As an offshoot to the News article about nursing education, an opinion was brought to the board that LPNs are not adequately prepared to care for patients, and that their education is not strenuous like an RN program is. Having been in the field for awhile, what is your opinion on the differences between LPNs and RNs, other than the legally different aspects (LPNs cannot do initial assessments or IVs in my state for instance)
I'm not looking to start trouble, but rather discuss the topic in an area other than an unrelated thread.
Differences in LPNs vs RNs (educationally, functionally, intellectually)
Best way to combat any possible negatives of the above
Advice for an LPN student (who is too far through her program to just throw it out and start over in an RN program - already applied for an LPN to RN program starting Jan 2010)
Should I really expect to run into attitudes in the workplace about my not being worthwhile as an employee and a care provider because I chose the path that I have? How do you handle it if you do?
There is a local small rural hospital that pays incredibly well for LPNs right out of school and who has been trying very hard to recruit us during clinicals... am I going to be inequipped to care for patients there because of my education? I would never want to get into a situation where patient care was compromised because my education was lacking somehow...
from What I have seen of the current LPN and LPN students is that most are using it that as a step to becoming a RN. there are many schools that offer the LPN program just for that. many of the 2 year and 4 year schools are backlogged with potentials that I found it would be quicker time fram and better money wise to do the lpn then progress with the lpn RN bridge then to try to get past the intersting and some quite lame entry reqirments.
The main thing is to never stop learning. if a person goes thourgh school get their test past and get a job and then stop learning. then that person should not be nursing. no learning is a brain stopped working
First of all, would all of you do me a favor? PLEASE stop calling me a PN, to me I hear P ON come to mind every time I see that written on here. I am an LPN, a real nurse too. Thanks . Okay now for this subject. I went to LPN school in 1979. Our program was 11 months long. We had clinicals 3 days a week, after our initial first quarter. While going to school, I heard someone say, why are you going to LPN school, they are going to do away with LPN's. Let's do the math, that was 31 years ago. Fastforward to graduation. Everyone who sucessfully passed our program, and was eligible for their working permit, had a job. Many of us were offered multiple positions, in nursing homes, hospitals, and doctors offices. Many of my classmates took jobs in the hospital where we did much of our clinical work, I went to work at a health related facility. During the 1980's I heard more and more about hospitals wanting to hire only RN's. This was a trend that continued for about 5-6 years, until, they realized that having an all RN hospital was very expensive and many RN's found themselves doing way more work than one nurse could handle. Then the nursing shortage reared it's head. Many positions went unfilled, whole units at hospitals closed due to understaffing. During that time, I was hired to work at a small hospital in my area on the Med/surg floor. LPN's and RN's worked side by side in all departments. I worked there for over 2 years, then went to work in a nursing home in my area. Meanwhile the nursing shortage continued and got worse and worse. Pretty soon the "all RN" thing became a phrase of the past. But then a new rumor started to go around, they were going to do away with LPN's , all LPN"S currently licensed would be grandfathered in as an RN, and from that point forward a new title would be given to RN's because they would have to have their BSN, but all RN's currently licensed would be grandfathered in to the new title also. Can you imagine the uproar? I believe, I might be wrong, but this was something being pushed by the ANA. It never happened. By the 1990's things had pretty much calmed down, but the nursing shortage continued. LPN's were being hired everywhere, as well as RN's, that were being wooed by big sign on bonuses at almost every hospital. Many of my RN coworkers and friends took them up on the bonuses, but soon found out, the bigger the bonus, the crappier( is that a word?...lol) the work conditions. Towards the end of the 90's something changed. Nursing got harder for all of us. Sitting down with a worried or scared patient was impossible. No longer was it easy to complete your shift on time. New paperwork reared it's ugly head it seemed like everyday! Write it here, write it there, then write it again. It made no sense, but it had to be done. Things went rapidly downhill from then on. Patients suing nurses, hospitals, and anyone in between. The nursing shortage was becoming critical. Then we have the last few years, many people out of work looking for a new career. More paperwork than anyone could have imagined, whether computerized or hard copy. Nurses not being able to use the restroom, let alone have a break. So it's been 31 years since I went to school and I can't help but think about in all those years I've always had a job and never had any trouble finding one. I do high tech pediatric home care,trachs, vents, feeding tubes. To all the new LPN students out there, keep on plugging, they'll never do away with us, they need us too much. Pretty soon it will "come around" again, being a nurse, is in your heart. LPN's rock!
Specializes in Med/Surge, Geriatrics(LTC), Pediatricts,.
I used to be in a rut being an LPN. I thought all I was good for was a long term care door mat for the RN's. You know, the LPN's do all the grunt work, the RN gets all the recognition and the LPN gets half if that, pay of the RN. Yadda, Yadda, Yadda. Then I moved to another town, and got a job with a home health agency. I must have gotten very lucky or God is watching out for me or something. This agency I'm with not only pays LPN's quite handsomely, but recognises the work we do, and the value we give.
In the beginning of my nursing carreer, I worked in a state that LPN's were recognised highly, we did IV starts, maintained IV's, a whole slew of tasks that when I came home to my home state, and hometown, started working in my hometown hospital, found out everything for the most part I could do in the other state, I couldn't do here. A lot of changes over the next 20 some years. Some places paid better than others, some let LPN's "do" more things, it all depended on how solid the RN base was so LPN's could have the supervision of the RN. It's not that we are any less intellegent than our RN counterparts, but RN's have had the further training that what LPN's have. For myself I went to a Nursing School that far surpassed quite a few College programs. I got what LPN's need in their training, how to be a good bedside nurse.
Now for my comments on the topic: "LPNs should be done away with altogether." My personal opinion is, even though I want to brige over and get my RN after 20+ years, I don't think LPN's should be done away with. We do have a valuable place in this family of Nurses. Some folks who go into Nursing, don't want the "paperwork" side of the job, they just want to take care of people, and that's what LPN's were started for in the first place, to do the bedside care so the RN could do the paperwork side of the care.
I do believe that RN students should be taught the valuability of LPN's and new grads should respect LPN's for their choice in vocation, and not treat LPN's any less than they would another RN counterpart. LPN's aren't any less intelectual, as I said befor, just the differences in what we've been taught. It's like the differences between a basic EMT and Paramedic. Is the basic EMT any less intelectual than the Paramedic because the basic chose to operate at that level? No!
So, rather than have Rn vs LPN wars, and fight to eliminate LPN's why not take a look at what the individual person's comfort level is, do they want to simply deliver good bedside care, including passing medications and other tasks that LPN's do. Take a look at the needs of the facility or agency where you work, are RN's in greater need, or can LPN's handle the work load? Remember too, in today's economy, going for that second year for the RN isn't always a financial option for most folks in school for nursing. On the same line, some facilities would go bankrupt if they had only a staff of RN's when LPN's are quite capable of doing the specific job required, but at a lesser pay than RN's, making it possible for the facility to stay in operation. I'm not saying LPN's should be "abused" or made to accept poverty level pay just to keep a job, but I do realize that an RN has more training, so they deserve the higher pay from an LPN.
My response is delving into that "can of worms" that goes along with this topic. The domino effect is one thing leads to another. And as many nurses out there who may or may not respond to this thread, is how many "worms" there are in this can. So, commrades, when making your responses, remember that this is just a topic to voice your opinions. Each facility, agency, town, state, wherever, are going to look upon the RN/LPN nurse pool in as many different ways.
was it to re stir the pot of LPN's vs RN's--was it to gain interest in the site---
sad if the reason was gain interest--------
the state nursing boards that promote the demise of LPN's sad the medical field is loosing some good confident and caring NURSES------does the initial RN behind the name make the person a better nurse/that cares or gives good care----------------------------------
I heard on a discussion interview recently that the nursing profession was the most " caddied, backstabbing, unprofessional career" in the last decade------this is just further evidence of the discussion---
I have been an LPN for over 40 years and I am very proud of it. I have given good care to patients/families/and organizations I worked for.
At one point RN's, associate/diploma/and 4 year degrees worked beside LPN's, each other learning from each other----l my self have taught Associate and Degree RN's how to insert NG tubes/ start IV's and insert urinary cathers--the nursing as a profession was to be proud of on all levels
I would not trade the experience and learning I have had for anything ------
There are very good LPN's and very good RN's----------as well as there are poor excuses for both RN's and LPN's
I have heard that the 2 year Associate RN is to be the replacement for the LPN-----that way the insurance companies can pay more for the initials--------what about the care of the initials----
There are many reasons an LPN wishes to stay a LPN----financial/family situations/why should anyone discourage another from wanting to be a nurse in any respect and going after education that will give an edge in this cut throat profession called NURSING---------
Specializes in Hospice, corrections, psychiatry, rehab, LTC.
I don't understand the attitude of those who would do away with LPNs. There always seems to be a group of nurses who want to set up a hierarchy (with themselves at the top, of course) that would further fragment the profession, or drive many out of it. Another example is those who either want to do away with AD RNs or create a subclass of RNs to push AD graduates into. They claim to want to advance the profession, but the ideas they propose would exclude most of the people in it.
DO NOT go for your LPN..BIG mistake!! HUGE!!! for the rest of your career/life you will be asked "when are you going to get your RN? " when you tell people you're a nurse they'll always say " an RN ?" and you'll feel "less than" when you say LPN..like that's not good enough or you couldn't make the grade..believe me, I've been an LPN for 33 years and it's been that way the entire time. LPNs are the ******* of the nursing world..at least that's the way we are treated.33 years ago they said they were getting rid of LPNs..it has yet to happen. thankfully the LTCs are not just dumping grounds for the elderly anymore and you can get good experience with vents and trache's IVs and wound care...but you will always be looked upon as "less thak" and RNs do take advantage of us LPNs because they know we can do the work they can and will assign us alot of their work so they can sit around and do squat but get paid 15-20 dollars more an hour!! If you want to feel degraded for the rest of your life...by all means, be an LPN.
I am currently a RN. I started off in LPN in 2006. Personally, I think that I received more education during LPN school than what I did taking RN. The LPN program I took was very intense. The LPN program was much harder than my RN program. I actually felt bad for some of the traditional RN students during clinicals because they had no clue about many things. I was able to breathe a little easier during RN school because I had a pretty good knowledge base to start off with. Good luck and do not let anyone say "oh they're just an LPN" to you. I greatly value the LPN that works with me.
I don't know...maybe I've just been really lucky. I've been an LVN (in Texas) for just over 10 years. I started on a critical care floor working right along with the RNs. I started ivs, hung blood, drew from picc lines, basicly everything the RNs did. I have worked long term care, nursing homes and now work in a rehab hospital. When I jokingly say I'm just a Low Value Nurse I am quickly put in my place and told that we are all nurses. Yes where I work now the RNs are charge nurses but I still carry my load of patients, report to doctors, discuss my patients with the docs. Never have I been made to feel less because I'm an LVN and not an RN. Where I work now I even draw my own blood for labs. Don't ever regret being a LVN...after all we are all nurses regardless of the initials after our name.
Tsk,Tsk on you! I worked for many years as an LPN both in hospital and LTC. It is a fact that LTC facilities usually pay more to LPN's than Hospitals, if the hospital's in your area even use LPNs.
As far as not knowing what to do right out of school, RN or LPN, depends some on how well you did in school. If you just slid by and barely passed, yes you may have trouble at first. Also the extent of your orientation on your job. If you don't feel that you can do what is required to take care of a patient, please don't jump in. You will also learn the most on the job. School prepares you tremendously if you really put your all into it, but you will learn
more once you are on the job.
I feel the biggest difference in LPN and RN is the pay. I worked along side RNs and did everything they did except IV push Meds. Of course they were there should you find yourself needing help, just hope you are working with a good RN.
If you can in any way extend your education it is best that you do. If you can't be proud that you are a NURSE as a LPN.
LPNs are not adequately prepared for nursing? I'm an RN, and my schooling consisted of a lot of the nursing theory and diagnosis fluff. I mostly learned how to write papers and give presentations. Meanwhile, my friends in the LPN programs had much more hands on training. Then again, LPNs have many more privileges here in Texas.
LPN'S HAVE BEEN AROUND & WILL REMAIN AROUND. THERE ARE RN'S WHO DONT LIKE LPN'S HAVE NO RESPECT FOR THEM. THEN THERE ARE THE RN'S WHO DO HAVE RESPECT FOR LPNS. THEY WORK IN HOSPITAL SETTING. THEY ARE DRAWING, BLOOD. STARTING IV'S , GIVING IV MED'S. THEY TAKE GREAT CARE OF THERE PTS.
SO DONT SELL THE LPN'S SHORT. SOME GO BACK FOR THERE RN AND SOME DONT.
THEN THERE IS THE HOSPITAL BUGET OR NURSING HOME BUGET. I KNOW LPN'S WHO MAKE $27.00 TO $30.00 A HOUR. WITH BENIFITS IN NURSING HOMES. SOME LPNS WHO NEVER LEAVE THE HOSPITAL SETTING GO UP IN SALARY TO. LPN'S HAVE ALOT OF ON HANDS TRAINING. YOU WILL ALWAYS HAVE PEOPLE WHO THINK LPN'S ARE NOT NURSES. THAT LPNS ARE NOT ADEQUATELY PREPARED FOR NURSING.
IT WILL BE THIS WAY UNTIL THE END OF TIME. BUT BE PROUD OF BEING A LPN. WHO WORKS JUST AS HARD, MAKES LESS MONEY. I WOULD RATHER HAVE A LPN TAKE CARE OF ME THEN A RN WHO GO'S TO COLLEGE FOR 2 YEARS & STARTS WORKING. THE RN MAY HAVE MORE BOOK TRAINING. BUT THE LPN HAS THE HANDS ON TRAINING ALONG WITH BOOK TRAINING.
I was an LPN for 3 yrs before I received my RN. I believe their are needs for all levels of Nursing. As an RN, I have also worked with some outstanding LPN's! Being an LPN landed a strong foundation for my Nursing. I have NEVER had regrets about the Nursing route I have taken!!
Okay now for this subject. I went to LPN school in 1979. Our program was 11 months long. We had clinicals 3 days a week, after our initial first quarter. While going to school, I heard someone say, why are you going to LPN school, they are going to do away with LPN's. Let's do the math, that was 31 years ago. Fastforward to graduation. Everyone who sucessfully passed our program, and was eligible for their working permit, had a job. Many of us were offered multiple positions, in nursing homes, hospitals, and doctors offices. Many of my classmates took jobs in the hospital where we did much of our clinical work, I went to work at a health related facility. During the 1980's I heard more and more about hospitals wanting to hire only RN's. This was a trend that continued for about 5-6 years, until, they realized that having an all RN hospital was very expensive and many RN's found themselves doing way more work than one nurse could handle. Then the nursing shortage reared it's head. Many positions went unfilled, whole units at hospitals closed due to understaffing. During that time, I was hired to work at a small hospital in my area on the Med/surg floor. LPN's and RN's worked side by side in all departments. I worked there for over 2 years, then went to work in a nursing home in my area. Meanwhile the nursing shortage continued and got worse and worse. Pretty soon the "all RN" thing became a phrase of the past. But then a new rumor started to go around, they were going to do away with LPN's , all LPN"S currently licensed would be grandfathered in as an RN, and from that point forward a new title would be given to RN's because they would have to have their BSN, but all RN's currently licensed would be grandfathered in to the new title also. Can you imagine the uproar? I believe, I might be wrong, but this was something being pushed by the ANA. It never happened. By the 1990's things had pretty much calmed down, but the nursing shortage continued. LPN's were being hired everywhere, as well as RN's, that were being wooed by big sign on bonuses at almost every hospital. Many of my RN coworkers and friends took them up on the bonuses, but soon found out, the bigger the bonus, the crappier( is that a word?...lol) the work conditions. Towards the end of the 90's something changed. Nursing got harder for all of us. Sitting down with a worried or scared patient was impossible. No longer was it easy to complete your shift on time. New paperwork reared it's ugly head it seemed like everyday! Write it here, write it there, then write it again. It made no sense, but it had to be done. Things went rapidly downhill from then on. Patients suing nurses, hospitals, and anyone in between. The nursing shortage was becoming critical. Then we have the last few years, many people out of work looking for a new career. More paperwork than anyone could have imagined, whether computerized or hard copy. Nurses not being able to use the restroom, let alone have a break. So it's been 31 years since I went to school and I can't help but think about in all those years I've always had a job and never had any trouble finding one. I do high tech pediatric home care,trachs, vents, feeding tubes. To all the new LPN students out there, keep on plugging, they'll never do away with us, they need us too much. Pretty soon it will "come around" again, being a nurse, is in your heart. LPN's rock!
as a LPN.
LPN'S HAVE BEEN AROUND & WILL REMAIN AROUND. THERE ARE RN'S WHO DONT LIKE LPN'S HAVE NO RESPECT FOR THEM. THEN THERE ARE THE RN'S WHO DO HAVE RESPECT FOR LPNS. THEY WORK IN HOSPITAL SETTING. THEY ARE DRAWING, BLOOD. STARTING IV'S , GIVING IV MED'S. THEY TAKE GREAT CARE OF THERE PTS.
erwigg
54 Posts
from What I have seen of the current LPN and LPN students is that most are using it that as a step to becoming a RN. there are many schools that offer the LPN program just for that. many of the 2 year and 4 year schools are backlogged with potentials that I found it would be quicker time fram and better money wise to do the lpn then progress with the lpn RN bridge then to try to get past the intersting and some quite lame entry reqirments.
The main thing is to never stop learning. if a person goes thourgh school get their test past and get a job and then stop learning. then that person should not be nursing. no learning is a brain stopped working