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CRNA vs Physician Salaries

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Mar 28, 2007 07:55 PM

CRNA vs Physician Salaries

by paindoc

Source: www.payscale.com Parameters: 5 years experience in all fields
City: Chicago Salary quoted: 50th percentile unless otherwise noted
Physicians are quoted for private practice CRNA quoted as permanent

CRNA salary 121K (50th percentile) with the 75th percentile at 137K
Nurse Practitioner 78K
Nurse manager 59K
RN 55K

Family physician 127K
Internist 127K
Rheumatologist 128K
Pediatrician 129K
Oncologist 129K
Pulmonolist 129K
General Surgeon 137K (25th percentile is 87K)
Neurologist 139K
Psychiatrist 146K
ER physician 161K
Plastic surgeon 207K (25th percentile is 125K)
Ortho surgeon 228K

Analysis: Nurse anesthetist salaries are within 5% of the majority of primary care physician salaries and within 10% of many physician specialists. The nurse anesthetists salaries are greater than some surgeon salaries for which they provide anesthesia and in some cases, nurse anesthetists make substantially more in salary than the surgeon for which they deliver anesthesia. Nurse anesthetists (not considered advance practice nurses in some states) make 224% of the RN salary and 156% of the nurse practitioner salary (an advance practice nurse in all states).
According to allnurses website, 58% of CRNAs are non-advanced degree nurses, having only a RN degree.

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35 Comments

from NRSKarenRN

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 08:01 AM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

Little misleading there pain-doc.

'58% of CRNA's are non-advanced degreed nurses"....HOWEVER they attended nurse anesthesia programs when they were advanced training certificate programs and have been practicing anesthesia for the last 20-50 years.

Educational advances of the last 20 years moved to strengthen educational programs to graduate degree level across all advanced practice settings in the nursing profession.

Healthcare professions advancing their educational levels also include Pharmacists (Doctor of Pharmacy degree), Physical Therapists (Doctorate degree by 2020) and Speech Therapists (MS degree).

I remember a time doctors only completed internship, not residency which was for specialized practice.

Times change. Nursing advanced practice has advanced educational standards along with other healthcare practitioners.

To your prior premise you can train an individual RN to administer anesthesia in a month........might be one or two agents to relatively healthy individuals. CRNA's are educated to administer a variety of agents, differing modalities, to infants and those in their 90's, in controlled settings and in trauma code situations.

Maybe it's time to move your disdain for this profession to another bb.

from deepz

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 08:22 AM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

Yeah!

from paindoc

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 09:04 AM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

It is futile to argue with facts. CRNA salaries have bloated to the point they should indeed become the focus of not only hospital administrators and anesthesiologists, but also the MDs that work twice as many hours per week as CRNAs, have substantially more education, and assume far more liability risk all for the same salary as a CRNA.
Another little nasty fact is that there are many CRNAs practicing that have less than a BS RN, in fact have no 4 year college degree at all. They come from the 2 year or 3 year RN programs, some of which were hospital schools rather than colleges. In 1992 the predominate degree achieved by nurses matriculating into the CRNA programs was a 2 year RN, period. Many of these CRNAs continue to practice today and are paid the same as a MS + BSRN. Furthermore they are paid the same as a MD primary care physician that had requirements of 4 years college, 4 years medical school, and 3 years residency in 1992.
You are correct in assuming this message needs to be disseminated to other bulletin boards and I plan on doing exactly that, beginning with the primary care bbs and working my way up through hospital administrator bbs.
Just the facts...just the facts....

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from urgewrx

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 11:33 AM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

Thanks paindoc for providing hardcore evidence on a statement I made on another thread. These inflated salaries are totally ridiculous for the level of training. As soon as Medicare and other private insurers adjust the payscale for nurse anesthesia, the party is over. And it WILL HAPPEN

1 Reader Gave Kudos

from HairCanada

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 12:40 PM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

Firstly, your figures are a little bogus, ..come on you got them from some website, if you were actually a "Doctor" ..you would laugh at that type of research method.

Secondly ..what is your point?...Are you trying to communicate that highly educated and trained cross discipline medical professionals are compensated extremely well?......wow very astute!!!

Maybe your next post will be about your revolutionary idea that there is some invisible force pulling things downward!!...please keep us posted...

1 Reader Gave Kudos

from FlGasman

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 01:52 PM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

And those doc salries conflict SIGNIFICANTLY with the Bearau of labor as well as salary .com low balling doc salaries by 30-50%. But people forget what goes into CRNA training today
4 years under grad-
2 years ICU-
2.5 years school (and not the same as NP school, you cant work in anesthesia school)
so just slightly less then MD

from FlGasman

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 02:04 PM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

just out curiosity, are you a pian doc? paindoc? Is there a complaint about our salaries? Are they too high? Why does an interventional radiologist make 400PLUS K a year? Why do anesthesiologiusts and pain docs make more then several residencies that are 2-3 years longer then theirs who have worse hours? WHy do attorney who have 7 total years of education make more then all of us (in some cases) What is the issue specifically with CRNA salaries?

from skipaway

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 03:41 PM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

I'm just not sure why how much a CRNA makes bothers you so much, Paindoc. Athletes, who, may have no degree whatsoever, are multi-millionaires as are entertainers. Do you begrudge them their living like you do CRNAs? Would it make you feel better if people who are not formally educated always make less then the almight MD? What about entreprenurs who do not hold a degree, but by sheer work ethic and smarts becomes a high earner? Do you feel that they don't deserve a good living too? I just think it's nobodies concern how much I get paid and I don't understand how paying CRNAs less would make you happier.

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from ali anesthesia

Old

Mar 29, 2007, 06:18 PM

Default

Re: CRNA vs Physician Salaries

The real question is: what is the value of administering anesthesia. The ASA has established that years ago with their relative value guide. It seems like the value of administering anesthesia is higher than treating runny noses and type 2 diabetes. Make of it what you want, but it is the reality.

I know many physicians who wish they had gone the CRNA route. One of the surgeons I work with insisted his son become a CRNA instead of going to medical school.

Ali A

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