CONTINUED IN WHAT IS THE MAJOR REASON Why are they all leaving? - page 4

What conditions would cause so many nurses to leave? Our ER has been losing friends fast. Why is there such a large turnover in nursing? I'm going to school, yet I talk to many RN's who are looking... Read More

  1. by   Mulan
    Quote from mickeypat
    Boy, I have to say... it sure seems like you're bitter and pissed off at the world right now and pissed off about your work... We are just trying to answer the question that the OP had and offer some suggestions....these are just the feelings I have been getting from your posts Mulan. We all know that the ratios are crappy, and that people are getting sicker when they come to the hospital, LTC and what not... the only way to change that is to take a stand for ourselves and not let the higher ups roll us over like a steam roller. Believe me, I do know what I'm talking about... I just left a job that I really enjoyed and was good at because they took advantage of me.... expecting me to take care of all of the little details and doing things that the other nurses wouldn't do. I told them my position many times, if this continued, then I was leaving and I did. Does it bother me that they are short 3 nurses... yes it does because the residents aren't getting the care that they should... but then when you don't have any one who comes to apply for a job and wonder why, maybe they should ask the people who left, why they left and actually listen and do something about it.

    As someone said here prior, we are not the only ones who have a harried job... many others do also...but we are dealing with peoples' lives here and that is not easy and without stress... we need to be open and honest with ourselves and know when we need to take a break, take a day off, make time for yourself... find ways to take care of ourselves... we are the only ones that can speak up for ourselves and make our voices heard and get the changes made!!!!

    Sorry this got long....

    Mickey
    Nope, not bitter and not pissed off, LOL.
  2. by   Mulan
    Quote from mickeypat
    Boy, I have to say... it sure seems like you're bitter and pissed off at the world right now and pissed off about your work... We are just trying to answer the question that the OP had and offer some suggestions....these are just the feelings I have been getting from your posts Mulan. We all know that the ratios are crappy, and that people are getting sicker when they come to the hospital, LTC and what not... the only way to change that is to take a stand for ourselves and not let the higher ups roll us over like a steam roller. Believe me, I do know what I'm talking about... I just left a job that I really enjoyed and was good at because they took advantage of me.... expecting me to take care of all of the little details and doing things that the other nurses wouldn't do. I told them my position many times, if this continued, then I was leaving and I did. Does it bother me that they are short 3 nurses... yes it does because the residents aren't getting the care that they should... but then when you don't have any one who comes to apply for a job and wonder why, maybe they should ask the people who left, why they left and actually listen and do something about it.

    As someone said here prior, we are not the only ones who have a harried job... many others do also...but we are dealing with peoples' lives here and that is not easy and without stress... we need to be open and honest with ourselves and know when we need to take a break, take a day off, make time for yourself... find ways to take care of ourselves... we are the only ones that can speak up for ourselves and make our voices heard and get the changes made!!!!

    Sorry this got long....
    Mickey
    Not bitter and not pissed off as you say, and I don't think you're trying to answer the question the OP had, it seems like you're trying to argue with me about no meal break and not going to the bathroom, :roll based on your posts. By the way, what was your answer to the OP's question? I must have missed it.
  3. by   peds4now
    Quote from ItsyBitsySpider
    You know, whether she's a nurse or not, her advice is great. Nurses should take their breaks and lunch DAILY.
    Amen! Let's allow Epona to speak and not jump down his/her throat!

    I am a student nurse, and I had one clinical instructor who worked straight med-surg many years and she went on and on about this. Yes, you can take breaks. Yes, you can almost always go to lunch. It's about time management and, more importantly, setting boundaries. Now I KNOW you have someone who is assigned to cover you. You have to go to the trouble of giving report and getting report again from them before and after your breaks, but it can be done. If they don't do their job, you have to speak to them about it and then follow the appropriate channels to get them spoken to by someone higher up if they don't cover you properly. That is not easy and won't necessarily make you popular, but it will slowly affect a change on your unit.

    Also, I work as a student RN and I'd say most nurses on the med-surg floor I'm on take lunch every day-an a full 1/2 hour at least. Those who don't are 1) the new grad who is gonna burn herself out fast and just can't seem to get it all done and 2) the woman who cannot delegate and has trouble prioritizing. I'm not at the level of either one of them (!), but from the comfortable position of a student I can see where they are going wrong.
  4. by   pjsleepy
    I can tell you why I am looking to leave ER nursing:

    *Gross misuse of the emergency room by the general population for problems that are no where close to being classified as an emergency situation because: a.) they either have no doctor or b.) they know that they must be treated by us and that they don't have to pay
    * Primary care doctors that refuse to attempt to practice medicine for non-emergent symptoms and instead say "go to the ER"
    * Rude patients and family members who:
    a.) are so egocentric that they can't recognize that the person who is blue and barely breathing is going to be seen before your hang nail you have had for 30 minutes
    b.) yell and scream at you, call you every naughty name in the book, name drop supposed "big-wigs" of the hospital (who supposedly exist but I wouldn't know any of them because I've never seen one make it down to my ER to check out the working conditions), and threaten lawsuits, etc.

    I've been a nurse for 6 years. Just in what seems to me to be a short amount of time, I feel like the work load in the ER has tripled. We used to have some downtimes. After midnight was usually a cake walk with maybe 1-2 pts a piece. Now I come in and the lobby is packed from the time I get there until the time I leave. I got tired of hospital politics and started traveling a little over 2 years ago. It was better for awhile, now I only see it getting worse (and I'm a glass is half full kind of girl!) I hate that we have to hold patients in the ER because the floor is not ready. Nothing against the floors---I know they are dealing with their own problems. I bow down to the med-surg nurses because you do a job I could never do. There are just no easy answers. Hospital administrators only see $$$$ as the bottom line when suggestions are made about hospital improvements. And adding to my fury is JCAHO- an organization whose heart (I'd like to think) is in the right place, but it's recommendations and guidlines are so out of touch with reality that a hospita's JCAHO accreditation means zero in my book. I think one doctor I worked with said it best---"They are just making it impossible to do our jobs." Sorry to vent so long. It's part letting off frustration and part mourning a emergency medical system I used to love....
  5. by   ANnot4me
    I had an epiphany the other day and it wasn't good. Basically, I have been in a very unhealthy relationship and haven't left because I keep waiting for things to change. It hasn't changed in 10 years and it probably not going to... I am so tired of hoping and waiting and I ain't getting any younger.

    In the last 10 years, I have worked in 3 different countries and it is basically all the same: there must be some benefit to high turnover and a skill mix that is heavily skewed toward the younger and less experience side. Hmmm, I bet it has something to do with money. In the US, you are paid well (relative to other countries), but worked to death. In Australia and New Zealand conditions are a bit better and you get more time off, but you get paid crap and have absolutely no voice or input (extremely top-down management styles) and change is almost imperceptible. Turnover is also very high and staff very inexperienced. In all 3 countries there is a high percentage of imported nurses.

    I left Illinois to work in California and before any of you buy into the hype about how wonderful the CNA and their national branch are, the fine print is that the AB 394 ratio/staffing laws are pretty much unenforceable and routinely and widely ignored. You can make money in California, but you work like a dog for it (just like anywhere else) and the cost of living is high.
  6. by   NurseCard
    Quote from Mulan
    Well, when you don't even have time to use the bathroom and you have to stay 2 hours over to get your work and charting done as recently happened to me on an evening shift, does that tell you anything? Of course, since I didn't have time to use the bathroom, I didn't get my half hour meal break that I don't get paid for to begin with. I asked about signing for no meal break and was told you have to call the supervisor and fill out some PTO form, and I'm sure you get flack for that from the manager so I didn't even bother, since if no one else does it, it looks like you have a problem.

    So much responsibility and liability and you don't have the time to do the work properly because of the staffing and nurse to patient ratio.

    This is a new job for me, working prn, and this is my last nursing job, I decided I would give one more nursing job a try and then that's it, I'm doing something else. It's too soon to tell yet, but when you find yourself working only what you have to to fulfill your committment instead of what you wanted to before going in, that's not a good sign.
    You keep saying "Everyone is focusing on meals and bathroom breaks...it's not about meal and bathroom breaks, it's about poor working conditions, yadda yadda yadda...", but YOU are the one who first brought up anything about meal and bathroom breaks!

    Anyway, not getting to take a meal break or go to the bathroom is a HUGE SYMPTOM of a poor working environment! They go hand in hand!

    At my last job, I made the decision that no matter WHAT, I was taking my meal break. I NEEDED to, regardless of anything, or else my performance and my patient care, greatly suffered. If I couldn't get a fellow nurse to help cover my patients, then I called the supervisor and said "look, I need a break, please come and watch my patients".

    Like said before, nurses need to stand up for themselves or the poor working conditions in this country are going to continue to perpetuate...
  7. by   mariedoreen
    Quote from porcelina22
    ...run to the fridge to grab your food to eat while you chart

    Chrissy (nurse extern)
    But then this isn't truly a break is it?
  8. by   oneLoneNurse
    Pay, benefits and respect. You are not really compensated for years of experience like you might be in other fields. Computer programming/systems analysis is one place where I think you can command more money, BUT the rewards are geared to what you actually know how to do.

    People tell me we make alot (even the nurses I work with), BUT I look at our pension plan and it literally sucks. I have to put about 1/4 of my wages into a 401 to think about retiring @ age 70. When you take that into consideration and rate the salary against that of a postal worker and/or teacher it may not cut it.

    Staffing is at the whim of the supervisor they can do with you what they want. I am lucky in my present position, BUT generally if the hospital wants to cut your nurse/patient ratio they can and there ain't nothing we can do about it.
  9. by   BSNtobe2009
    What amazes me, is why are nurses leaving hospitals (at ANY hospital) and Administration isn't scrambling doing exit interviews to see why.

    From reading these boards, orientation is a huge expense to the hospital, so I don't see how to keep training new hire after new hire is going to benefit them in any way.

    Has anyone that has quit a hospital had an exit interview? Are these typical or rare for the industry?

    Some might find that it's a particular DON, a supervisor, a certain doctor, etc. To me it would be easier to get rid of the source of the problem than to go through a bunch of staff members.

    Not everything can be corrected, but it's hard to be sympathetic to hospital administrations that keep saying, "We need good, quality nurses!" Because my first question to them would be, "What are you doing to keep the ones you have?"
  10. by   PANurseRN1
    schooldays wrote:

    I'm not at the level of either one of them (!), but from the comfortable position of a student I can see where they are going wrong.
    This is what makes many people bristle at students/nurse wanna-bes who say "You should do this," or "You should do that" or lecture those of us with experience for our "bad attitudes." They haven't been there to know what it's like.

    So some of us, especially those of us with years of experience, are a little impatient with people who right now have no clue what it's like to be a practicing nurse trying to advise us.

    You're certainly entitled to an opinion and to express it. I'm just saying that for those of us who are actually working as nurses, we also have the right to give those opinions exactly the consideration they merit.
    Last edit by PANurseRN1 on Nov 5, '06
  11. by   oldiebutgoodie
    Quote from BSNtobe2009
    What amazes me, is why are nurses leaving hospitals (at ANY hospital) and Administration isn't scrambling doing exit interviews to see why.

    From reading these boards, orientation is a huge expense to the hospital, so I don't see how to keep training new hire after new hire is going to benefit them in any way. ....

    Has anyone that has quit a hospital had an exit interview? Are these typical or rare for the industry?
    I quit my first nursing job after 4 months because when I was hired, I was told I would probably do days and PMs. Instead, they scheduled me for 4 nights a week! (Pretty different from what was said!) Furthermore, the nurses there were witches, etc...

    When I handed my paperwork into personnel and I turned to leave, I heard one HR person say to the next, "Boy, we sure have had a lot of nurses resign this week!"

    Of course, there was no exit interview. But they keep on hirin', and people keep on leavin'. Make you wonder where the brains are.

    Oldiebutgoodie
  12. by   mamason
    Quote from UKRNinUSA
    sorry mamason - I don't believe that the federal government will help us out on this one. It was the California Nurses Association that fought hard for the nurse/ratio law for 12 years and our "great" (?) California governer that tried to roll it back. It's up to us. I can't say it enough - unionize, unionize, unionize -there is great strength in numbers!
    Yes,,you are very correct. It was just some wishful thinking on my part. I wish I had the option to go union. But, around here, they are few and far between.
  13. by   NurseCherlove
    Quote from NREMT-P/RN
    Speaking from a purely personal experience.

    I just can't keep any self respect and continue nursing! I refuse to allow myself to be treated in the manner that is customary toward NURSES!

    Brutal, but true.
    I feel ya! I have said that a couple of times lately to my SO...that one has to have some serious mental/self-esteem problems to continue in a job like mine. Makes me sad though, because there are some times (albeit far and few between) that I really love it and feel good about being there and what I'm doing. Unfortunately, I know those moments, when they are happening, will be ending very shortly and that I will go home that day wondering why I continue in this.

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