Never placed an IV!!!!!

Nurses General Nursing

Published

I'm not sure what to do and this sounds ridiculous! I just started a new position and realized I have never placed an IV and I have never stuck anyone for blood - my last job had IV team and phlebotomy. Does anyone have any advice how to learn very quickly!! I looked at community colleges but they only offer courses that last weeks...I need to learn asap! Thanks for any advice you have to offer.

Specializes in Acute Mental Health.

We were not allowed to come in and announce to the pt that we needed to start an IV. The pt was always aware that we were students and had the choice to refuse if they wanted. I even threw my name out to the other nurses who had no students, but it was a slow time and I totally understand the couple that needed them refused students attempts. It's hard enough to be a pt and then to have to be stuck more than once would be uncomfortable. Our rule was 2 times to try and you were done. I didn't get that chance in med surg, but landed a few during my 8 hrs in ER. It's been like 3 yrs so if you don't use it you lose it (or at least I do). I would venture a guess I could do well if I took a position that had the nurse do them if given the opportunity to practice a bit.

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I did go to an excellent school at a large teaching university hospital. We had an indigent ward, where whenever someone died, nursing students and medical students lined up to place NG tubes, foleys, and any other invasive procedure we lacked skill on. Respect for the dead lost out on the need to train future health care providers.

I'm sure I sound just awful and bitter to you, but I'm genuinely concerned about the quality of nursing that will be available when my family members are ill.

This may be one of the most horrifying things I've ever read on this site. Give me a novice nurse who has taken an ethics class with no phlebotomy/IV skills to poke at my arm any day rather than one who practices on dead "indigent" people (i.e., homeless or the most vulnerable among us who likely do not have people to speak on their behalf).

Wow.

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Wow! Really Lori? I can't imagine going through school and not doing IVs or phlebotomy on anyone. Why did you not learn this in school???

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This may be one of the most horrifying things I've ever read on this site. Give me a novice nurse who has taken an ethics class with no phlebotomy/IV skills to poke at my arm any day rather than one who practices on dead "indigent" people (i.e., homeless or the most vulnerable among us who likely do not have people to speak on their behalf).

Wow.

I'm sorry that offended you. It is one of the top colleges and medical centers in the nation. And it was not just the nurses, but the medical students who did this...routinely. I'd assume that there are many aspects of medicine that would shock you then.

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I'm sorry that offended you. It is one of the top colleges and medical centers in the nation. And it was not just the nurses, but the medical students who did this...routinely. I'd assume that there are many aspects of medicine that would shock you then.

I guess because medical students did this too that it's alright then? Let me ask you this as I see from another post that you have been a nurse for a number of years--does this medical center continue to harvest from the deceased indigent population for student experimentation?

And no, nothing about medicine shocks me. Humanity shocks me sometimes. How people treat other human beings can be shocking. The fact that someone in 2012 can recall practicing nursing skills on dead homeless people and not think "oh my god, I can't believe our society ever found this acceptable" is really messed up.

This is an excellent example of why schools SHOULD favor a little more time in the classroom, and a bit more emphasis on ethics and history. Skills come with practice and excellent on the job mentoring. Distinguishing right from wrong when you are confronted with a practice that seems acceptable simply because "everyone does it" is much more nuanced, and something we all should be striving for.

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I guess because medical students did this too that it's alright then? Let me ask you this as I see from another post that you have been a nurse for a number of years--does this medical center continue to harvest from the deceased indigent population for student experimentation?

And no, nothing about medicine shocks me. Humanity shocks me sometimes. How people treat other human beings can be shocking. The fact that someone in 2012 can recall practicing nursing skills on dead homeless people and not think "oh my god, I can't believe our society ever found this acceptable" is really messed up.

This is an excellent example of why schools SHOULD favor a little more time in the classroom, and a bit more emphasis on ethics and history. Skills come with practice and excellent on the job mentoring. Distinguishing right from wrong when you are confronted with a practice that seems acceptable simply because "everyone does it" is much more nuanced, and something we all should be striving for.

Kanzi,

Asking me if I think because medical students did it as well, does that justify it?, assumes that I feel the practice is wrong. I do not. And ethics professors do not teach you which ethics to have, but how to understand ethics. Yours are different than mine. For instance, I am fine with animal testing (under humane conditions) and I wear real fur.

I don't care if you hate me for my ethics....I'm not here to defend them. I feel when the body is dead, there is nothing left. Treat live people with dignity, but in the same way that a corpse can provide many items to benefit others through transplantation, that body can also provide students with valuable learning opportunities. Do you feel that if a person was homeless, and had no one to sign the papers, that they should not be able to donate organs for transplantation? Whats the difference?

To your other question, I'm not sure if the practice is still in place, as I have been out of school 20 years and I don't follow the university's daily activities. There are many things which were done "back then" and before which are not acceptable now, such as electric shock treatments used on anyone who was "too emotional". (which for the record, I do not find acceptable)

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Specializes in ICU.
This may be one of the most horrifying things I've ever read on this site. Give me a novice nurse who has taken an ethics class with no phlebotomy/IV skills to poke at my arm any day rather than one who practices on dead "indigent" people (i.e., homeless or the most vulnerable among us who likely do not have people to speak on their behalf).

Wow.

I completely agree. I cannot even believe that this is legal.

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Specializes in Trauma, ER, ICU, CCU, PACU, GI, Cardiology, OR.
i never inserted any type of iv while in nursing school.

i now am an infusion/picc nurses with a va-bc

thank you for stepping up to the plate on this subject, and admitting that you weren't exposed to this practice during your nursing program. as i reinstate my point this doesn't come as a surprise to me. having said that, there are some nursing programs that go through the theory of the procedure, and maybe have the nursing student start an iv or blood drawn on a particular pt. one time. however, it takes practice, practice, practice....just saying :cool:

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kanzi,

asking me if i think because medical students did it as well, does that justify it?, assumes that i feel the practice is wrong. i do not. and ethics professors do not teach you which ethics to have, but how to understand ethics. yours are different than mine. for instance, i am fine with animal testing (under humane conditions) and i wear real fur.

i don't care if you hate me for my ethics....i'm not here to defend them. i feel when the body is dead, there is nothing left. treat live people with dignity, but in the same way that a corpse can provide many items to benefit others through transplantation, that body can also provide students with valuable learning opportunities. do you feel that if a person was homeless, and had no one to sign the papers, that they should not be able to donate organs for transplantation? whats the difference?

to your other question, i'm not sure if the practice is still in place, as i have been out of school 20 years and i don't follow the university's daily activities. there are many things which were done "back then" and before which are not acceptable now, such as electric shock treatments used on anyone who was "too emotional". (which for the record, i do not find acceptable)

i don't have a problem with cadaver or organ donation. i really strongly support both as they serve to educate medical professionals and save lives. i do have a problem with the fact that your hospital specifically took bodies from the indigent ward for you all to practice on. why not practice on the people that did have someone to speak for them and agree to it.

and i'm laughing out loud at this: "do you feel that if a person was homeless, and had no one to sign the papers, that they should not be able to donate organs for transplantation?"

i'm laughing because you seemed to practice only on the people who didn't have the opportunity to sign papers. and--you weren't harvesting organs to save lives. you were placing catheters and starting ivs.

i am an organ donor. i also would donate my body for medical research/surgical research. i would also agree to students practicing life-saving measures on my body such as endotracheal intubation. i would never consent for my body to be taken to practice nursing skills that can easily be learned on the job and that aren't highly risky.

would you allow nursing students to do this to your mother? your husband? child? yourself? no one in your family has any more right to dignity in death than any other person, even if you feel that your loved ones have led worthier lives.

and on another note, how on earth can say that you only support "humane conditions" for animal testing, and yet you wear real fur? you are truly experiencing some cognitive dissonance there.

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i don't have a problem with cadaver or organ donation. i really strongly support both as they serve to educate medical professionals and save lives. i do have a problem with the fact that your hospital specifically took bodies from the indigent ward for you all to practice on. why not practice on the people that did have someone to speak for them and agree to it.

and i'm laughing out loud at this: "do you feel that if a person was homeless, and had no one to sign the papers, that they should not be able to donate organs for transplantation?"

i'm laughing because you seemed to practice only on the people who didn't have the opportunity to sign papers. and--you weren't harvesting organs to save lives. you were placing catheters and starting ivs.

i am an organ donor. i also would donate my body for medical research/surgical research. i would also agree to students practicing life-saving measures on my body such as endotracheal intubation. i would never consent for my body to be taken to practice nursing skills that can easily be learned on the job and that aren't highly risky.

would you allow nursing students to do this to your mother? your husband? child? yourself? no one in your family has any more right to dignity in death than any other person, even if you feel that your loved ones have led worthier lives.

and on another note, how on earth can say that you only support "humane conditions" for animal testing, and yet you wear real fur? you are truly experiencing some cognitive dissonance there.

i think you need a soapbox and a protest sign....but let's look at what you are saying.

for all i know, maybe they did obtain consents. do you think they would refuse medical tx because they didn't want anyone messing with their cadaver should they die? apparently you want to attach a class struggle to it.

as for would i allow this to happen to a family member of mine? once the person is dead, why does it matter? this is my personal and spiritual belief, and who are you to question it? apparently you also missed the class on multicultural awareness and acceptance.

what do you think happens to the homeless and unclaimed bodies?

"each state demands that any unclaimed bodies need to be first offered to medical schools and other organizations that uses human remains for scientific study."

what happens if you die & no one claims your body? | ehow.com

a story about medical students experience with cadavers. note that they mention most bodies are donated and the family wants it back later for burial, but there are many that have no family member attached to it that go to a mass grave after the medical school is done using it. no one signed for those.

medical students learn from cadavers - usatoday.com

here is an interesting old article about the criminal side of obtaining body parts:

ucla's cadaver scandal and trade in human organs

not as relevant but an interesting old story that a movie was made from.

you are awfully indignant thinking there is a difference between harvesting organs or educational practice. both these things are critically important and schools turn out many a brilliant doctor/nurse who in turn saves countless lives because of the skill learned there.

and lastly, what does humane conditions for testing, have to do with wearing fur? those are 2 unrelated concepts. use caution when using phrases like "cognitive dissonance" when you don't truly understand them.

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Specializes in PDN; Burn; Phone triage.
hmm...i've not seen an IV placed above the elbow.

Damn, you've never seen a boob IV?

/fat chicks with thin arm veins tend to have great boob veins

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