Intimidated Nurse, Informed Patient, and WebMD - page 2

Just writing to see if anyone else has experienced anything like I did the other night. Had a patient admitted from the ED. Fifteen family members (I kid you not), followed her to our floor and... Read More

  1. by   JeneraterRN
    Here's my annoying situation with WebMD:

    http://allnurses.com/general-nursing...ic-561631.html

    What a crappy situation that they put you into! This desperate ploy for attention has to be incredibly annoying. Good luck in the future.
    Last edit by JeneraterRN on Aug 17, '11 : Reason: Forgot something
  2. by   Anna Flaxis
    Ah, yes, a "Basker".

    Sometimes, when I feel sorry for a patient because of the crappy behavior of their offspring, I have to catch myself and remember that they learned it from somewhere....

    Even if the patient is condoning or requesting that 15 zillion family members be present, you still need to take control of the room and set limits. My facility doesn't have a hard and fast rule about the number of visitors either, but I have no problem implementing a two at a time policy if the situation warrants.
  3. by   sameyjaney
    Are you sure this wasn't my family?? If I had a dime for every time my aunt told me, "Well I looked it up online and I know I have (insert: bizarre uncommon diagnosis), so I am going to treat myself with (insert: random homeopathic therapies that "anyone" can do at home).
  4. by   Thomas RN
    [font="microsoft sans serif"] i agree with one nurse that says that the "intimidated nurse" needs to have established control over the situation and gone from there. the first thing i would have done in that situation would have been to call the nursing or "house supervisor" that person should be experienced in dealing with most situations. first of all get the attention of someone that appears to be giving the most direction. which of you signed the admission forms for your mother or who assisted your mother in helping her during the admitting paperwork. which of the family members will most directly involved in her care while she is here? who will be speaking for your family as a whole? by now there is always one person that seems to be doing all of the talking. ask that person to step outside the room. be calm but firm; "the number of people in your mother's room is keeping us from doing what we must do for her. this is an unsafe situation. we need to move around the room quickly and do some very critical things that are necessary to save her life. i am sure that you understand how a distraction could result in something being omitted. until the room is cleared out we can do nothing more . get the nursing 'supervisor involved immediately.
  5. by   ChicagoICUNurse
    @rnccf2007 you did the right thing. don't argue or indulge ignorant people. they'll alway beat you with experience
  6. by   netglow
    Quote from ~*Stargazer*~
    Sometimes, when I feel sorry for a patient because of the crappy behavior of their offspring, I have to catch myself and remember that they learned it from somewhere....

    OMG this! I used to feel sorry too for especially elderly patients with rude and irritating adult children. But on one specific occasion it did dawn on me clear as a bell that many times they did learn it from that tricky, gaming, selfish little old lady or man in the bed. Since then, I don't look at the elderly patients as "angels" like I used to. Some are quite horrible and more than have all their faculties in place and are masters of their "art" turning it on or off depending on who is in the room. They just are now old, and horrible and have probably been horrible all their lives. Man can they get away with stuff now that they are old and society puts that "angel" label on them at first sight. YIKES.

    Big lesson for me. Now I expect the elderly to behave just as anybody else. Sans any pathology that might be just cause for poor behavior.
  7. by   trytounderstand
    As a family member who may have been viewed as being in the way I feel that I need to weigh in on this. Recently, I saw a family member totally stripped of their dignity by icu nurses for no medical reason. If I had been in the room when it all started I may have been able to help my family member. I will never forget how this person was treated nor will I forgive the nurses who gathered around like a gaggle of geese insisting that their way was the right way and did not call a doctor when it was requested. Although the patient has recovered, that experience has left a bad taste in my mouth and has ruined my opinion of caregivers, that at one time I had respected as being called to their profession. I will be more watchful from now on and will have the patient advocate phone number in my contacts at all time. Or I will use the web to research and find it for whatever hospital I am in and I will report transgressions for other patients as well. There will be no turning of my head when I see a patient's dignity being infringed upon by anyone.

    On the other hand having a roomful of people is not necessary and they need to have respect for the professional caregivers. But the professional caregivers need to have respect for their patients and take care not to strip them of their dignity and to not intimidate just to get their way or out of spite because a fellow employee has them out of sorts. By intimidating a patient, unless they are out of control and a danger to themselves or others, you are no longer their advocate.

    As far as doing research on WbMed, I have a right to do research and ask knowledgeable questions that may help in my care. If I had not done my own research, I would not have known that I was having dangerous adverse reactions to medications because the doctors kept assuring me I was not having a reaction. Actually at one point, I was offered another medication to control the reaction I was having rather than alternative treatment. Once I went to an allergist he could not believe that the doctors had allowed me to continue the medication.

    I am just trying to understand why patient dignity is not respected by some professional caregivers and why if a patient has a legitimate question it is not permissible to ask that question. If I have been allergic to a specific medication for over 50 years, I have the right to ask a doctor why they would prescribe something from the same family. Why isn't the patient supposed to be part of their care?
  8. by   Accolay
    Impossible to control every aspect of every situation. Families are weird sometimes. Roll with annoying things the best you can. Like water off a ducks back.

    Continue to take care of the patient to the best of your ability.
  9. by   trytounderstand
    Remember in most cases the spokesperson is only wanting the best care and is concerned for their family member. While I realize that some family members can come unglued and may be seen as being in the way, most are only trying to support the person who may be the love of their life or a beloved parent who has always been there to protect and care for them. I am not trying to argue just wanting to put a different perspective on intimidation.

    After a recent experience, I now know that as a patient or spokesperson I can request the Nursing Supervisor to help get the situation under control in the room for the patient's benefit as well. There is no reason for nurses to be standing in a patient's room discussing other nurses, arguing over what is being presented on a monitor, refusing to listen to the patient or the spokesperson or refusing to respect the patient's dignity. There is no reason for a patient or spokesperson to feel so intimidated that they do not speak up for themselves. There is no reason for a patient or spokesperson to be afraid to speak up because they are concerned how that person will be treated once they have left the room. There is no reason for the spokesperson to be forced to leave and then have to sit and pray that their loved one is being cared for properly and that they won't have treatment because of implied consent under a drug that was administered to help them relax.

    While I was raised to respect caregivers. I also expect them to respect me. I realize that at times things have to be done in an emergency that puts a patient in an embarrassing position. Actually I have been in a position such as that that saved my baby's life. But to stand over a patient and expect them to be compliant when you have basically stripped them of the last bit of dignity they have left is morally wrong. Then to become flustered and angry because they have asked for their dignity to be restored is also morally wrong. If a patient is coherent and says "No" it is "No!".
  10. by   JKL33
    Quote from trytounderstand
    Remember in most cases the spokesperson is only wanting the best care and is concerned for their family member. While I realize that some family members can come unglued and may be seen as being in the way, most are only trying to support the person who may be the love of their life or a beloved parent who has always been there to protect and care for them. I am not trying to argue just wanting to put a different perspective on intimidation.

    After a recent experience, I now know that as a patient or spokesperson I can request the Nursing Supervisor to help get the situation under control in the room for the patient's benefit as well. There is no reason for nurses to be standing in a patient's room discussing other nurses, arguing over what is being presented on a monitor, refusing to listen to the patient or the spokesperson or refusing to respect the patient's dignity. There is no reason for a patient or spokesperson to feel so intimidated that they do not speak up for themselves. There is no reason for a patient or spokesperson to be afraid to speak up because they are concerned how that person will be treated once they have left the room. There is no reason for the spokesperson to be forced to leave and then have to sit and pray that their loved one is being cared for properly and that they won't have treatment because of implied consent under a drug that was administered to help them relax.

    While I was raised to respect caregivers. I also expect them to respect me. I realize that at times things have to be done in an emergency that puts a patient in an embarrassing position. Actually I have been in a position such as that that saved my baby's life. But to stand over a patient and expect them to be compliant when you have basically stripped them of the last bit of dignity they have left is morally wrong. Then to become flustered and angry because they have asked for their dignity to be restored is also morally wrong. If a patient is coherent and says "No" it is "No!".
    trytounderstand,

    I do believe whatever your experience was very difficult and/or disturbing.

    The best place to air these grievances is with the patient relations personnel at the facility in which these things occurred.

    Nurses other than the ones involved in these events are not responsible. Nurses are individual human beings. If nurses are called to their profession, it is in the same way that anyone is called to any profession or trade; we are not special angelic beings who can always respond perfectly as we wade through the social injustices and general ills of humanity. So I will thank you to not post here as if we are all guilty and/or not doing the best we can, for the most part.

    I am truly sorry that your impression of nurses has been marred, but won't engage in any self-flagellation based on one-sided stories. You may not know it, but nurses are frequently asked to judge ourselves and our peers based on everything from someone's perspective to outright lies. We are somewhat desensitized as a group through these unfortunate exercises of reviewing patient satisfaction comments. That's one reason why it is best to review the care of your loved one directly with those who have the benefit of knowing what you're talking about.

    Take care ~
  11. by   Horseshoe
    Quote from trytounderstand
    Although the patient has recovered, that experience has left a bad taste in my mouth and has ruined my opinion of caregivers, that at one time I had respected as being called to their profession.
    Well, that sounds really fair and reasonable, seeing that all caregivers are exactly alike. Oh, wait, maybe not...

    Consider also that your "research" may not have given you all the relevant information that the nurses "insisting their way was right" might be privy to, given their years of education and experience. Without being there, it's impossible to know for sure, but I imagine they do have just a smidgen more knowledge about critical care than you can find on the web. Regardless, it's not very logical to extrapolate your experience to all nurses.
  12. by   Ambersmom
    yup have had similar situations, not as many family members. I just usually answered their questions with a question "what did the doctor say about that".
  13. by   Ambersmom
    on a funnier note, I was discussing a med with someone who them told me "I was not an expert"(I'd only been giving that med in various forms and routes for a few decades) she informed me she knew more about that drug than I did since she had researched it on WebMD, she was a real estate agent.

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