Shabbos/Religious Observances

[texasmommy]

As I begin the applications process for nursing schools, I have one huuuuge concern - my religious obligations. I am not permitted to work/attend school, etc. from sunset Friday nights until an hour past sunset on Saturday nights because of the Jewish sabbath. I've heard that a lot of programs have 12hr clinicals on Saturdays...yikes! Has anyone "worked it out" with similar obligations?

[texasmommy]

I am aware that there is little similarity between these two religious traditions. It was not my point to make a comparison. Just a comment and observation that many strict traditions do make exceptions and perhaps yours might.

While I am on the subject I did not mean to suggest that you are not familiar enough with the teachings of your own tradition. I suspect you are right on with what you are saying.

We do hold different ethical values and I guess that is where the problem with my understanding comes in. I know you have directed me else where with any further questions, but May I ask for clarification of one more thing, as you see it? I am at the moment more interested in what you as a believer think about this rather than what an Rabbi might tell me. That is not to rule out talking to a Rabbi after this.

My question is this. You talk about life threating situations where you are permitted to act. What is your practice if you have a sick family member? Not in a necessairly life threatening situation. Perhaps they are sick or disabled at home. How do you deal with this.

Again. I mean this with the most respect. I am trying to understand.

One is most certainly allowed to care for sick family members, etc on Shabbos. There are different ways that we do things (for example, applying ointments with the opposite hand or in a different manner to differentiate the ways we do things on Shabbos from the way we do them on weekdays), and also situations in which we must enlist the help of a non-Jewish person who is not observing the laws of the Sabbath. Working in a hospital situation is far different than caring for a sick child at home (which is an obligation). On Shabbos, religious Jews are not permitted to earn money, which would negate working altogether. The prohibition against working does not include certain things such as caring for the sick in many capacities. However, there are limits, and there are many stringencies. Each individual case must be properly evaluated and remedied accordingly.

[Tweety, BSN, RN]

Eight pages of talking religion without a TOS violation? Can it be true???

[vashtee, RN]

i guess i'm having trouble fathoming a teaching, that would take issue with those who minister to the sick and needy.

i would think that any God/all Gods would encourage human acts to those less fortunate.

if there are grey or updated teachings, then why not ascribe to the core values of the most generic meaning of Christianity?

leslie

You may have missed where it was said that a person must always act to save a life. In the event that the original poster was presented with a life or death situation on the Sabbath, I have no doubt she would act on that person's behalf. However, to agree to a schedule where you would routinely miss the observance of a core commandment would be unacceptable.

[Agnus]

Oh, I understand your point. And throwing in a "shalom" doesn't remedy your willingness to exclude this entire group of people because you don't want to cover on a Saturday.

I've worked with a lot of Orthodox Jews and we always managed to accommodate one another. The only complaints I ever heard were rare, and from those who basically resented Jews, period, and the "special privileges" they erroneously thought they were getting.

Whoa! I never said I resent Jew, Christians or any other religion. I am sorry you really do not understand.

Apparently you are unwilling to allow anyone who has different values. I can do nothing about that. It was NEVER my intent to turn this into a contentious situation. I came into it with the understanding that I had a very different point of view from others here. I understand the world does not operate on my understanding of ethics. I am trying to understand the view of the OP. Perhaps I was wrong and it is too much to hope for that religious people are peaceful and looking to promote understanding.

Get your dander down. I am not perfect. I may even stick my foot in my mouth here because of something I word awkwardly but to call me anti semetic and picking on Jews not where I come from.

Would you have felt better if I said "Peace" in English? I chose not to because of the topic. I thought this was a friendly discussion among rational people.

I am out of here

[leslie :-D]

Leslie, are you suggesting that the OP explore Christianity? Because that is simply impossible.

I'm getting a little confused. Aren't you an Orthodox Jew? Or did you mean something else?

no, i am not suggesting this at all...

please, allow me to clarify.

i would NEVER suggest such a thing.

first- i am not orthodox anything. my mom was Jewish but i never followed suit.

i realize i stated, "we orthodox nurses", and that was an error on my part.

second- when i use the word, Christianity, i am not referring to the formal definition.

for yrs, i considered myself to be a Christian woman, solely defined by my personal values, morals, ethics and acts on this earth.

but when my Christian friends pointed out that i did not accept Jesus as my personal savior, etc., i was indeed NOT a Christian.

i had (and suppose, still do) considered Christianity a life of Godliness, minus the teachings in the Bible.

so what i am asking, is if a nurse/doctor goes to work, to help the sick and suffering, wouldn't this type of ministry be acceptable to any one God?

leslie

[TazziRN, RN]

eight pages of talking religion without a tos violation? can it be true???

shhhhhhh!

we're doin' good here, go 'way!

[Tweety, BSN, RN]

shhhhhhh!

we're doin' good here, go 'way!

nope. the mods are all over this one. yes, you're doing well.

[Agnus]

Thank you to the OP for your explanation. It has helped a great deal.

[texasmommy]

As I said earlier, TM, I do not in any way think you are "wrong" for your beliefs or trying to stay within the restrictions of your belief. I just tried to point out another way of looking at it. As a Christian, if I have it way wrong, I apologize and will learn from this.

If I were your nurse manager (when you're licensed! ) I would have no problem with trying to help you observe the restrictions of your beliefs, but I just have a hard time understanding how any religious leader could see working on the Sabbath when there is no other feasible choice could be a sin and deny permission. I would never encourage you to go against your beliefs on the assumption that you would be forgiven later, unless there were an emergency.

Again, I am NOT offended by your question.

Glad to know that we are on good terms!

If there were absolutely NO other nurses who could do what I was able to do, then of course, I would be allowed to work in order to save lives. But in our society, as I said before, there are plenty of qualified professionals (even though there is a nursing shortage) who could offer the same services and probably would not mind working on a Saturday.

As a side note, in Judaism, our religious leaders do not make the rules, per se. Our rabbis interpret the laws and are able to make halachic (legal) decisions based on specific circumstances. Halacha (Jewish Law) itself is firmly based in the Torah.

[TazziRN, RN]

texas, i have a question:

i recently switched to home health, and we always have a nurse available 24/7. the only patients who get seen on weekends are the ones who need daily dressing changes or ivs or injections. how would an orthodox family handle that, if i needed to go to their home to care for a family member who was on iv meds? or, we often try to teach family to do some of the dressings or medicating, even the iv stuff. how does that fit with the work restrictions? i honestly want to know, just for my own information.

[SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN]

i had (and suppose, still do) considered Christianity a life of Godliness, minus the teachings in the Bible.

So Christianity is a life of Godliness if you ignore the Bible?

Now I'm totally confused!

Oy!

HELP!

[leslie :-D]

So Christianity is a life of Godliness if you ignore the Bible?

Now I'm totally confused!

Oy!

HELP!

i am not familiar with the teachings of the Bible.

everything i have done in my life, has been based on my 1:1 relationship with God.

yet most that are considered sins in the Bible, i have known already.

this has worked tremendously with and for me.

anything i have been taught, has been through thousands of personal conversations with Him, or through those who eminate and live under His hopes/will for us.

leslie