Union-yes or no

Rionoir, ADN, RN · Jul 27, 2019

Most people would be fine negotiating their own contracts but the union won’t let them do that even if they aren’t paying dues, so to turn around and say it’s stealing when the union is the one making sure no one has the option... ?‍♂️

Also, it’s absolutely by force unless you don’t consider “pay dues or you can’t work here” somehow not by force lol

FolksBtrippin, BSN, RN · Jul 27, 2019

10 hours ago, Rionoir said:
Most people would be fine negotiating their own contracts but the union won’t let them do that even if they aren’t paying dues, so to turn around and say it’s stealing when the union is the one making sure no one has the option... ?‍♂️
Also, it’s absolutely by force unless you don’t consider “pay dues or you can’t work here” somehow not by force lol

No, most people are not fine negotiating their own contracts. Because your impact against the company means very little all by yourself. That is why unions started. Companies were abusing their employees because of the massive imbalance of power. That is precisely why unions began. Are they not teaching this important part of American history in red states public education? Shame.

You can choose not to work at the union hospital if you dont want to pay union dues. That's not force. Except that your pay, benefits, and working conditions are still way better than the non union hospital. So why would you not pay dues?

Talk to me again after you finish school and get a job as an RN. Then we'll see how you feel about your ability to negotiate with management for decent working conditions and pay.

Wuzzie · Jul 27, 2019

12 hours ago, Rionoir said:
Most people would be fine negotiating their own contracts

Not in the nursing world. Almost every facility has a rigid pay scale based on experience that they adhere to. There simply is no negotiating unless it’s a management position or you bring something incredible to the table that the hospital can use. Trust me when I say this, there isn’t anything they will view as incredible when it comes to interviewing for a bedside position. In fact, if you try to negotiate there’s a good chance they’ll move on to the next candidate waiting in the wings. They have plenty to choose from. In right to work states nobody is forced to pay union dues and those that don’t still enjoy all the benefits off the wallets of their dues-paying peers. I don’t suppose you see a problem with that.

Rionoir, ADN, RN · Jul 28, 2019

20 hours ago, Wuzzie said:
Not in the nursing world. Almost every facility has a rigid pay scale based on experience that they adhere to. There simply is no negotiating unless it’s a management position or you bring something incredible to the table that the hospital can use. Trust me when I say this, there isn’t anything they will view as incredible when it comes to interviewing for a bedside position. In fact, if you try to negotiate there’s a good chance they’ll move on to the next candidate waiting in the wings. They have plenty to choose from. In right to work states nobody is forced to pay union dues and those that don’t still enjoy all the benefits off the wallets of their dues-paying peers. I don’t suppose you see a problem with that.

What I see a problem with is allowing a union to steal money from people or telling them if you don’t pay you can’t work here. Yes, I have a gigantic problem with that for what I would think are obvious reasons to any reasonable person.

The fact that those people still fall under the union contract is due to the union demanding that they still fall under the contract, so no, I don’t feel sorry for the union in that scenario.

Wuzzie · Jul 28, 2019

3 hours ago, Rionoir said:
What I see a problem with is allowing a union to steal money from people or telling them if you don’t pay you can’t work here. Yes, I have a gigantic problem with that for what I would think are obvious reasons to any reasonable person.
The fact that those people still fall under the union contract is due to the union demanding that they still fall under the contract, so no, I don’t feel sorry for the union in that scenario.

The fact of the matter is that the majority of states are “right to work” states. Perhaps you are unclear what that means. Half of the states that are not are in the process of working towards it leaving a very small percentage of closed-shop states. Furthermore not all nursing unions require joining regardless of their state’s laws. Nursing unions are not run like the Teamsters. Your premise that they are “stealing” your money is a fallacy.

You continue to be under the delusion that you will be able to negotiate a better contract for yourself because, as I previously told you and you have ignored, the process is generally set and experienced base regardless of whether it is a unionized hospital or not.

Finally, I did not ask you if you felt sorry for the union I asked you if you thought it was fair to get something for nothing and given your deliberate obfuscation of the question I’m thinking you’re fine with it.

Rionoir, ADN, RN · Jul 28, 2019

Taking your money by telling you the alternative is you can’t work there - call it whatever you want ok. I’m not going to play some semantics game over wording. It’s wrong in my opinion, you like it, we get it.

Wuzzie · Jul 28, 2019

22 minutes ago, Rionoir said:
Taking your money by telling you the alternative is you can’t work there - call it whatever you want ok. I’m not going to play some semantics game over wording. It’s wrong in my opinion, you like it, we get it.

Oh for heaven’s sake are you being deliberately obtuse? In right to work states, which are the majority in the US, you cannot be forced to join or pay dues to a union as a condition of your employment. It’s the friggin law. You keep spewing this nonsense about unions stealing from you when it’s been pointed out that that isn’t the case yet you double down on it over and over. It isn’t semantics it’s your lack of understanding what “right to work” means.

Rionoir, ADN, RN · Jul 28, 2019

It would seem you are the one that didn’t read from the beginning and are now being obnoxious because the conversation isn’t what you thought it was so ?‍♂️ You are also stereotypically the type of person that pushes unions on people and a really good example of why people hate them so much...

Wuzzie · Jul 28, 2019

2 hours ago, Rionoir said:
It would seem you are the one that didn’t read from the beginning and are now being obnoxious because the conversation isn’t what you thought it was so ?‍♂️ You are also stereotypically the type of person that pushes unions on people and a really good example of why people hate them so much...

?????????

FolksBtrippin, BSN, RN · Jul 29, 2019

On 7/28/2019 at 2:23 PM, Rionoir said:
It would seem you are the one that didn’t read from the beginning and are now being obnoxious because the conversation isn’t what you thought it was so ?‍♂️ You are also stereotypically the type of person that pushes unions on people and a really good example of why people hate them so much...

Your position is a little irritating for 2 reasons. For 1, you are not a nurse yet. You really should not act like you know what it is like to work as a nurse in a non-union hospital vs a union hospital because you don't know jack about either. Wuzzie has years of experience in both settings. You have no experience whatsoever. You should listen a little bit and learn something.

For 2, your position is anti-nurse. You are working against us by bashing unions.

I have clearly stated to you that I made more money after my dues in the union that I have in my non union position. I do NOT live in a right to work state, and had to join the union to work in the hospital where my wages were higher, the conditions were better. It was a no brainer for me. I still made more money than the RNs in the nearby hospital that was not unionized, AFTER my dues were taken out. Plus I had a real grievance process when my manager went after me and attempted to toss me under the bus. The union stopped her from getting away with terrible abuse, many times. You may one day have a monster of a supervisor. This is pretty common in nursing. You better hope you have a union, or that person could literally ruin your life.

Your belief that you could possibly negotiate on your own against a giant hospital is extremely naive. I don't know how you could possibly believe this, unless you are a very young person who was poorly educated on American Labor history.

You owe it to yourself to learn about why we have unions. Look up the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory Fire. Read on the history of coal mining.

Rionoir, ADN, RN · Jul 30, 2019

I have experience with unions. They are all the same. Hard pass.

You know, if I get unlucky and have a bad manager I'll just go somewhere else and do us both a favor if we can't resolve it. There is no shortage of places to work in my area. At all. I may not have a lot of experience, but you have zero experience with my area. I've started an externship already, I have family and friends that nurse in this area... I'm extremely happy with the way things seem to operate around here. I'm sorry if you all come from a *** system, maybe you should move.

db2xs · Sep 28, 2019

On 6/22/2019 at 3:46 PM, RNBSN08 said:
Hello,
I am working at a hospital which trying to become union. I am a pool RN and am wondering how this will affect nurses as a whole in my hospital if union were to get voted in and am looking for any input from pool/per Diem RN’s and effects on them specifically. Thank you so much for your input!!

While I don't agree with forcing RNs to be in the union, I think being union is great and I wish I could still be. I think it is worth it.