They make me feel like a failure

EmerNurse, BSN, RN · Mar 13, 2007

I had an agency nurse, good nurse, very sweet (read young) speak with me about being nervous asking docs for things. Conversation went along just find until she said "you know, they're smarter than me and all, and so I'm intimidated...". Have MERCY I about jumped across the room at her. SMARTER than us????????????????????????????????

If a doc orders the wrong dose of a med, whose job is it to catch it before it gets to the patient (besides pharmacy who often misses it)?

If a doc forgets to address that K+ of 3.0 and he just ordered 40 IV Lasix BID, WHO reminds him?

If a doc drops the bad news bomb and walks out, WHO sticks around to deal with the fallout AND explain why he's really NOT insensitive, just busy.

If a doc orders a regular diet on a 90 year old with gums and her chin receeding to the back of her head, WHO asks for the puree?

If a patient goes into new-onset a-fib with RVR at 3am, WHO gets to call the doc (and listen to the whining).

If a patient is creeping into that warm stage of septic shock, WHO is it that asks for the cultures BEFORE the abx goes up AND jumps up and down for the fluids now?

If a patient is in pain and the T#3 isn't cutting it, WHO bugs the doc ad nauseum at 7pm, just to be nice and save him a call at 3am from the night nurse?

If a doc is giving orders on 5 ER patients at one time, at 1:30am, while on call, WHO is the one taking those orders and reminding him of the miriad of things patients needs/wants/should have on the floor because he didn't think of them and will get a call later to correct it.

And WHO is it that makes sure that new July interns don't kill anyone? Who word-for-word explains the order they need to write AND the rationale behind it?

Docs may not want to admit it, but NURSES got the patient's AND the docs back. WE think of all the other things that may be unrelated directly to diagnosis but are nonetheless necessary. WE are not allowed to follow a doctor's order blindly. "The doctor ordered it" is NOT a defense in our profession. WE are responsible for what happens to that patient.

Not as smart as a doctor indeed!!! We are not educated in the details of every single possible ailment out there, to be sure. We have not memorized 200 minor s/s of diffential diagnoses for vague abdominal pain. But by God, after a little experience, we know the biggies and many of the "smallies", don't we?

Our education is different, our focus is different, our scope is different but they are all COMPLEMENTARY to an MD, not inferior.

Until our own profession recognizes this, how in hell will anyone else? To the OP - what we do is an AMAZING thing and a severely necessary thing. And an endangered thing as our working conditions go down the tubes. Docs can see 30 patients a day right now precisely BECAUSE we are what we are. If we go away, or aren't what we are, the docs will be in a world of hurt - not to mention the patient.

Point out to all those "almost doctors" that you're going to school to be able to cover THIER butts, so they better get some respect quick. Cause you know what? I don't HAVE to ask you for more pain meds at 7pm. Patient isn't complaining just NOW, you know. I CAN wait until 2:30am to call you, when the patient IS complaining, can't I? Hey docs, DON'T MESS WITH YOUR NURSES~!

Woot -sorry for the vent!

jjjoy, LPN · Mar 13, 2007

To EmerNurs - I wish I felt that my nursing program had prepared me for the great responsibilities of nursing. They certainly let me know that "just following orders" wasn't acceptable and that I had to "use my critical thinking" and "use my nursing judgement" and "advocate for my patients" but I didn't feel that nursing school gave me much in the way of practical experience in honing those skills. I think most nurses make their first call to a doc after graduation. Most of the nursing care plans we had to create focused on the 'nursing' component versus the 'medical' component, thus lots of impaired mobility and risk for impaired skin integreity but not so much on the stuff that nurses need to have down. So for the first 6 months to a year, new grads are floundering, being asked to provide a higher level care than they are able to.

I'm getting off-topic here... apologies!!!!

RN BSN 2009 · Mar 13, 2007

if u get the "Why didnt you decide to be a doctor" just say that you were too smart to do that!

arciedee · Mar 14, 2007

You know, I used to feel somewhat inferior as a graduate of a college that was highly pre-professional, "I-can-top-you," etc. But you know what? I know anecdotally and through our class notes that there are a lot more of us who are pursuing nursing. I'm about seven years out of college now and I think a lot of us as we moved through our first post-college careers realized that nursing was the right fit for us. And I think there will be more people like us as we go along. Nursing offers a wide array of opportunities that extend far beyond the bedside and those are going to attract the people that previously might have pursued medicine or law or business. I think we are just the pioneers in this movement.

So don't allow a few ignorant comments to hold you back. You have to hold your head high and know in your heart that you are doing what is right for you. Tell people why you want to be a nurse... and if they don't understand then just let it drop. What's important is that YOU'RE happy with your choice.

iriska_meller · Mar 14, 2007

I just wanted to thank everyone who has offered their support on this thread, I really appreciate it. I feel that I am making the right decision, and all of your advice wil be really helpful in keeping in mind that I am right. Thanks again!

beth66335, BSN, RN · May 23, 2007

Hi everyone... This thread is totally non-practical, just to vent and get some moral support...
The story is this. I am graduating from a very good college (not Ivy, but still very good), with BA in chemistry and minor in biology. I am most likely going to Columbia's BSN/MSN track. I personally am very excited and happy about my choice. Here is the problem, however...
Most kids in my class are going to med schools, dental schools, law schools, MBA programs, or simply get $5000 a month jobs at top firms right after graduation. And me... well, I am going to NURSING school. Even though it may be an ivy school, still - nursing. Yeah, and don't forget the fact that few people actually know who NPs are. Every day someone in my school asks me - so why don't you go to med school? :angryfire And when I tell them that may be I DON'T WANT TO GO TO MED SCHOOL, they look at me in such a way... One girl, who's teaching a lab in my school and doing a PhD in Chemistry actually said to me - May be you don't want to be challenged...
Just today I talked to a girl who graduated couple of years ago, we took some classes together - and now she is a dentistry student. When she learned I have a little kid, she said - so that's why you don't go to med school... Again, as an obvious implication - you got yourself tied down, now you have to settle for whatever...
I would really appreciate some advice on how to handle this kind of questions and statements about me... They really bring my enthusiasm down, and make me think - may be I wasted my time and will not make my best... Eh, ok, I'm getting confused. Any moral support will be much appreciated!

NURSES RULE!! DRS WOULD BE LOST W/O US!!! YOU GO GIRL!!!

Praise,RN · May 23, 2007

Dear Beth,

Don't live your life based on what others say or think about your choice of career. I can't imagine changing my career because of what someone else thinks. I suggest you do some soul searching and figure out your passsion. I myself would not take anything for my nursing career. I love it. I made over $69,700+ year 2006 working only 2 days (Sat/Sun) 64 hours per pay period, full benefits as an RN supervisor. I have Mon-Fri to myself and if I choose to work somewhere else prn then its my choice and that adds to the $69+/annually.

Discover your passion, not popularity,

~Praise,RN

TheCommuter, BSN, RN · May 23, 2007

I would really appreciate some advice on how to handle this kind of questions and statements about me... They really bring my enthusiasm down, and make me think - may be I wasted my time and will not make my best... Eh, ok, I'm getting confused. Any moral support will be much appreciated!

I'd hate to sound harsh, but you owe absolutely nobody an explanation regarding your choice of educational attainment.

Nursing has a working-class, 'pink collar' history that will be immensely challenging to overcome. When someone thinks of a prestigious occupation, the terms 'doctor,' 'lawyer,' 'professor,' 'physicist,' 'engineer,' and 'therapist' come to mind. Nurses are regarded as helpful, but not prestigious. Also, many people do not know about the lengthy educational requirements, abstract thought, and important decision making that comes with being an advanced practice nurse (Nurse Practitioner).

You can choose to educate the ignorant souls, or you can simply choose to ignore the nay-sayers.

LaceyRN · May 23, 2007

I am getting so tired of nurses feeling the need to make excuses for our choices (not any of you dear folks, just in general). I say, I am totally happy there are physicians in this world, we all need a job, but I would feel so claustraphobic in the medical model........problem, fix problem, move on. Nurses are holistic, we come from strong theories of caring where people are seen as individuals and our role is more of deep connection and assistance in coping with change. Our role is different. Maybe it's because I haven't been in a hospital for 20 years and run a nurse run clinic, but good land, we have so much to be proud of........we have such amazing leaders, we are often afforded the priviledge of being with a patient in their most vulnerable time and we rock at finding their dignity. I think we made a wonderful choice to be nurses. I would want nothing less.

:yeahthat:

VERY well spoken and so true!

mimi1jb · May 23, 2007

I agree with many individuals here. Nursing is a great field to go into, but you should not feel discouraged. Everyone doesnt want to go to medical school and prefer nursing. Im a perfect example of that. I do knwo where your coming from. Just be honest, and tell them your passion is ursing. :)

Have a great day!

ICRN2008, BSN, RN · May 23, 2007

I understand how you feel.. of my closest friends from high school and college there are 3 MBAs, an MD, a PhD candidate, a PharmD and a PhysD (psychology). The only one who didn't finish grad school yet took a NOLS course and is now teaching people how to backpack through the wilderness. When they hear that I am going for my NP, many of them say "Why don't you just go to med school?" My husband's bosses wife actually said to her daughters (in my presence)- "She's going to be a nurse practitioner- that's almost as good as a doctor"!

In college, one of my best friends said to me "You're just going to move back to your hometown, get married, have babies and forget about med school." And that's exactly what I did (except that we don't have kids yet)! The truth of the matter is that I am perfectly content in my decision. I am very happy that I decided to go into nursing. For many of my friends, career aspirations take up most of their time and energy at the expense of personal relationships, so they don't understand how I could choose a different path. Your daughter most likely had an impact on your decision to pursue your NP, but that's really nobody's business.

At the other end of the spectrum, now that I've been married almost five years I am facing almost constant questioning from my entire family (and my husband's) about when we are going to start having children. When I tell them that we will have kids when I finish graduate school I get some funny looks.

In the end, I think that you have to be secure in your decision and not let yourself be bothered by what other people think. Saying something like "You are my friend and I hope that you will support my decision" will shut down the conversation pretty quickly. Everyone feels so free to share their opinions that they don't stop to think about how their comments might hurt their friend or family member's feelings. Reminding them once is usually enough in my experience.

misterniftypants · May 24, 2007

oh my god, what is with the jerks at your school?! it never fails to astound me how people can be so narrow minded. it sounds like those around you who are on the road to these $5000 a month jobs can't fathom that there are other options out there in the world. perhaps they'd have more respect for what you're about to do if they understood how much goes into being a nurse. maybe they think that nurses are glorified waitresses?

i started off working towards a degree in biology and changed my mind to get a BSN in nursing. all the bio and chem people around me couldn't understand it either.

isn't this site great for venting?