The 'De-Skilling' Of Nursing - page 17

What should be our greatest concern for the future of nursing? We must fear the day if (or when) registered nurses (RNs) and licensed practical nurses (LPNs) will be less needed in healthcare due... Read More

  1. Visit  wooh profile page
    3
    I don't care if we're called a "profession" or not. I do care that as long as we can be easily replaced by someone with a 2 year degree, we're not going to get the respect from facility management that is demanded by someone that is less easily replaced. We're going to go without breaks, be expected to work off the clock, get worse and worse ratios, etc. as long as there's a flooding stream of people ready to replace us every 2 years.
    Rose_Queen, lindarn, and TheCommuter like this.
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  3. Visit  Pranney profile page
    2
    I have to agree 100%. I'm a hospice nurse and frequent facilities with one if any licensed nursing staff and I shutter. I realize it's a money thing but why would you put a family member, or anyone, in a place where there's staff that wouldn't even recognize an allergic reaction, hyper/hypo glycemia ...the list goes on and on... they have compassion and patients best interest at heart but when that patients well being is in your hands education, education, education
    mc3 and lindarn like this.
  4. Visit  rita359 profile page
    1
    When I first graduated we had a lot of patients who were admitted to have gallbladder xrays and ivps. At some point they figured that the patient could keep himself npo after midnight. It doesn't take too much sense to take an iv site out and apply pressure so it don't bleed. Most diabetics are educated to do their own blood sugars so I don't see why aides cannot be so educated.

    In the meantime lab results come back quickly and need to be addressed. Patients conditions are much more complex now. A lot of the patients we get would not have survived to get so sick back in the day. Just because nurses don't clean floors, draw all labs, put kcl in if fluids etc doesn't mean we don't have anything to do. A lot of the things we no longer do (mix iv fluids as an example) are more safely done now and are no longer done by nurses because of many tragic mistakes in the past.
    lindarn likes this.
  5. Visit  OCNRN63 profile page
    2
    Quote from Asystole RN
    My original statement was facetious, now you get it?
    I'm not sure what game it is you think you're playing, but I find it tiresome.
    mc3 and Susie2310 like this.
  6. Visit  TheCommuter profile page
    3
    Quote from rita359
    A lot of the things we no longer do (mix iv fluids as an example) are more safely done now and are no longer done by nurses because of many tragic mistakes in the past.
    To be totally fair, many pharmacy technicians have made mistakes while mixing medications that had tragic results. A handful of dialysis technicians have made mistakes that have led to patient demise.

    Is it really a good idea to surrender certain nursing skills to people who tend to have less training? Is this practice going to stop tragic mistakes? I think not.
    nursel56, Esme12, and lindarn like this.
  7. Visit  Esme12 profile page
    2
    Quote from The Commuter
    To be totally fair, many pharmacy technicians have made mistakes while mixing medications that had tragic results. A handful of dialysis technicians have made mistakes that have led to patient demise.

    Is it really a good idea to surrender certain nursing skills to people who tend to have less training? Is this practice going to stop tragic mistakes? I think not.
    I can't like this enough!!!!!!!
    lindarn and TheCommuter like this.
  8. Visit  eCCU profile page
    0
    Quote from TheCommuter
    To be totally fair, many pharmacy technicians have made mistakes while mixing medications that had tragic results. A handful of dialysis technicians have made mistakes that have led to patient demise.

    Is it really a good idea to surrender certain nursing skills to people who tend to have less training? Is this practice going to stop tragic mistakes? I think not.

    The only thing that pharmacy techs do in my hospital is restock pyxis and bring up meds. We have a pharmacist in the I.V room whose job is to mix medications and others who accepts orders, process them and the tech brings the meds to the nursing station or pyxis.

    Techs mixing sterile I.V drugs? ....where the heck is this?
  9. Visit  TheCommuter profile page
    0
    Quote from eCCU
    Techs mixing sterile I.V drugs? ....where the heck is this?
    Cropp was the supervising pharmacist at Rainbow Babies & Children's Hospital on Feb. 26, 2006, when a pharmacy technician prepared a chemotherapy treatment for Emily.


    The solution was 23 percent salt when the formula called for a saline base of 1 percent. Emily slipped into a coma after receiving the treatment and died on March 1.


    As supervising pharmacist, Cropp had the duty to inspect and approve all work prepared by technicians before the drugs were administered to patients.


    Cropp initially was charged with reckless homicide but agreed to plead no-contest in May to involuntary manslaughter. The State Pharmacy Board revoked his pharmacist license in April 2007.

    Former pharmacist Eric Cropp gets 6 months in jail in Emily Jerry's death from wrong chemotherapy solution | cleveland.com
  10. Visit  eCCU profile page
    0
    Quote from TheCommuter
    Cropp was the supervising pharmacist at Rainbow Babies & Children's Hospital on Feb. 26, 2006, when a pharmacy technician prepared a chemotherapy treatment for Emily.


    The solution was 23 percent salt when the formula called for a saline base of 1 percent. Emily slipped into a coma after receiving the treatment and died on March 1.


    As supervising pharmacist, Cropp had the duty to inspect and approve all work prepared by technicians before the drugs were administered to patients.


    Cropp initially was charged with reckless homicide but agreed to plead no-contest in May to involuntary manslaughter. The State Pharmacy Board revoked his pharmacist license in April 2007.

    Former pharmacist Eric Cropp gets 6 months in jail in Emily Jerry's death from wrong chemotherapy solution | cleveland.com
    I hope they got slapped with enough lawsuits to last them a long long time....that's just plain ignorance on both the pharmacist for tolerating this and the hospital for not providing enough qualified staff!
  11. Visit  VICEDRN profile page
    0
    Quote from Esme12
    I am curious......what makes you say the BSN nurse predates all other forms of nursing except the diploma nurse. What are you saying that ADN programs don't produce nurses? I am unclear......If this is true.....what you are saying is that my ASN program was a figment of my imagination.I do however agree that the academic achievement of the nurse in no way influences their clinical expertise and practice at the bedside.
    Despite the endless and ever growing pile of studies that show that when there are more Bsn nurses in a unit, the less patient t mortality there is?I honestly can't believe that there are still corners of the nursing universe that haven't accepted this as a basic fact of life.And for brandonlpn, yes, the doctors care. They read those studies and now, they want to know why all the nurses aren't bsn and how crazy it is that we accept anything less for our profession. True.
  12. Visit  netglow profile page
    0
    ...and who really about what doctors think anyway? I mean, I don't seriously. They don't have much to do with well, anything.
  13. Visit  Esme12 profile page
    3
    Quote from VICEDRN
    Despite the endless and ever growing pile of studies that show that when there are more Bsn nurses in a unit, the less patient t mortality there is?I honestly can't believe that there are still corners of the nursing universe that haven't accepted this as a basic fact of life.And for brandonlpn, yes, the doctors care. They read those studies and now, they want to know why all the nurses aren't bsn and how crazy it is that we accept anything less for our profession. True.
    I can't honestly believe that as a profession we can't seem to come to an agreement on the entry level education and that this subject is still being discussed 34 years later.

    I just happen to believe that the degree does not always make the nurse......and nursing survived before the BSN degree. I think they are dumming down the curriculum to force a point. My niece is in an accelerated BSN program right now at the college I graduated from with my ASN. Her ABSN is my ASN program....it matches what I took exactly.

    What I find beyond comprehension is That there are ADN/ASN programs out there that have been allowed to remove pathophysiology, pharmacology, ethics and legalities out of the ADN programs by the governing bodies stating that is for "higher education" is trying to sabotage the profession as a whole.

    At one point the only difference between the BSN/ADN programs we the required electives. I find now that the curriculum has been down graded in favor of "higher" education. It remains that all nurses that pass NCLEX are all RN in the eyes of the law and the ADN must have some resemblance to the superior BSN education to enable all to pass the same exam.

    There are corners of the nursing universe that don't necessarily have access to all of these "superior BSN grads" and actually do very well.

    The studies that "prove" that the BSN makes for better outcomes are performed by the very individuals that are promoting their own agenda.....which for me negates their impact/validity in favor of promoting their own propaganda.

    However......I do believe for the health of the profession there needs to be a singular entry level education for this constant discussion about one's superiority is old.
    Wise Woman RN, nursel56, and tnmarie like this.
  14. Visit  dudette10 profile page
    2
    Quote from eCCU
    I hope they got slapped with enough lawsuits to last them a long long time....that's just plain ignorance on both the pharmacist for tolerating this and the hospital for not providing enough qualified staff!
    According to the law, however, they did have qualified staff.

    Have you ever watched behind the desk at your local pharmacy? The techs pull the scripts out of the bins, fill them, then the pharmacist rechecks them. I've watched the pharmacist open the bottle, look at the pills, look at the script, then sign off. I've even caught an error at my local pharmacy for a refill. The pills looked different than what I received before, although the label was correct. Ends up that the tech and the pharmacist both missed the error. Still not sure what was in the bottle.

    When I've had to pick up a med from pharmacy, I've watched the same process. Tech gets the order, gets the med, labels it, takes it over to the pharmacist, and he/she signs off on the label. I've caught two pharmacy errors in the past week. One was an order for an oral med, and they sent up an IV med. The other was the wrong solution for the med in an IVPB. The order called for D5W, but they mixed it with 0.45%.

    Always check your labels!
    tnmarie and turnforthenurseRN like this.


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