Supervisors at Abington Memorial Hospital in Philadelphia have explained that they sought only to avoid a confrontation when they told African American employees to stay out of a patient's room after a man ordered that no blacks assist in the delivery of his child.
Philadelphia Inquirer, Oct. 3, 2003
NAACP wants hospital supervisors punished
Local leaders call for Abington hospital to discipline those who told minority staffers to stay out of a patient's room.
Local NAACP leaders yesterday called on Abington Memorial Hospital to discipline supervisors who told minority employees to stay out of a patient's room after a man demanded that only white staffers assist in the delivery of his baby.
( By Oliver Prichard, Inquirer Staff Writer, 10/04/2003 03:01 AM EDT)
The other thing that always kills me when a pt pulls this is the idea that they really feel that the male nurse is going to freak out over their 90-year-old coochie. Puh-leeze, grandma! Give me a break!
And, then there are those times you wish you could say "Well, I'll be happy to give you a female nurse instead. I hope you don't mind that she's bisexual?" ;-)
Bwahahaha! This is too funny, I share your sentiment.
Back in the late 1970's when I just graduated from nursing school I was confronted with a racial issue that still bothers me today. I worked at a hospital with many Jewish physicians and nurses. We had the King of Saudi Arabia at that time in the Cleveland Clinic and his daughter went into labor. Our OB was available and she delivered her son safely. But no Jewish physician or nurse was allowed near her or son and could not work the floor either. The hospital agreed to all the demands. Everyone protested but was over ruled. They have the right to the care giver of choice. That rule applies today as well. I've seen good doctors given orders to get out of rooms good male nurse's yelled at and having to be replaced the list goes on...we can't change society how I wish we could..
No one from the Jewish organizations demanded any punishment of administration at that time. Sad.
Why not just say "we will keep your preferences in mind, but we can't guarantee that what you want will be possible 100% of the time." Then leave it to them to decide whether to accept care or refuse. I think the hospital's obligation is to make the resources available, once the patient has refused care knowing the possible consequences they take responsibility for any problems.
Why not just say "we will keep your preferences in mind, but we can't guarantee that what you want will be possible 100% of the time." Then leave it to them to decide whether to accept care or refuse. I think the hospital's obligation is to make the resources available, once the patient has refused care knowing the possible consequences they take responsibility for any problems.
I like that statement. It's professional and neutral. While some may be disappointed that it does not overtly challenge the client's prejudices, it sounds like a statement that would actually work in a real, emotionally charged situation, without further escalating tensions. I think a combination of neutral statements like that, involving the administrative chain of command, and returning the responsibility to the patient and documenting it could work.
For example, one could document that the client and family were informed of the risks of refusing care and probably delivering the baby without medical attention, including death of the neonate.
I think the Cleveland Clinic anecdote illustrates how the responsibility for these incidents ultimately lies with the hospital's administration. As I've read this thread, and pondered what I might do if I were ever caught in a similar situation, it has occurred to me that this problem is not something that an individual staff person or low level supervisor can "solve". Yes, we can make better or worse choices or statements in a situation like this. But without real support from an administration willing to actually stand behind the anti-discrimination policies that every large organization probably has written down somewhere, there is only a limited amount we can accomplish. The one good thing about the incident that started this thread is that it forced the administration of that hospital to actually display some accountability.
The other thought I've had while reading some of the pro "client-choice" posts is that we need to acknowledge that racism and other prejudices can actually harm people. I think most of us would agree with a philosophy that can be summarized by the phrase "I gotta right to do what I want, as long as it doesn't hurt somebody else." I realize that the harm we're talking about here isn't obvious in this broken-bones kind of way, but I do believe it exists.
I am a nurse at Abington Hospital (as well as mcp). Abington is a lovely hospital that really puts it patients first. It's like a hotel. Almost every room is priivate. They rely on their community for support--especially financially. They do tend to take the attitude that the "customer is always right." As an ER nurse in a hospital where everybody thinks they are somebody (for one reason or another), I am quite familiar with the way they want to keep their "customers" happy.
I have been ordered out of patients room because I was too young. A guy who was having chest pain told me to go away and find him a nurse who wasn't just "some kid" I was quite happy to becauset the last thing I want to do is take care of a pt that instantly hates me for something I can't help.
I also think it is a matter of safety. I can't say what happened was right. But it is interesting, my mother (who is also a nurse there) just showed me the new policy and it prevents bias in pt assignments,,,,but there is no mention of gender discrimination.
Its a shame racism still exists. But unfortunately it still does. And in many other forms. Im a male nurse. Ive worked the ER for a long long time. And working ER I see racism all the time. There are cultures that want only females to take care of their female family members. If reassurances dont work, then am I going to force an issue, and take care of them against their wishes. No I dont think so. I just make a deal with one of my female workers to swap patients. easier than forcing an confrontation. Easier than being charged with assault.
Now we can try to force societies beliefs and current laws onto an individual. Maybe Im getting old now. But im too tired of hitting my head against the wall.
Ive had male patients who were severely homophobic and didnt want me putting in their foley. I just say ok, you have that right, and I make a deal with someone else. BTW IM not gay by any means.
Now in a hospital that size there is plenty of work for everyone to do together. If someone doesnt want me Im just simple enough to say, thank god, let some one else deal with that idiot.
Lot easier than forcing an confrontation, having a fight, or to subdue someone in the hospital enviroment. Maybe Im just getting too old to fight. Or maybe I just dont want to fight.
But it seems to me in this case that everyone should be mad at the individual who expressed these feelings. Rather than against whoever tried to keep potentially dangerous situation from developing in their work enviroment. Done we have enough threats already in this world without adding more.
You know, it is very easy for white america to make a comment like that, quite easy. But if the person had said "I do not want any Jews in my room, it would have been a different scenerio. From what I understand the hospital is a nonprofit facility receiving Federal funds, they can not discriminate like that. The patient should not have been accomodated. The staff can not choose who they want to care for, "Oh, I can not take care of white people today, only black ones. " They would not have a job. Sure it would be okay to have one less thing to do, but remember, behind the uniform is a person. We tolerate a lot in this country, a lot that you will never understand because you will never be in our shoes, not today anyway. Keep it real.(Abington Memorial Hospital has their own corner on the nursing shortage, in fact as of today they have a vacancy rate of 142, are you available?:rotfl:
I am a nurse at Abington Hospital (as well as mcp). Abington is a lovely hospital that really puts it patients first. It's like a hotel. Almost every room is priivate. They rely on their community for support--especially financially. They do tend to take the attitude that the "customer is always right." As an ER nurse in a hospital where everybody thinks they are somebody (for one reason or another), I am quite familiar with the way they want to keep their "customers" happy.
I have been ordered out of patients room because I was too young. A guy who was having chest pain told me to go away and find him a nurse who wasn't just "some kid" I was quite happy to becauset the last thing I want to do is take care of a pt that instantly hates me for something I can't help.
I also think it is a matter of safety. I can't say what happened was right. But it is interesting, my mother (who is also a nurse there) just showed me the new policy and it prevents bias in pt assignments,,,,but there is no mention of gender discrimination.
Hello young one,
It is not the same to be asked to leave a room, as being another race. America has a history of racial discriminaton against the African American. It is known nationally for this, it is not the same as your youth. I know that your hospital is now quite well known and not for the right reasons. Part of the reason that there is a national nursing shortage today is facilities putting their staff last. Don't you think that your coworkers deserve to have respect and dignity just as much as the patients they care for?:rotfl:
I do agree that age and gender discrimination does not affect a person the way race discrimination can. I just had a situation last week where there was a pt who was a little crazy and drunk. Another nurse who was african american walked in to take vital signs and the slurs he was making was up there with David Duke. She and I were both shocked and she said that she didn't want to go back in the room-I completely understood and took care of the man so she wouldn't have to. I guess I just don't understand why an african american would want to take care of such an abusive pt. I didn't even want to take care of him.
I do agree that age and gender discrimination does not affect a person the way race discrimination can. I just had a situation last week where there was a pt who was a little crazy and drunk. Another nurse who was african american walked in to take vital signs and the slurs he was making was up there with David Duke. She and I were both shocked and she said that she didn't want to go back in the room-I completely understood and took care of the man so she wouldn't have to. I guess I just don't understand why an african american would want to take care of such an abusive pt. I didn't even want to take care of him.
You know,
Alcohol releases the inhibitions in a lot of those that indulge. People say and do things that would have otherwise remained hidden. You wonder where all the anger originated. The world has no idea what nurses deal with, we are an endangered species. Be Blessed.
I totally disagree. A patient does not have the right to bring his racist viewpoints into the workplace setting. The administration should of stood up to him and said "behave yourself or get the hell out." Give me a break. It is the year 2004 and blatent racism is still allowed to live on. You all who say go along with this stupid guy should be ashamed of yourselves.
I just came across this thread and spent most of the evening reading it and have to say I found some very offensive things being said by people who are complaining about patients being offensive. Weird.
To say that an elderly woman who is so private that she does not want a male nurse to "see her 90 year old coochie" is completely uncalled for and just plain mean and rude. I'm taking care of an elderly woman whose goal is to get strong enough to go home and take care of herself so that she isn't embarrassed by having to ask her son to take her to the bathroom and help her wipe. My grandmother is in LTC and would be appalled to have a male nurse help her do anything in the vicinity of her "coochie" due to her sense of modesty. I would think that most male nurses would respect a woman's sense of modesty, whatever her age. How professional to make fun of her.
I also think it is unfair to catagorize WWII era men and women as being intolerant as a whole and to say that BabyBoomers are tolerant and to look forward to the day when the WWII era dies away. WWII men and women fought against intolerance, lived through the Civil Rights era and I'd wager to bet many marched against racism.
Maybe we don't need to look so far to see bigotry or prejudice.
I don't condone what happened at the hospital but I certainly will not accuse certain age groups of being more bigoted or make fun of elderly women to make my point.
I just came across this thread and spent most of the evening reading it and have to say I found some very offensive things being said by people who are complaining about patients being offensive. Weird.
To say that an elderly woman who is so private that she does not want a male nurse to "see her 90 year old coochie" is completely uncalled for and just plain mean and rude. I'm taking care of an elderly woman whose goal is to get strong enough to go home and take care of herself so that she isn't embarrassed by having to ask her son to take her to the bathroom and help her wipe. My grandmother is in LTC and would be appalled to have a male nurse help her do anything in the vicinity of her "coochie" due to her sense of modesty. I would think that most male nurses would respect a woman's sense of modesty, whatever her age. How professional to make fun of her.
I also think it is unfair to catagorize WWII era men and women as being intolerant as a whole and to say that BabyBoomers are tolerant and to look forward to the day when the WWII era dies away. WWII men and women fought against intolerance, lived through the Civil Rights era and I'd wager to bet many marched against racism.
Maybe we don't need to look so far to see bigotry or prejudice.
I don't condone what happened at the hospital but I certainly will not accuse certain age groups of being more bigoted or make fun of elderly women to make my point.
steph
:balloons: Hey,
I have worked in LTC for the past ten years, I hear you. People do not know much about the generation that they are dealing with. That generation is very modest and that is just the way it is. We are now living in an age where it is okay to marry another sex, kiss another sex in public, get plastic surgery to look like another or whatever we want, so what is the big deal they say? That generation has something alot of us need to get morals and scruples and above all respect for their bodies. I will leave it there.
Plus the person that made the comment probably has never had a grandmother to love.
SharonH, RN
2,144 Posts
Bwahahaha! This is too funny, I share your sentiment.