How Will Universal Health Care Change Nursing? - page 12

How will universal health care change the Nursing profession? Will we finally get ratios? Will our pay go up, or down? What about benefits? Will the quality of care improve, slide, or stay the... Read More

  1. by   GadgetRN71
    This is going to sound horrible but if it comes to capping pay for nurses, reducing benefits etc I will leave nursing, as much as I like my job. Bad enough that insurance companies run healthcare, now you want to hand the reins over to government? Um, don't think so. What makes you think they will be any better at running things?

    More government involvement is not a good thing. I have members of my family that are uninsured. They could be insured, but don't think they should have to pay the premiums..howver, they have no problem paying for cartons of cigarettes, the latest sneakers and cell phones. I'm not saying everyone is like this. But, healthcare providers deserve to be compensated fairly for the services they provide, especially with elective things. We already have doctors that are leaving medicine because they are fed up with malpractice suits run rampant,(OT but I also support caps on how much people can sue for) and horrible compensation for services rendered. It can only get worse when you have government dimwits making medical decisions..Our system may not be perfect but no system will ever be..that's just the way life is.

    I think it's one thing if everyone has access to primary care but I don't agree with the rationing and waiting lists that happen in some countries. Everyone is not the same. In every society, there will always be those who are rich, those who are well enough off, and those that are poor. I don't buy the whole "redistribution of wealth" idea..some people work harder than others, manage their money better, or are just plain fortunate.. it gets dicey when government thinks everyone should live the same. People make choices and these choices have consequences. Yes, I feel bad somewhat for the unemployed mother of 6, but why on earth would you keep having kids if you can't support them? Why should everyone else have to feel the effects? I had no insurance for a good 3 motivated me to better myself to find a job where i get good benefits.

    I know I'll get kind of flamed for this but IMO, universal health care(in the manner it's been presented thus far anyway) is really close to socialism. Also a big thumbs down to taxing our health benefits..

    I voted for Obama but I think he's on the wrong track here.
    Last edit by GadgetRN71 on Jun 24, '09
  2. by   GadgetRN71
    Quote from nursecassia
    also, I am reading more and more of your posts and I am sick to my stomach...not for the horrific stories because those are to be expected from a private pay system but for those of you that really truly believe that a private system is the way to go I am saddened....Do you all realize how incredibly selfish this system is? Who are you, or any insurance company to value one persons life over anothers...If two people enter a hospital bleeding out, who is going to get care first? the insured or the is as simple as that...THIS IS MORALLY wrong!!! Those of you that think this system works are also those of you that either 1.) have a ton of money 2.) are a person that gets richer off of others....remember, everyone is only one step away from being in a slum ... things change in peoples lives may have health care today because you make the big bucks, but wait till you get in that unexpected car accident, cant work to pay the bills and end up at the bottom of the barrel...I stand firm on the fact that private pay is nothing but heirarchy making the rich richer and the poor poorer...publically funded is EQUAL and FAIR!! you may not like it cause you have to wait in line for someone ahead of you but I guess you would just have to suck up your ego and realize that indeed we are all humans and should be treated equally....NO system is perfect, they are all flawed but why would you want to choose the morally repugnant one?
    First off, I work in a level one trauma center. Trust me, we have plenty of people coming in off the street bleeding out and we save them, simple as that. No one looks at their insurance status. Much of the time, they have no ID on them, they literally come up the trauma elevator and into an OR suite.

    Really, who are you to decide what is moral and what is not? You have zero idea of what you are talking about. Here, if you receive government funds, you can not turn anyone away. Period. My hospital will treat you if you are poor. If you are bleeding out, you get treated. If you are drunk, and abusive and get brought into the ER, you get treated. Now, if you are dying, and seriously hurt, I believe you should be treated, no questions asked. If you are coming into the ER because you know we have to treat you and you have the sniffles, then you are a bum. If you are coming into the ER for a free pregnancy test then you are a leech, especially when you are wearing plenty of "bling" but are crying poverty.

    I am not rich. But, I fail to see why I should pay even more taxes than I already do to support people who have no desire to do it for themselves. If this makes me "morally repugnant" then yup, proud to be so.

    Oh, and remind me never to move to Canada!:uhoh21:
  3. by   time4meRN
    Just reading all the posts. I would love to come to the hospitals that some seem to work at , where the system is working. All I see in our ER is one BIG health care MESS ! If it's working well somewhere..... you know , where, pt's get seen in a timely manner, it's not a web of paper work to get insurance to pay for a simple procedure, where, insurance pt's don't get more testing done than medicade pt's so that revenue is produced to help pay for those costs that the hospital knows it won't see a single cent for. Gee ! Sign me up. I'll move tonight. I can never figure out why people seem so worried about " socialism". What do they think medicade, medicare and social security are. Like the post prior to me stated, we pay for preg tests ( after an entire work up for the co abd pain, just to find out all she really wanted was paper documentation of the pregnancy for medicade). Then the girl gets a free bus pass to her home and to the OBGYN. Don't forget about the WIC benifits. But heaven for bid we tell her and her sig. other they won't see another dime for another baby.
    Last edit by time4meRN on Jun 24, '09
  4. by   lamazeteacher
    "I don't feel it is fair for people who work to be punished for having children."
    quote from Toomuchrock

    I'm not sure how the above comment resulted from a "toothless old man"'s viewpoint that having babies will bring parents money. It could have been derived from 2 thoughts: 1. selling the baby to a black market adoption racketeer, in return for a large payment (horrible thought).
    2. a wistful onbservation by an old man with no children who could support him in his old age.

    I doubt that it was said with the intention of taking your enjoyment of your newborn baby away. It could be that PP depression was setting in, with concommitent thoughts that you might not deserve such happiness. That could hark from some earlier experience dredged up from your memory. Many reasons could be the reason you took it to mean criticism of you.

    Please bask in the knowledge that you have a healthy baby, and you deserve to have everything good in life. Cry a lot (that relieves stress), and talk about your feelings with your husband.
  5. by   GadgetRN71
    Quote from time4meRN
    Just reading all the posts. I would love to come to the hospitals that some seem to work at , where the system is working. All I see in our ER is one BIG health care MESS ! If it's working well somewhere..... you know , where, pt's get seen in a timely manner, it's not a web of paper work to get insurance to pay for a simple procedure, where, insurance pt's don't get more testing done than medicade pt's so that revenue is produced to help pay for those costs that the hospital knows it won't see a single cent for. Gee ! Sign me up. I'll move tomarrow. I can never figure out why people seem so worried about " socialism". What exactley do they think medicade, medicare and social security are.
    Well, the argument could be made that some people have issues with that too. I don't have a problem with Social Security, because we pay into that. I believe they should toughen the standard for Medicaid, however. People with special needs and kids..OK. But you have generations of people who sit on welfare(and Medicaid is welfare) for generations.

    Never said the system is perfect. But, so many liberals think that once we go to Universal Health Care, everything will be just ducky. We should be moving toward less government oversight, not more.
  6. by   GadgetRN71
    Regarding the people who come in for free pregnancy tests and who keep spitting out kids, or others who milk the system. I think everytime you go to the ER for a non-emergent reason, they should deduct $50 from your welfare check for the month. Heck, if we are going to have government oversight of healthcare, we should be fair about it, no? If you want to tell Grandma she has to wait 2 years for her total knee replacement then you have to start telling Ms X that she doesn't have free reign to hit the ER whenever she darn well feels like it.
  7. by   shah
    The only thing I know is that right now Americans are 'healthcare slaves.' If I did not have to buy healthcare from my employer, I would travel and make more money.

    I know so many people who are stuck in jobs they hate, just because they cannot afford to lose coverage of 'pre-existing conditions' if they lose their jobs.

    If you lose your job, you lose health coverage. We might have the best health care system in the world, but not the best access.

    While going to nursing school, I had 2 part-time jobs and no healthcare insurance.

    I would surely welcome affordable government sponsored health insurance. The insurance companies can go to hell in a hand basket. I would quit my job the next day and become a travel nurse.
  8. by   shah
    It appalls me to see that people who have never traveled out of the US think that this is the best system.

    I think Americans are being screwed by their system and proud of it. They need to look around the world and see how other countries are delivering health care to their citizens. Some good examples are those of Singapore, Saudi Arabia, and a lot of European countries.

    Just wake up and smell the coffee.
  9. by   KMULL002
    I do not have personal experience with Universal Healthcare but I've had patients and friends/family members who have had it and they all say the same thing: long waits, and sometimes people die waiting for elective surgeries. All the responses I've gotten have been negative. The only positive light I've witnessed is the movie by Michael Moore called "Sicko."
  10. by   MamaKitty13214
    Quote from JoPACURN
    I won't participate in any government run insurance. The doctors I see told me the same thing; some of them are turning away Medicare/Medicaid patients.

    I know my docs, know what my family and I need.

    I'm not going to be told by some government numbers counter to tell me what to way, uh-uh, I don't think so...
    I hope you don't lose your job or health insurance because of what your insurance company may deem a "pre-existing condition" or deny payment for "experimental treatment". Glad you are happy with what you have and that you are OK with a FOR PROFIT insurance company numbers counter telling you what to do. Your situation could change in a heartbeat.

    If you think there is any Freedom or Justice in the U.S. healthcare system as it is, you are clearly not paying attention. PROFIT based insurance as the payment mechanism for health care is a FAILURE because the priority is on maintaining a healthy profit margin for the insurance corporation, NOT on providing proper health care for human beings. Single Payer HR676 is the only answer that makes sense. Privately delivered, publicly financed health care. PERIOD.
  11. by   Jiminocala
    You can get a pretty good idea of what Universal Healthcare will mean to nurses by reading the London Times online edition. They have daily articles about ther horrors of their National Health Plan: Stories about piles of bloody, soiled linens left in halls and rooms r/t curbacks in Housekeeping staff to "control costs." Elderly patients denied joint replacements, Cancer patients expiring while they wait months for a scan or biopsy. One size fits all medical devices, etc. etc. Oh, one other thing. Who do the govt. officials expect to mop and clean in place of the Housekeeping Dept.? The Nurses, of course.
  12. by   Jiminocala
    This is a link to the Daily Mail and a sample of articles about their National Health Service:

    You may want to look up your local suicide hotline after reading the articles. Obamacare cometh!
  13. by   MamaKitty13214
    Quote from mianders
    It has been a long time since I was able to log on to allnurses and this is the first thread I came to. I have read most of the post and there are some very strong opinions from each side of the issue. Each one can make strong arguments for their side and provide convincing data to support their opinions. I in no way have the answers to the problems in healthcare. As nurses we see so many problems in our healthcare systems whether it is here in the US or in countries with UHC. I have a nephew right now who was injured in a motorcycle accident and broke his arm. He was treated in the ER and his arm was splinted. He was told to follow up with an Orthopedic surgeon to determine if he needed a pin. Every surgeon he called wanted at least $500 for the FIRST visit. He has no insurance and no job. His only option is to leave the splint on for 4-6 weeks and hope it heals right. This is just one story. I am sure each of us can come up with more than one whether it is from personal experience or as a nurse. This is an issue that can not be rammed through just to say we did something though. It needs people from all interested areas to sit down and formulate a WELL THOUGHT OUT PLAN that would be best for our system here in the US. There will be disagreements and not everyone will be happy but it is time for a change.
    The answer: HR676 = it is a WELL THOUGHT OUT PLAN -- please read it:

    PLease also look here to see what some nurses have to say:

    And Physicians for a National Health Plan on Single Payer: