resignation dilemma - page 2

I will try to keep this brief. I am in the midst of battling some personal (marital) problems that, quite frankly, my current job and shift (nights) have only seemed to exacerbate. I will not... Read More

  1. by   serinamour
    I too live in an "at will state" I recently resigned my position as a charge nurse. I told my manager in writing , that I gave two weeks notice, but I also told her If I could quit tomorrow, I would. She called me the next day and asked me If I wanted to make my last day that day. I then called my HR department and spoke with the director, she told me yes, to stay rehireable, for a good work reference, I had to give two weeks notice, but I didnt have to fulfill that two weeks. So I quit, And I am rehireable. This is a large hospital. And I worked there for over 5 years. It was a terrible place to work. So I agree with the others, Go to your HR dept. and get the policies, and procedures first. Ask HR people. An "at will state," in the application when they hire you states," either party can terminate employment without reason or notice. " So legally you dont have to give two weeks. And neither do they.. stop listening to managers, she should know better than to threaten, but desperate times call for desperate measures I guess. She needs wrote up. I used to be a manager, so I do know some of the tricks. Dont worry, its up to HR if you ae rehireable or not, not the manager. Good luck to you,
  2. by   mtnmom
    the email I got with this information was cc'd to the VP of Nursing, and There are only 2 people in the HR dept, neither of which are nice at all.

    here is the text of what I was sent:
    "The thirty days notice is hospital policy not mine. If you do not fulfill this you will waive your PDO's and will not be eligible for rehire. Please keep in mind that you have approximately 60 hours of PDO's that you will loose if you do not work the proper notice as per hospital policy.
    I do understand that your family is important. Coverage for the 30 day period is also important to patient care. RN's are held to the 30 day notice due to our level of professionalism.
    I do appreciate your home issues but I must follow the hospital policy as far as your PDO's and eligibility for rehire. "

    Maybe I should try and talk to an attorney and find out if I have any rights...in my state workers seem to have very few rights.
  3. by   live4today
    Quote from mtnmom
    .................................................. ...................

    Maybe I should try and talk to an attorney and find out if I have any rights...in my state workers seem to have very few rights.
    See an attorney regarding this matter. Go by what the attorney says. If you cannot afford to hire an attorney, legal services or paralegals in your area who are familiar with "employment laws" will help interpret it for you.

    I am so sorry you are going through this. Remember: You only have ONE family. To them you are EVERYTHING...........to an employer: you are just a warm body among many. Their attitude towards you proves it. Leave when you need to leave for the sanity of your homelife. If your marriage can be saved by leaving and putting in more time with the family, then leave. Blood is blood. Honor that.
  4. by   LPN1974
    Sorry....I didn't catch the last post where she emailed you.
    {Edited mine out}

    I worked for a local well known company at a NH for 2 years.
    When I got ready to quit I had to give a month's notice. I worked it out, but I was exhausted by the time it ended.
    I didn't have a family at home tho. Just me and the dog.
    Last edit by LPN1974 on Nov 9, '05
  5. by   Bipley
    Quote from Daytonite
    Give them their Dec. 2nd resignation date and then call in sick every day until Dec. 2nd.
    BAD BAD BAD!!! Bad move! Then they actually have just cause not to rehire AND give a crappy reference.

    If you don't have a contract stating you will give more than two weeks, you are being manipulated. Don't pay attention to them, give your two weeks and WORK your two weeks, give it your best and move on.
  6. by   moonchild20002000
    In a right to work state neither you or your employer are required to give notice.
    If you had to resign due to serious medical problems most likely you would not give 30 days notice.You would leave ASAP due to the problems.
    I really don't see a difference in this situation with your family.
    I would ask for a written copy of hospital policy that states you will loose your time if you don't give 30 days notice then talk with an attorney.
  7. by   mistoff
    It sounds like you gave more than appropriate notice and explaination for your decision. You are not obligated to give them more than the 2 weeks notice and it sounds like the manager is trying to make you feel guilty. You should stand by your resignation letter and contact the HR department as this is creating a hostile work enviornment and if your work record is fine in the department, stating that you would be a no rehire is a threat.

    Jen
  8. by   vanrn
    Would another two weeks make that much difference? It sounds as if you're already on poor terms with your manager and are unlikely to get a good reference from him/her no matter how long you work prior to resignation, so why care? I feel you should care because it is with your present coworkers you don't want to burn bridges. Any one of them might well be in a position someday to hire/influence hiring/promote you-they will certainly look upon you poorly if you leave them to cover extra shifts over the holidays. They will remember forever if they are forced to change their holiday plans to cover a staff shortage; I doubt your manager will be the one to pick up your shifts. Certainly I sympathize with your situation but the larger picture should also be viewed objectively before deciding your best interests.
  9. by   Katillac
    some major points here:
    1) an employer in an at-will state can legally choose to hire, fire, and re-hire or not for whatever reason they choose unless the action is discriminatory against a protected minority. they don’t legally have to be nice to you, treat you like an adult or even treat you ethically.
    2) an employer is obliged to provide at termination whatever benefits it has agreed to provide, no more and no less. there is no law that says they must give you your pdos at all unless they have agreed to do that. but the employee handbook or manual is the “contract” that sets all that out. it’s really important that you find a copy of that somehow, from a fellow employee or whomever. but it should be available from hr, and not as a favor to you from a nice person but as a tool for you to use in order to make decisions. but you can't "make" them give you a copy.

    a hospital that i worked for had a policy that you had to work every scheduled day of your two week notice in order to collect your vacation time when you left. that’s legal. my nm tried to tell me that i had to work an extra day’s notice for each of the sick days that i had taken in that year, but that wasn’t in the manual, so if they had tried to stick to that i would have had a good shot at tem in any legal action against them. see the difference? it all hinges on what written (or verbal with compelling proof) agreement you have with them.

    3) most employers these days will only confirm dates of employment because too many have been sued when a bad reference has cost an employee a new job with a different employer. that makes the chances that you will be effectively blackballed in any organization but this one very slim.
    4) getting a lawyer is going to very quickly eat up the $1200 to $1500 that you stand to lose here.


    as to her email to you, it’s a mix of manipulation and doubletalk. she’s hiding behind “hospital policy” in trying to strongarm you into staying so her staffing is easier. then she tries to equate your needing to care for your family with your needing to stay and provide coverage for patients. that’s like management who, while refusing to negotiate with the union, pulls on the heartstrings of the nurses by saying, “but what about the paaaaaatients?” should a strike be called. providing staff to give appropriate patient care is management’s (her) problem, not yours. funny, isn’t it, when they want you to stay you’re a professional who owes them thirty days, but were they to fire you do you think they’d give you the severance package they’d give one of the docs? i doubt it.

    and just for the record. . .

    “for better or for worse, i am one of those people who believes in telling the truth.”

    if you say, “i am quitting because i have problems at home,” you have told the truth. but, “i regret to inform you that after ( date ) i will no longer be available for employment at st x’s hospital,” is the truth, too. as a person who deals with this stuff all of the time, i can say that the effort that people put into exactly how a resignation letter is written is usually wasted. but saying more than you need to isn’t a good idea, either.

    as far as staying the extra time so your co-workers won't carry grudges. . . if one of them allows the nm to mandate them on a holiday they had originally been scheduled off for and blames you for it, i'm not sure you'd want to work for them or be recommended by them. you're not requesting time off, you're resigning for heaven's sake. you don't need to do so in a time frame that's convenient for your nm or your co-workers.

    good luck with this.
  10. by   mtnmom
    Quote from vanrn
    Would another two weeks make that much difference? It sounds as if you're already on poor terms with your manager and are unlikely to get a good reference from him/her no matter how long you work prior to resignation, so why care? I feel you should care because it is with your present coworkers you don't want to burn bridges. Any one of them might well be in a position someday to hire/influence hiring/promote you-they will certainly look upon you poorly if you leave them to cover extra shifts over the holidays. They will remember forever if they are forced to change their holiday plans to cover a staff shortage; I doubt your manager will be the one to pick up your shifts. Certainly I sympathize with your situation but the larger picture should also be viewed objectively before deciding your best interests.
    For the record, I just got a great review and excepting this situation, am not on poor terms with my manager. She is getting ready to download a baby in 2wks and right now does not have the time nor care to deal with anything.

    For instance, We were supposed to all get "across the board raises" that were announced about 2 months ago - I never got one and when I asked her about it, first she said it would come after my review, then she was going to "look into it" but never has.

    You know, I am really sorry that I cannot schedule my personal problems to coincide with when it is convenient for staffing.

    And yes, in my situation 2 more weeks is a lot. I am scheduled 4 nights in a row on thanksgiving weekend through early week...had already pleaded with my manager please not to do that to me because I do not sleep well during the day and by that 4th night I am really worried about my ability to provide good patient care. Plus I had planned to go and visit my grandmother for thanksgiving that I have not been able to see since April...because I have not been able to get a reasonable block of time off. That is why I have so many accumulated pdo's that they now do not want to pay me for.

    sorry to keep ranting here but it feels good to beat the h*** out of this keyboard.
  11. by   NRSKarenRN
    I hired an RN who started Nov 1st. Came into my office and immediately resigned on the spot Nov 7th--worked 4 days. Won't make the person "no hire" cause I understood their childcare arrangements fell through. Family comes first.

    I'm stuck without a FT staff RN till we get a chance to advertise and hire--takes minimum of 6 weeks so don't anticipate new hire till after Jan 1. This is part of real life that managers have to learn to accept: staff leave due to issues in their life, nothing to due with managers staffing needs.

    Facility policy and procedure books are most important thing for staff to READ. I now get my new staff to read and sign off that they've reviewed and understood content so no surprises.

    HR/Manager has the right to list a staff person as "no hire" due to insufficient notice given if less time than facility dictated in policy and not payout PTO due you. Our health system now has P+P online. Does yours? I'd check out date this policy came into affect, where you notified of change? That is only leg you have to stand on to challenge this policy.

    You stated that you requested a change in work schedule, your hours were cut so you obtained an agency position. This is a RED FLAG in many HR minds that you are not dedicated to that facility and only want to leave as you got better deal elsewhere.

    Make sure your spouse understands that by your leaving without 4 week notice, your losing pay through no fault of your own. If family needs dictate your leaving, then do so with clear conscious.

    Allnurses is great place to vent.
    Feel free to pound away on your keyboard anytime---just make sure your beverage of choice is a distance away so you don't fry keyboard.
    (Unless you have an understanding spouse like mine who bought a plastic cover since I veg out while at keyboard whenever home)

    Best wishes for a better future.
  12. by   mtnmom
    You stated that you requested a change in work schedule, your hours were cut so you obtained an agency position. This is a RED FLAG in many HR minds that you are not dedicated to that facility and only want to leave as you got better deal elsewhere.

    The reason that I requested a change in work schedule was that when I was hired I told them up front that I was in an FNP program part-time and needed to accomodate my one-day a week class schedule - I had recently been placed on a schedule that required me to work all night, p-a, the night before class. (school is an hour away) After a couple times almost falling asleep at the wheel and then missing a class I asked that something be done - by this time it was too late in the semester to drop. The response I got was to cut my hours by 1/3-1/2 because "I dont have anywhere else in the schedule to put you". I only have scheduled 2 days for agency, was cancelled one and sent home after 6h the other. I only did that to make up the hours I was stripped of. The rest has come from savings.
    I feel like because I was up front before hire with my school plans and the need for flexibility, that should not be a surprise to them.


    Make sure your spouse understands that by your leaving without 4 week notice, your losing pay through no fault of your own. If family needs dictate your leaving, then do so with clear conscious.

    Oh, he wants me to finish the notice and get the pay. He is a controlling alcoholic that complains about my schedule but complains also about the hours I have lost. My whole objective right now is to be able to be around my kids more....and time is of the essence. 2 weeks ago my 15-yr old daughter told me that she "did not want to marry anyone like dad" and "he is not a good dad". Every day to me is important right now ... thats why I feel that the sooner I get on a more stable schedule and am able to be with the kids more at night/weekends, the better for both kids. Plus I dont know at what point I might have to throw in the towel on hubby...there are good days and horrible ones. Right now with the schedule I have I am trapped and could not make a domestic adjustment even if I had to.

    I guess I sound like a real whiner, huh?
  13. by   gypsyatheart
    mtnmom....No you are not whining. You are frustrated and this is a safe avenue to "vent". I totally understand what you are going through.
    Stick to your guns....leave your job as planned...in 2 wks.
    You already have a job, you are pursuing an advancement in your career....ask yourself, "am I ever going to want to work for this facility again?". My bet is the answer is "no"! Don't worry about being blackballed. That mgr is blowing smoke up your *$$! I'm sure a call to the head of HR, friendly person or no, mentioning you are planning on consulting with a lawyer regarding this matter....they will shut up real quick.
    Ultimately....you have to be prepared, what is the worst that can happen...you leave in 2 wks, start your new job, spend precious time w/your kiddos and lose the paid time off. I could live w/that.
    Don't ever let anyone tell you what you are going to do w/your life or allow yourself to be intimidated into something out of fear.
    This is precious time w/your children....crummy hospitals, managers, facilities are all over the place. You only have one family.... Stand up to the hag and leave as planned.

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