What do you consider to be nursing's biggest setback?

newohiorn, BSN, RN, EMT-P · May 13, 2011

Inflation of credentials. Get your BSN--when you go back to school for your BSN they try to sell you an MSN. When I started a Master's program they tried to sell me a DNP. All this education and no commensurate increase in pay--we're shooting ourselves in the foot if we go along with this. The only ones making more money are the schools selling these credentials.

And all the Magnet crap--which is one of the things pushing the heightened credentials--but you don't see them working to increase our pay.

Ruby Vee, BSN · May 13, 2011

the above response is one of nursings biggest setbacks in the form of a 'put you down because i know more, and have more experience' attitude.
an innocent question for example is asked on this site. one then encounters some good, mature, respectful arguments, then there are the 'longest' and 'oldest' posters who have to be rude, argumentative - because they are always right apparently - and discouraging. nursing will never, ever grow as a profession if older nurses look down on younger people (or older, newer nurses), and don't treat them with respect. if one doesn't have 20+ years of experience, blah blah, one is told basically on here that 'they don't know anything because you have only been a rn for 2 years' or whatever other lame excuse is used on here.
i post a thread for which i thought was an interesting discussion, one which i was curious about. i got some good and thoughtful replies, and i've encountered interesting people on an. but i'm appalled by the amount of rudeness that is allowed on this board and in the nursing proefession in particular. it's rude, immature and unnecessary, and has the quality of a 'i'm one up more than you' attitude.
i for one probably won't post much on here anymore, as these attitudes towards newer nurses needing help and the blatant rudeness on here - which the moderators rarely do anything about, especially with longer-term posters who get away with it - greatly disappoints me. i thought the goal of an, and nursing blogs, was for us to help each other and to show a higher level of maturity (as well as venting). seems not.
thanks to all for the great replies i've received in the past, and for the friends i have made on here.
this has been a disappointing experience of the first nursing blog i have been a part of. and the last.

the post you quoted had absolutely nothing to do with experience or lack thereof. it was in response to a poster who seems to think that the biggest problem in nursing today is "the bunch of females in it." blaming the problems of a profession or of professionals on the gender of the professionals seems to be a poorly thought-out, bigoted and knee-jerk response. worse than that, the poster (at least as near as i can tell) is female. bad enough to be a misogynist, but to be a female misogynist is both sad and frightening.

i'm surprised at how many females thoughtlessly bash their own gender, insisting that it's ok that they do so because they themselves are female. "all women are nasty, catty, dramatic backstabbers", they'll claim. it leaves me to wonder if they consider themselves to be nasty, catty, melodramatic backstabbers and if so, why don't they do something about it by changing the one person they can change -- themselves. or do they not include themselves when they make such sweeping and bigoted generalizations? or maybe they don't include themselves or their friends . . . do you see where i'm going here?

as far as treating other nurses with respect -- that should go both ways. newer nurses need to respect their elders for their wisdom and experience and for their very humanity. if you expect to be treated with respect, you need to treat others with respect. some newer nurses seem to think it only goes one way. not naming any names here, but many of the newer nurses seem to lack respect for the same experienced nurses they expect to teach them how to function as nurses. rudeness is often in the eye of the beholder . . . the internet doesn't do nuance, body language or facial expression very well. rather than assume you've been "dissed", why not just ask if you're interpreting someone's response the way they meant it. at worst you'll get a "yeah, and what of it?" at best, you might get a thought-provoking and intelligent answer that helps you to look at an old problem in a brand new way. and you might find out that people you assumed were being rude and dismissive were in actuality trying to help you.

(announcing that you refuse to post on here anymore because you don't like the responses you get isn't really the height of maturity, either. rude and unnecessary? probably.)

joies1 · May 13, 2011

As usual, I am a bit late to respond - which probably isn't a concern.

What is nursing's greatest setback? Well, many of you seem too avant guard for me. I may be old, but I am not particularly 'old fashioned'. So here is my gist of things.

I became an RN in the mid '80's while in my 30's. I do live in a rather rural area so things may have a different perspective from other areas. So I will give you my view of our nursing [and health care provision].

Corporations !!!!! and health Insurance !!!!

In my northwest we were largely small, wonderful hospitals dedicated to serving our communities. The entire staff was a family of sorts with our entire focus to those in need of our care. In came the large corporation with all of its remodeling and division to take over not only our hospital, but every hospital and clinic for half the state. Not all their ideas were wrong, but so many were not focused to patient care. With corporations, presentation and profit seem to equate with a good success and the focus of their intent. I have to disagree ! As a nurse, my prime intent is as patient advocate - not 'yes-man/woman' - to the corporate people who seem to know nothing about real patient care and advocacy. It has been several years since I have worked in a hospital, but see the same thing in extended care and assisted living. Once a corporation umbrella takes over functioning facilities the whole focus turns from patient or resident care to profitability for the owner and share holders.

Insurance - I will not even go there. I just know that many, if not most, of our MD's stopped delivering babies as their Liability Insurance elevated to unreasonable costs. I can only imagine what things are like now. My own doctor was 'black-balled' out of her excellent practice by a corporation years ago.

So, to nursing. . . . . Nurses are held to oblige whatever the facility or corporation designs - regardless of their better judgment or advocacy. They have no say while feeling the hard edge of the boot when they cannot ethically comply or voice differently. Good nurses - REAL NURSES - face this setback every day, I suspect. Do you keep your job ? Or do you set your foot to what is needed for your patients ?

Good wishes to any and all that may continue to feel the call of this profession at its essence.

This is so against my grain, but I will say it anyway. I think private/corporate marketing to health care is the greatest set back to nurses being able to provide excellent nursing care. A 'patient advocate' nurse knows what she needs to do to provide the best care for her patients. And that should not be restricted to corp guidelines or insurance costs.

cdsga · May 13, 2011

We just celebrated Nurses Week this week and the hospital where I work combined it to Patient Care Week to include all the tech support as well. We have been very accommodating almost to a fault. We had celebrations for all shifts and it was amazing the lack of attendance due to staff being sent home early or to the inability for staff to leave their assigned units. Communication about the weeks events in my dept was not very evident and I understand that every individual is responsible for obtaining their information about hospital activities, but I also feel that managers need to promote hospital celebrations and allow that time for staff to participate. I still feel there is a elitist factor between managers and their staff, in that I mean, it's a subliminal diminishing effect on the bedside nurse. Keep them in the dark, let them work, keep them busy or send them home. I don't know---I have worked with excellent managers and not so good managers. The good ones get to know their staff, empower them and keep staff enthused and informed. It's disappointing to say the least, when you know certain actions work to improve morale and they don't have the desire to tap into those managerial styles. Are they tired?, do they really like what they are doing? Do they respect the people who work for them? What is it? Are they being pressured from above? Anyone have a clue?

Katie5 · May 13, 2011

that includes you, i'm sure. and all of your friends? or just all of the females who aren't you?

i'm impartial.

gentlegiver, ASN, LPN, RN · May 13, 2011

We just celebrated Nurses Week this week and the hospital where I work combined it to Patient Care Week to include all the tech support as well. We have been very accommodating almost to a fault. We had celebrations for all shifts and it was amazing the lack of attendance due to staff being sent home early or to the inability for staff to leave their assigned units. Communication about the weeks events in my dept was not very evident and I understand that every individual is responsible for obtaining their information about hospital activities, but I also feel that managers need to promote hospital celebrations and allow that time for staff to participate. I still feel there is a elitist factor between managers and their staff, in that I mean, it's a subliminal diminishing effect on the bedside nurse. Keep them in the dark, let them work, keep them busy or send them home. I don't know---I have worked with excellent managers and not so good managers. The good ones get to know their staff, empower them and keep staff enthused and informed. It's disappointing to say the least, when you know certain actions work to improve morale and they don't have the desire to tap into those managerial styles. Are they tired?, do they really like what they are doing? Do they respect the people who work for them? What is it? Are they being pressured from above? Anyone have a clue?

I have no clue for you, but, my company sent us trays of sandwiches. This we thought was great, until the patients saw the sandwiches and started demanding they get some too. As there was just enough for the staff the patients became very unruly and made the job harder for the rest of the night.. all because we got sandwiches and they couldn't have one. Sometimes you just can't win.

cdsga · May 13, 2011

Oh my goodness-it's unbelievable.

Caffeine_IV · May 13, 2011

Patient satisfaction surveys. I hate them but this is how we get reimbursed no and you must have near perfect scores.

The nursing shortage lie along with the influx of people who jumped on the nursing bandwagon with no idea of what it would be.

I don't truly know if this is a setback but maybe the union/non union thing because maybe it would help if it was one or the other.

No Stars In My Eyes · May 13, 2011

This is a little off-track, but one year for Nurse's Week, an agency I worked for gave us a xerox copy of a note thanking us for working so hard. That was it! I'm surprised they even thought to waste the copy-machines toner on it. I was pretty insulted.....but, OH WELL! .....................And something I see alot, no matter how big or small the situation ( ie Hosp. or PDN) there is always someone who thinks one or more of the others (staff) is/are so BAAAAD it's all they talk about behind their backs, Like they think the other one is practically trying to actively kill the patient, or something. What's with THAT??!!!!................Oh, and I have a question : What is "Press-Gainey"?

BLMRN2BE · May 14, 2011

Nurse "mills" that have popped up over the past few years to help with the nursing shortage. They're turning out ill-prepared, under-educated, and clueless "nurses" that have no idea about the work involved with nursing.
Is it any wonder why there is a push for institutions to want the BSN nurses?
(Oh, and NO WAY do I want to see nursing "federalized". I believe in state sovereignty. The imperial federal government does not need any greater power or authority than it already posesses. Pain in the @$$? Sure but I wouldn't have it any other way.)

Ding Ding Ding we have a winner!

cdsga · May 15, 2011

Press Gainey is a patient satisfaction survey reference

justashooter · May 15, 2011

I have no clue for you, but, my company sent us trays of sandwiches. This we thought was great, until the patients saw the sandwiches and started demanding they get some too. As there was just enough for the staff the patients became very unruly and made the job harder for the rest of the night.. all because we got sandwiches and they couldn't have one. Sometimes you just can't win.

in most cultures it is regarded as impolite to serve a meal in a public place that is not open to all those in attendance. the remaining cultures that establish exclusionary groups at public meals (forbidding women and children from eating in traditional arab social events, at least until the men are finished and have left, for instance), are regarded as backward and uncivilized.

perhaps it is unwise to allow food to be placed in front of patients if they will not be allowed to partake.