn - I am 10 years into my diabetes, was never really controlled with oral agents due to side effects, and now take injections.

I have no insurance, and everything comes down to money. I have had reactions to some of the injectables - mostly localized - and now take 70/30 and regular. Thankfully they are not too expensive. But I am obese, and insulin seems to keep me from losing weight.

So far, I have 4 stents and awful neuropathy. Neurontin is wonderful. But it is not a cure.

I challenge any of you who condemn us to stick your fingers 3-5 times a day, to inject yourself 3,4,5 times day, to have to think about every bite.

Life can be a b*tch. If you were not already depressed before you were diagnosed then depression may not be far behind. And the anti-depression meds can sometimes cause weight gain.

Specializes in Wound care & basically everything else.
[wiki]we might need something similar to a 12-step program for diabetics for constant encouragement. anyone who thinks instantly adhering to a diabetic plan (diet, exercise, finger sticks, meds, etc.) is a "just do it!" proposition doesn't get it[/wiki]

i normally don't discuss my personal life in public....here it goes. i'm a t1 diabetic. i'm a wound care nurse. i know diabetes well. i also know nurses & physician bias very well. depression is very very very common. being tired & exhausted is common. merge those too together and motivation goes out the window.

before we dismiss a pt for being non compliant perhaps we can show a bit of understanding. think about their support - perhaps there is none. i have had pts cry because i was the first caregiver ever to understand their feelings of frustration.

lastly, i'll never forget my diabetes educator who yelled at me several times because i wanted to do things different. yelled at another nurse. can you imagine how she treated her lay patients?

stop the paternalist mentality.

Specializes in ER.
So we use financial blackmail to coerce pts into doing exactly what we say, how we say, when we say, and where we say? Given the cost of healthcare that isn't giving the patient freedom of choice. Sounds more like bullying than anything else. What is wrong with giving a person who has just been given a life changing diagnosis a little time to come to grips with the situation, do a little research, maybe get a second opinion, and maybe accept things rather than expecting them to make immediate on the spot changes that not only affect thier lives but their family's as well.

Its not financial blackmail. Its having good boundaries. If you folks really want to stop being benevolent maternal figures than it is not enough to allow patients to make their own decisions, we must also stop shielding them from the consequences of them. True enlightenment does not arise out of the freedom to make informed choice without consequences. It comes from exploring both sides of that equation, including the consequences.

I am never surprised when diabetic patients tell me healthcare providers must not think its a big deal when we provide them regular diet trays in CDU or encourage or support them eating foods that are clearly not good for diabetics.

Specializes in home health.

I *am* diabetic. I would be LABELED a "non compliant". Being told what to do, and when to do it.."Dr's Orders"

as opposed to being treated as a person with education, respect and understanding has made a huge difference in MY attitude. What I hear it the "just DO it". Nothing about the intricacies of overwhelming carb cravings and how to deal with them; I hear "you have to lose weight" without the fact that I have lost 50 pounds and my weight has stabilized for about a year being taken into consideration. One size does NOT fit all. I take my meds, I do exercise. I still have 'trouble' with the carbs.

The company for which I work has initiated a "wellness plan" get money back each pay period for "compliance" with certain things -- the 1st year or two it was voluntary. it is now MANDATORY if employees wish to maintain healthcare insurance. In some ways I have a problem with this (privacy)

in others I don't-- it is the company doing this and not the government mandating. the 1st couple of years I chose not to participate-- my privacy is more important than the measly amount of "rebate". This next year I have no choice. Well I do, but that means that anything health related (such as emergency surgery which I had this year -- had NOTHING to do with diabetes) comes out of pocket completely.

As far as the threat of government not paying for healthcare-- I maintain that if the government got OUT of healthcare business completely -- monetarily and regulation wise- costs would go down. How many billions of dollars are spent in the bureaucracy of regulation enforcement? What on earth did people do before 1965 (medicaid)? What did seniors do before 1966 (medicare)?? How many physicians refuse to accept medicare patients because their business loses money?

Leave all those $$ in the hands of the people instead of taking it in taxes, and let the people be responsible for themselves.

Ooops I'm digressing (sort of)

wow I don't think I've ever been so appalled by nurses. I'm an RN diabetes educator, I was diagnosed with type 1 in my early 30's. yes as an adult, at the time I was a night shift ER nurse. My first educator told me 'oh, you're an RN you know!' but I didn't. Since then I have taken care of patients who were told here you need to start taking this pill........not you're diabetic no education, just take this pill. I went through EVERY stage of grieving and I don't have friends or family members that this disease has killed. think about it.......go to the Dr because your not feeling well and get labeled with a disease that killed your mom, is this your death sentence? Have you ever asked a patient why they are noncompliant? I took care of a young man in the ER that was constantly coming in high or low, do we take away his insurance?? I didn't even think that I asked him how he managed his diabetes. He told me if he ate alot he took alot of insulin and if he only ate a little then he only took a little. So, his dinner of steak, broccoli and a fruit got a lot of insulin with no carbs and his baked potatoe only got a little. See he was diagnosed at 2 and his parents had education it was 25 yrs old but they at least got something, he got NOTHING because his parents already had it. You every single one have a college degree, how many of your patients didn't finish high school? Are you making sure they understand what you're telling them? because most of them don't, but they nod they don't want you to think they are stupid. They respect you, even when you haven't earned it. They lie to you because they are ashamed. They can't make EVERY change at one time, and neither could you. They need our support and help, not us looking down our upturned noses at them. I currently volunteer at a free clinic ( yes volunteer, I'm not in nursing just for the money) we are currently helping patients with their diet because they cannot afford those medications. Have any of you ever priced insulin? Have any of you ever priced low carb foods? Before you call a patient noncompliant....find out why.

And I agree just as long as the rest of us do not have to continue to pay for those patients to delay care.

For example, stating, "I understand that while you may not be ready to make significant changes in your life today, please understand that of you present yourself to the emergency room with extremely elevated sugars that require treatment and perhaps admission, your care will not be covered under medicaid/medicare/your insurance plan. You will receive a significant bill instead. Furthermore, if a delay in treatment can be linked to the loss of vision or extremity pain or amputation, you will need to pay for these treatments out of pocket and before treatment because you have chosen to delay care."

Please know that I am all for patients making informed decisions. In fact as a nurse, I pride myself on reminding patients that they are active participants in their own care and have the right to have care provided in a manner consistent with their own desires but that doesn't mean there aren't any consequences to making your own decision to delay care.

what about cancer and HIV patients? and unwed mothers? while we're at it what about low income mothers? Why are you in nursing, and please don't ever be my nurse

Specializes in LTC, CPR instructor, First aid instructor..

I have a friend who has advanced diabetes. He is now wearing a pacemaker with an implanted defibrillator, and has been going to a physical therapy place for massages and other treatment on his very swollen foot and leg. He was ready to be discharged when during his last visit, a therapist noticed an ulcer growing.

I have told him time and time again that white rice, white bread, (he eats homemade white bread & milk every night before going to bed) and fried potatoes are not good for him. Now we both get "meals on wheels" that occasionally has mashed potatoes and noodles in them, but an occasional meal is alright. His favorite meal is spaghetti. He each so much white stuff, and will not listen to what I tell him. Now he says he's feeling doomed.

Specializes in psych, general, emerg, mash.

type II, i believe is weight related.

therefore if the client is addicted to sugary stuff, they suffer the consequences. If its weight related, why is it weight related.

the pancrease & illets of langerhans decided to go on holidays, why should it work. The dumb human is doing it for me

perhaps not enough reality is being shoved down their throats, OR perhaps it is, and theyCHOSE to ignore it

Its getting to the point as here in Ontario, patient heal thyself, or take care of your self scenerio is being played out. That is probably a pipe dream, or I am snorting too much white stuff. But I am seeing, as a senior RN, the evolution of stupidity. General public dont give a damn.

I pay my taxes and my benefit plan, or I am on welfare aka the govt will take of me.

parDON ME FOR my anger but i see so much of it

Specializes in HD, Homecare, Med/Surg, Infectious Disease.

You can't force patients to do anything. It's a shame to give people ultimatums: Do this now or you can't have health insurance.

I don't see my diabetic patients as problem children unless they simply don't care. Then it is a problem because it wastes my time, which is already extremely ltd. in nursing. I will educate people on foods/proper diet/lifestyle changes and try to get people to understand their disease. I will tell a new diabetic you are likely not going to change overnight. This is an adjustment, it is a process. However, I absolutely believe that for people who have been diabetic for years, who are constantly being educated, who are constantly in your nursing homes because they simply don't care or are not willing to make any changes should have a higher cost of health insurance. Should they be refused health insurance? No. But it should certainly cost them more. Because they are costing the whole system more. I feel the same way about people who smoke. On the same token, I suppose you could say this must be the case for everyone who lives an unhealthy lifestyle then. But the difference is these are things that are KNOWN to cause illness/disease/death.

I have one particular patient who is educated, still works as an accountant who has been diabetic for years. He is currently on HD. He has both legs amputated and he is missing several fingers. He has suffered some brain damage to the point where his speech is impacted. He is educated over, and over. His wife has gotten to the point where she doesn't want him home anymore because caring for him is so draining. He has MRSA, Cdiff, and VRE. He DOES NOT CARE! He is a problem child. He drains the system. He wastes my time when I'm calling the MD to get him add'l insulin, make changes to his regimen. Health insurance should cost him more. If that makes me callous, well then so be it.

I have an aunt in the same position as the above mentioned patient. Except she has Type I diabetes. She's on HD. She has to go for extra tx at dialysis every week because she is non-compliant. I heard her once say she is tired of being sick when I took her to the emergency room. My thought is, "why not make changes then"? She's blind as well. My mother said she was going to give her a kidney, I told her "ABSOLUTELY NOT!" It would be a waste of a perfectly healthy organ. She refuses to care for herself, then when I try to educate her she says, but " I do walk, I do eat better". Yet she asks me to bring her Chinese food and Almond Joys. The only physical activity she does is walk from her bedroom to the kitchen/bathroom, living room.

Do they have some level of depression? Most likely. I view many diagnoses of depression as a cop-out. It is too many people's way of not dealing with the issues of life. My issues may not be the same as the next persons, but we ALL have issues. We ALL have struggles. The only way to make it is to get back up, brush your knees off, and keep it moving.

Yes, some diabetic patients are problem children because they cause the problem of waste...Money and time. I agree with the person who mentioned the need for a study between the compliant and non-compliant patients. We need to understand why some people just won't do the necessary. When you think about people as a whole, we wonder why some become addicted to drugs after one try while others don't. The human brain is too complex to truly understand the rationale behind people's behavior. How many nurses smoke while they have pts. with trachs because of laryngeal cancer, or patients dying right before them because of lung cancer. People do what they want to do. Until people/patients decide they WANT better or WANT CHANGE then things will remain the same.

For the people who are disadvantaged, it's up to those with more to help them. But like someone else mentioned, our society is so individualistic that we think it hard to help another. It shouldn't be so. Volunteering/Community service is the rent you pay for your time on this earth -Muhammad Ali