To tattle tale or not tattle tale... that is the question.

lmpotter · Aug 6, 2005

I understand what the thread is about, and we all have those nurses that believe that they will look better if they belittle and berate their peers, but it really is because of their insecurity in their own practice. The bigger issue is some of the posts that are stating that they don't see the big deal with lines not being properly labled, etc, and I get concerned with nurses who perceive that they are "protecting" their peers by not reporting. This creates an unhealthy environment and eventually complacency in practice or "protecting" our peers leads to entire units of substandard practices, this does affect patient outcomes. I don't believe we should support our peers that try to create drama and purposely look for any small thing to report to managers, they need to be confronted and held accountable for their behavioral issues and it can be done as peers and is usually more effective that way, but I also believe that we have an obligation to ourselves, our peers and our patients to hold each other accountable for standards of care, and this is often uncomfortable, and occasionally people feel picked on, but as professionals, we should expect to be held accountable for our practice.

Oh definitely...consistently bad practice needs to be dealt with. I suspect the guy you are talking about is a management pet, right? They usually are when they get away with leaving a mess every shift, I've noted. I've worked with a few of those too (and it seems guys do this more than gals) They don't 'clean up' because they think they're above it or something.
I believe what we are talking about in this thread is a different issue..the intentional dogging of good coworkers to find 'something' in order to make trouble for them and/or make the tattler look good to higher ups.

spidermonkey · Aug 6, 2005

Sounds like a bunch of 3rd graders rather than "professionals"!! I would look for another job, and not hold back on my exit interview!!!

Hey all.
There are quite a few nurses on my unit who have scored points with management and made a select group of other nurses look pretty bad by ratting out on them about pretty small insignificant stuff like so and so didn't date her lines or so and so didn't put one assessment in the computer for q 1hr neuro checks or so and so didn't have time to change her lines (because, well so and so admitted a 1:1 pt at 17:30 while still keeping the other stable pt anyway) and then there's always the arcane so and so didn't follow SICU protocol z even though she used critical thinking to solve the problem and advised the residents immediately, etc.
I've NEVER been a snitch for little stuff that didn't compromise the pt. As such, I have ended up protecting a few of the nurses who have now turned into snitch nurses. They are well respected not because they don't make mistakes but because the rest of us aren't petty enough to report them.
Well at any rate there are quite a few of them on my unit and I don't want to start biyatching about them but I'm tired of helping them look squeeky clean at the expense of others including myself and my friends.
Lately, one of my friends received a pretty crappy eval because of this phenomenon. She's more over it than I am... but my strong sense of justice is not letting me let go.
Any thoughts?

spidermonkey · Aug 6, 2005

I agree that management is to blame for toxic work environments. My manager despises tattle tales, she expects us to work out our differences between ourselves- if that is not possible, then the people w/the conflicts meet w/her & confront each other openly w/their complaints. My manager is very fair, does not play favorites, and believes in all of us; but she is not afraid to tell it like it is either. We all get along well, for the most part- but if you are not a team player, you will not last here. It is not a 'clique' - but it is the most professional group of people I have ever worked with-- not perfect of course, but a place I enjoy going to every day!!!

This kind of stuff goes on at my workplace on and off, too. Right now we seem to be in a lull. Someone got written up once for holding a 7am Prevacid on a pt who was NPO. ????? Why that report didn't get torn up, I don't know. Our manager, however, does not give much attention to all the back stabbing and petty complaints. In fact, she basically refuses to deal with much of anything of that nature. I think this helps keep it down.
All I can say is I'm really sorry you're having to deal with this type of work environment:o

kadokin, ASN, RN · Aug 6, 2005

Catty & rude, the exact attitude that makes nursing such a dog-eat-dog environment.
Now, to Bluesky, I too struggle in a less than ideal work environment. There are 10 nurses in our small ED & you are either on team A or on team B. I realized after several months of working here that these people are my co-workers, they are not my chosen friends. I come to work, I do the best job that I can - and yes, I make mistakes, yes, I have been written up for petty BS- I take care of my patients, collect my check & get home to my REAL life as quickly as I can.
There have been issues & incidents along the way that I do not agree with, my best advice to you is to choose your battles.
I hope things get better for you

Amen to that. I know this is harsh and, for what it's worth, it goes against my personal policy of TEAMWORK GETS THE JOB DONE, but if those nurses who are the cheif "tattle tales" have time to write up an incident report, or take notes on petty mistakes to share w/the manager later, they don't need MY help taking care of their pt. load. As one previous poster suggested, if it is not "my" patient, send someone to find the assigned nurse to take care of it. Or get on the call light and summon that nurse to come do her job. If you have time to snack and gab, you have time to respond to your pt's needs. I work w/too many people who think they are getting paid just to show up and not put forth any extra effort(and take care of personal business on company time). When I work w/them, I focus on MY pt load and refer all others to my co-worker. Certainly, I am available for help in an emergency situation, but, sister, I am not doing your work for you while you buff up your social life. Isn't it amazing how it seems these are the very same people who tend to "nit pick" and "rat out" their co-workers. It goes against my grain to be this territorial, but you have to stand up for yourself, we all have our limits, defend yours! BTW, document, document, document, and by that I mean keep a personal journal, at home, of what each day is like, it may come in handy if you have a face-to-face w/"tattle tales" and managers. If nothing else, this is a good tool for self-evaluation and self-esteem. Just sit back and think of all you have accomplished at the end of the day, by golly, you are a good nurse and a hard worker. No one has the right to run you down!

rnparrot · Aug 6, 2005

its interesting to read this thread because i worked night shift. there were 3 of us RN's sometimes 4 if we were lucky and our PCA's. one RN thought she was major suck up. she would report the petyist of all things, write us up for anything she could find. got to the point i was getting a little concerned that maybe it was really ME lacking or slacking. my paranoia came true one night. we had been having narcs stolen from the narc boxes on our floor, so of course we were all suspects....until i found out that I was the biggest one, to this day i will never know why. probably because of all the pety snitching that goes on there. turns out the thief was from a whole other floor! so you see all you snitches who have nothing better to do than see what everyone else is doing "wrong". mind your own business because someone always gets hurt. i no longer work there, thank the lord above! :yeah:

sayitgirl · Aug 6, 2005

I worked in an environment like that a couple of years ago. I quit that job. I'm sick and tired of working in "kindergarten" environments where the tattling and the backstabbing take place. I deserve to work in places that hire adults who know how to handle themselves as adults, so I refuse to ever work in a nasty environment such as that ever again. My loyalty is to my sanity, not to a place of employment that can't retain staff due to the petty crap that it allows to infest its dwelling place. If you value your sanity, your career, and your nursing license you'll leave that crabby job for someplace that practices the professionalism that it preaches.

You know what? Well said, very well said!

I went back to school to complete my RN and the first job that I took to complete my med-surg internship turned out to be one of those jobs. And believe it or not, it was a magnet status hospital. After a few months of trying to work within the system to correct the problem, I realized that there was no way to fix a broken wagon. I moved on. It was the best move that I could have made for my sanity and belief in the human race.

We are not put on the earth to suffer and then die.

MrRNman · Aug 7, 2005

Hey all.
There are quite a few nurses on my unit who have scored points with management and made a select group of other nurses look pretty bad by ratting out on them about pretty small insignificant stuff like so and so didn't date her lines or so and so didn't put one assessment in the computer for q 1hr neuro checks or so and so didn't have time to change her lines (because, well so and so admitted a 1:1 pt at 17:30 while still keeping the other stable pt anyway) and then there's always the arcane so and so didn't follow SICU protocol z even though she used critical thinking to solve the problem and advised the residents immediately, etc.
I've NEVER been a snitch for little stuff that didn't compromise the pt. As such, I have ended up protecting a few of the nurses who have now turned into snitch nurses. They are well respected not because they don't make mistakes but because the rest of us aren't petty enough to report them.
Well at any rate there are quite a few of them on my unit and I don't want to start biyatching about them but I'm tired of helping them look squeeky clean at the expense of others including myself and my friends.
Lately, one of my friends received a pretty crappy eval because of this phenomenon. She's more over it than I am... but my strong sense of justice is not letting me let go.
Any thoughts?

I'll tell you what, I'm really just a sit back and observe kind of guy. Oh, and believe me, it's not a mistake I am like that. What I have really noticed about the "General Hospital" environment is you can be really "tight" with one co-worker on one night (or day) and put that same person with another co-worker and they seem to "turn" on you. I'm definitely not shovenistic or anything, but, being a female dominate career, I find this happens mainly with my female co-workers. I'm not sure if you girls work with any male nurses or not, but, if you do, do you find that this type of scenario happens only with the female nurses? No biggie...just curious. :cool:

sayitgirl · Aug 7, 2005

I'll tell you what, I'm really just a sit back and observe kind of guy. Oh, and believe me, it's not a mistake I am like that. What I have really noticed about the "General Hospital" environment is you can be really "tight" with one co-worker on one night (or day) and put that same person with another co-worker and they seem to "turn" on you. I'm definitely not shovenistic or anything, but, being a female dominate career, I find this happens mainly with my female co-workers. I'm not sure if you girls work with any male nurses or not, but, if you do, do you find that this type of scenario happens only with the female nurses? No biggie...just curious.

From my experience, it depends on the individual. I have worked with men that do the same thing, flip the switch. It is more with females but I think because there are more women in the field.

Thunderwolf, MSN, RN · Aug 7, 2005

Toxic...oh way too toxic.

whipping girl in 07, RN · Aug 8, 2005

You really played yourself out by quoting my statement one word at a time and using the words out of context to imply that I am some kind of lazy nurse who just wants easy patients. That was a really manipulative. I never stated that I wanted easy patients. I stated that there is a group of nurses who consistently hook each other up and it creates a great amount of resentment among the rest of us who get the leftovers. I am one of many on my unit who after this B.S. will now no longer work extra shifts for example.

Sorry it's taken me so long to get back to the board. I apologize for sounding catty; that's not what I meant at all. As for "making friends with the queen bee," I was speaking from experience. When I came into ICU as a new grad I went through the same thing. Two "gomers" every night. After a year and a half, about the time I moved to a different state, I was just getting to where I got better assignments. Part of it was that there were other newer people to give the gomers to, and part of it was that my colleagues had gotten to know me, realized I was safe and knew what I was doing and didn't have to do a lot of handholding if I did have a really sick patient. It's difficult to make an assignment to a nurse if you're not sure they're going to be able to handle it and then be around to help them out if they can't. If you have lots of sick patients in the unit, and you have a sick patient, too (I'm speaking as a charge nurse now), you want to make sure the assignments are reasonable.

When I moved here, I started all over again in gomer land. By the time I got to where I was getting good assignments on nights, I went to days. I'm just now getting to where I get good assignments on days, and I made friends with all the nurses I could, even if I really thought they didn't like me (and I didn't like them either), I was still nice, friendly, helpful, and made sure to show them that I knew what I was doing; that I could handle a sick patient or difficult situations. When I say "make friends with the queen bee," that's what I'm talking about (not going out for drinks after work and going shopping together!)

It might help you if you kept a journal of your patients so you can look back and see what your assignments have been; you've probably been getting better stuff than you think. And any patient in ICU has the potential to become really sick, that's why they're in ICU. And maybe you're just so on top of problems before they get bad that they never really get sick on you (because you prevent it!)

I thought your post sounded whiny; if your colleagues think you're always whining about your assignment, they'll give you the worst one they can if they are even a little vindictive. If you come in every day with a good attitude, though, and try to learn whatever you can from whatever assignment you get. It may not be drips today, it may be how to deal with a confused patient. It may not be balloon pumps today, it may be how to break bad news to a family member. It may not be open heart surgery, it may be managing a-fib three days out from a CABG. But they are still things an ICU nurse needs to know. Also, if your colleagues don't like you and they know you're just in it for CRNA experience, you're almost guaranteed to get a sucky assignment every day. The long termers often resent teaching new nurses everything they know, only to have them leave just when they're getting pretty good.

If you really feel like you're in a toxic work environment that's making you ill, you should change jobs. But at least try to make some changes yourself first and see if it helps.

Good luck to you.

Konni

lmpotter · Aug 8, 2005

I agree with you MrRNman, women are the main participants in this type of "tattle tale" behavior. But I believe that it is not because it is a mostly female field but rather it is because men are and always will be more of the "Team" type players and approach work the same way. Women (girls) traditionally learn to play games and participate in play that is focused on individual...ie Barbie, house, dress up, so they don't learn to play well with others. Men (boys) rarely participate in play that is focused on individual, but rather they spend their entire lives participating in "TEAM' sports, and learn early the successs of working well as a team, even if they don't particularlly like the other boys they play with, the focus is always the team. I believe that this carries over to their adult life and that is why women in any field struggle to "play well with others", and really, it is not just limited to nursing. Women participate in this type of behavior even in male dominate professions, it is just not as easily received or rewarded as in nursing, because there is not many other participants in the behavior. Oh, and I think I know this first hand.....I am a Woman!

I'll tell you what, I'm really just a sit back and observe kind of guy. Oh, and believe me, it's not a mistake I am like that. What I have really noticed about the "General Hospital" environment is you can be really "tight" with one co-worker on one night (or day) and put that same person with another co-worker and they seem to "turn" on you. I'm definitely not shovenistic or anything, but, being a female dominate career, I find this happens mainly with my female co-workers. I'm not sure if you girls work with any male nurses or not, but, if you do, do you find that this type of scenario happens only with the female nurses? No biggie...just curious.

allnurses Guide · Aug 8, 2005

I agree with you MrRNman, women are the main participants in this type of "tattle tale" behavior. But I believe that it is not because it is a mostly female field but rather it is because men are and always will be more of the "Team" type players and approach work the same way. Women (girls) traditionally learn to play games and participate in play that is focused on individual...ie Barbie, house, dress up, so they don't learn to play well with others. Men (boys) rarely participate in play that is focused on individual, but rather they spend their entire lives participating in "TEAM' sports, and learn early the successs of working well as a team, even if they don't particularlly like the other boys they play with, the focus is always the team. I believe that this carries over to their adult life and that is why women in any field struggle to "play well with others", and really, it is not just limited to nursing. Women participate in this type of behavior even in male dominate professions, it is just not as easily received or rewarded as in nursing, because there is not many other participants in the behavior. Oh, and I think I know this first hand.....I am a Woman!

I'm not sure. Barbie was banned in my house and sports was emphasized.

My daughter never played with Barbie. She is an athlete. She played soccer starting at 6. She now plays volleyball and basketball and softball. She is an expert on skiis and also on a snowboard.

But, when she entered junior high school - the clique stuff and gossip stuff and backstabbing stuff got serious . ...

I've worked with lots of guys who gossiped and tattletaled . .. .

I'm not sure what to think . ... :uhoh3:

steph :)