"Circulating is so easy"

CDNORRN · Jun 22, 2007

I laughed out loud for some time at this comment. I consider myself good at both roles but if I'm having a day that I'm just not "on my game", I will choose to scrub. I still do a bang on job scrubbing but can hang out in my own little world.

P.S. As an RN scrub, you are still acutely aware of all the other things going on in the room that a CST might not. Don't get me wrong, I have worked with some amazing techs!!!

passionate · Jun 25, 2007

I was a surgical technician for 7 years before becoming an rn. I have scrubbed and circulated. There is nothing easy about any of it. Because I have always been part of a "team" I would want ffrom the technician to verbalize what she/he thinks is so easy about circulating. After a hard day of scrubbing I can feel like circulating might be easy but after a long day of circulating, scrubbing would feel easy. That comment from others is so common--just acknowledge it, store it and move on. There are patients waiting.

ARTCHICK-RN · Jun 29, 2007

This Is My First Time Ever In A Chat Room. Quite Honestly, I'm Not Even Sure If I'm Doing This Right!!! However, After A Hard Week At Work, I Just Wanted To Say That--thank God The Struggle Between Circulator And Scrub Doesnt Only Go On In My Hospital. I Have Been Circulating For 2 Years Now And It Is Almost As If I Were Reading What The Rns Here Go Through!

It Is Techs Hate Rn's, Every Day Backstabbing, Remarks And Walking Into A Group Of "friends" Who All Suddenly Stop Talking And Begin Looking At Each Other When An Rn Walks Into A Room. How Can We Attain Respect On Any Level?

GadgetRN71, ASN, RN · Jun 29, 2007

This Is My First Time Ever In A Chat Room. Quite Honestly, I'm Not Even Sure If I'm Doing This Right!!! However, After A Hard Week At Work, I Just Wanted To Say That--thank God The Struggle Between Circulator And Scrub Doesnt Only Go On In My Hospital. I Have Been Circulating For 2 Years Now And It Is Almost As If I Were Reading What The Rns Here Go Through!
It Is Techs Hate Rn's, Every Day Backstabbing, Remarks And Walking Into A Group Of "friends" Who All Suddenly Stop Talking And Begin Looking At Each Other When An Rn Walks Into A Room. How Can We Attain Respect On Any Level?

It's hard-you know what though? I'm starting not to care if they like me or not..people like that get off on making you doubt yourself and some people you can never please, so the heck with them.

HeatherB,CST · Jun 29, 2007

This Is My First Time Ever In A Chat Room. Quite Honestly, I'm Not Even Sure If I'm Doing This Right!!! However, After A Hard Week At Work, I Just Wanted To Say That--thank God The Struggle Between Circulator And Scrub Doesnt Only Go On In My Hospital. I Have Been Circulating For 2 Years Now And It Is Almost As If I Were Reading What The Rns Here Go Through!
It Is Techs Hate Rn's, Every Day Backstabbing, Remarks And Walking Into A Group Of "friends" Who All Suddenly Stop Talking And Begin Looking At Each Other When An Rn Walks Into A Room. How Can We Attain Respect On Any Level?

You know, I really do not want to start a war here or anything, but I feel this needs to be said. As a training surgical tech, I know that many techs feel the same way. There are circulating nurses out there who try to make the techs feel like they are under-educated "ancillary staff" who do not deserve to be in the OR. There are bad apples on both sides. I'm not defending the techs with shoulder chips. The back-stabby stuff isn't okay on either side. Both roles deserve respect, so both roles should behave respectfully.

It is hard for a CST with a degree to hear that they aren't educated enough. I will have completed an AAS and a certification by exam, the highest education available for a CST (save for the BST I will mention in a moment), before I work in the OR. I'm taking A&P, Microbiology (with nursing students at my school) as well as training in pharmacology, aseptic technique, surgical procedures, and a year of specialized lab and clinical training. Once I begin working, my goal is to further my education to a BS, first assist certification, or both. A diploma LPN could have no more months of schooling than me and circulate, so it's unfair to say that all nurses are better educated. Many are, some aren't...it's just DIFFERENT education. I won't be administering patient care in the same manneras the circulator, but I will be highly competent to perform the tasks within my scope of practice.

The OR team is a TEAM and should work as such. Any competitive, insecurity or jealousy-related crap will only serve to compromise patient care. And THAT'S not okay.

As an aside, Penn State offers a BS in Surgical Technology. It's the only such program I am aware of. I don't know if this is where things are headed, but the fact that such a program exists at a reputable school means to me that Surgical Technology is a valid career choice, not BELOW a nurse, but alongside, where it belongs.

AEGER PRIMO - The patient is first. Think of that when you hear the backstabbers, and remind them why you all chose the OR -the patients. Advocate for them by not allowing the hostility to invade and compromise their care.

Thanks.

GadgetRN71, ASN, RN · Jun 29, 2007

You know, I really do not want to start a war here or anything, but I feel this needs to be said. As a training surgical tech, I know that many techs feel the same way. There are circulating nurses out there who try to make the techs feel like they are under-educated "ancillary staff" who do not deserve to be in the OR. There are bad apples on both sides. I'm not defending the techs with shoulder chips. The back-stabby stuff isn't okay on either side. Both roles deserve respect, so both roles should behave respectfully.
It is hard for a CST with a degree to hear that they aren't educated enough. I will have completed an AAS and a certification by exam, the highest education available for a CST (save for the BST I will mention in a moment), before I work in the OR. I'm taking A&P, Microbiology (with nursing students at my school) as well as training in pharmacology, aseptic technique, surgical procedures, and a year of specialized lab and clinical training. Once I begin working, my goal is to further my education to a BS, first assist certification, or both. A diploma LPN could have no more months of schooling than me and circulate, so it's unfair to say that all nurses are better educated. Many are, some aren't...it's just DIFFERENT education. I won't be administering patient care in the same manneras the circulator, but I will be highly competent to perform the tasks within my scope of practice.
The OR team is a TEAM and should work as such. Any competitive, insecurity or jealousy-related crap will only serve to compromise patient care. And THAT'S not okay.
As an aside, Penn State offers a BS in Surgical Technology. It's the only such program I am aware of. I don't know if this is where things are headed, but the fact that such a program exists at a reputable school means to me that Surgical Technology is a valid career choice, not BELOW a nurse, but alongside, where it belongs.
AEGER PRIMO - The patient is first. Think of that when you hear the backstabbers, and remind them why you all chose the OR -the patients. Advocate for them by not allowing the hostility to invade and compromise their care.
Thanks.

Excellent post. I don't think artchick was saying that all CST's are backstabbers though. I also have an associates in surgical technology in addition to my nusing degree. I was a tech for 6 years prior to becoming an RN. There are techs that are resentful and will undermine you, and when you are a new nurse, it can be a real problem. I am not saying that CST's are undereducated but there are some that step outside their job, and start telling the RN how to do theirs..I know for a fact that until you are the one circulating, you don't really get how stressful it can be. I think artchick was merely talking about the backstabbing, overly aggressive techs and not everyone. I don't want to start an argument either-just my 2 cents,

HeatherB,CST · Jun 29, 2007

I totally agree that artchick was not trying to say that all techs are backstabbing, and I didn't even disagree with her post. I'm sorry if it sounded like that. I only wanted to say that if there is animosity between techs and RNs in her OR, then I 'd put money down that the nurses are giving it right back to the techs. It's a two way street.

I'd bet that if the techs felt more valued for what they do, they wouldn't have to "prove themselves" by knocking the nurses. They aren't being "appreciated" financially, so it is that much more demoralizing when someone also acts as if though their contribution isn't worth a hill of beans. I suggest the nurses in this situation take the high road and do not allow the techs to upset you. Simply let em know that within their role, they are valued, and you expect them to value your contribution as well. Just my $.02

I sure hope this does not go on where I have my first job.

HeatherB,CST · Jun 29, 2007

Oh, also, I would like to add that I am sure I will never be able to fully appreciate how stressful circulating can be. You all have my utmost respect.

RN Zeke · Jun 30, 2007

A "scrub nurse" may be a surgical technologist, RN, LPN, and more titles also, that is passing the instruments, supplies, whatever's to the Dr.(s). A circulator is the RN working the room, keeping every "thing" and everyone, running smoothly. All while charting, monitoring, playing secretary as needed and the list goes on.

I have to agree as one knows their job they make it look easy.

I worked as a Surgical Tech. for a few years and am a nurse now. I would never say all circulators sit on their butts. If sitting they are charting like mad, document, document, and more documentation. Who gets all the supplies, instruments, medications, and misc. while the rest of the room is scrubbed in? It is unfair to make such a statement unless one has worn the shoes of a circulator and or a surgical technologist.

JLynnOR · Jun 30, 2007

My immediate reaction to the thread title was "Ooh, those is fightin' words!" I've hearded nurses who should know better say equally insensitive and false things about scrubbing. (I often like scrubbing more, but that doesn't make it any less challenging).

I agree with the poster who said that this statement is often uttered due to bitterness about compensation. The sad matter is that, yes, many ST's go to school for 2 years and many RN's go to school for 2 years. This makes many techs bitter that they're not getting paid the same. However, nurses do ultimately have more responsibility. One tech I work with (when not complaining that he doesn't get paid enough) laughs and says, "Yup. I'm not a nurse. I don't deal with all of the P's: Paperwork, phones, pagers, poop, puke." Unfortunately, if ya' want to make the money, you've got to take the good ($$) with the bad (nursing school being a broader prep for a professional practice, "wiping butts," [a reason I've heard techs list as why they didn't go to nursing school] and more legal responsibility).

Back on topic--I wouldn't be caught dead saying that either is consistently easier or harder. Anyone saying differently about either role is just stirring the pot!

HeatherB,CST · Jun 30, 2007

My immediate reaction to the thread title was "Ooh, those is fightin' words!" I've hearded nurses who should know better say equally insensitive and false things about scrubbing. (I often like scrubbing more, but that doesn't make it any less challenging).
I agree with the poster who said that this statement is often uttered due to bitterness about compensation. The sad matter is that, yes, many ST's go to school for 2 years and many RN's go to school for 2 years. This makes many techs bitter that they're not getting paid the same. However, nurses do ultimately have more responsibility. One tech I work with (when not complaining that he doesn't get paid enough) laughs and says, "Yup. I'm not a nurse. I don't deal with all of the P's: Paperwork, phones, pagers, poop, puke." Unfortunately, if ya' want to make the money, you've got to take the good ($$) with the bad (nursing school being a broader prep for a professional practice, "wiping butts," [a reason I've heard techs list as why they didn't go to nursing school] and more legal responsibility).
Back on topic--I wouldn't be caught dead saying that either is consistently easier or harder. Anyone saying differently about either role is just stirring the pot!

EXACTLY!!!! I chose ST over nursing school because I wanted to work in the medical field but, in my exact words at the time, "circumvent the cleaning up of poo." If it was workable, I'd be going to med school, but that just isn't gonna happen for me so scrubbing is how I will begin my career in medicine. I don't want to be a floor nurse, and I don't want to chart all day, or take care of 10 patients at a time. I am going into this knowing the pay is less, and I'm totally ok with it and understand why. I still think the job deserves more respect, and more pay would send a message that it's valued by the hospital, but that's another thread entirely.

I have a lot of respect for nurses, because quite honestly, I'm glad someone else is willing to do it so I can scrub all day LOL

ARTCHICK-RN · Jul 2, 2007

You know, I really do not want to start a war here or anything, but I feel this needs to be said. As a training surgical tech, I know that many techs feel the same way. There are circulating nurses out there who try to make the techs feel like they are under-educated "ancillary staff" who do not deserve to be in the OR. There are bad apples on both sides. I'm not defending the techs with shoulder chips. The back-stabby stuff isn't okay on either side. Both roles deserve respect, so both roles should behave respectfully.
It is hard for a CST with a degree to hear that they aren't educated enough. I will have completed an AAS and a certification by exam, the highest education available for a CST (save for the BST I will mention in a moment), before I work in the OR. I'm taking A&P, Microbiology (with nursing students at my school) as well as training in pharmacology, aseptic technique, surgical procedures, and a year of specialized lab and clinical training. Once I begin working, my goal is to further my education to a BS, first assist certification, or both. A diploma LPN could have no more months of schooling than me and circulate, so it's unfair to say that all nurses are better educated. Many are, some aren't...it's just DIFFERENT education. I won't be administering patient care in the same manneras the circulator, but I will be highly competent to perform the tasks within my scope of practice.
The OR team is a TEAM and should work as such. Any competitive, insecurity or jealousy-related crap will only serve to compromise patient care. And THAT'S not okay.
As an aside, Penn State offers a BS in Surgical Technology. It's the only such program I am aware of. I don't know if this is where things are headed, but the fact that such a program exists at a reputable school means to me that Surgical Technology is a valid career choice, not BELOW a nurse, but alongside, where it belongs.
AEGER PRIMO - The patient is first. Think of that when you hear the backstabbers, and remind them why you all chose the OR -the patients. Advocate for them by not allowing the hostility to invade and compromise their care.
Thanks.

I THINK YOU ARE RIGHT IN THE SENSE THAT EVERYONE WANTS TO BE VALUED. WHETHER YOU ATTEND A VOCATIONAL TRAINING PROGRAM OR GO TO A UNIVERSITY. HOWEVER, I WOULD LIKE TO ASSURE YOU THAT IN OUR OR-AMONG OUR NURSES THERE IS NO DISREPECT GOING ON THAT CONCERNS EDUCATIONAL BACKGROUND. WE ARE A TEACHING HOSPITAL AND I CANT EVEN BEGIN TO TELL YOU THE NUMBER OF SCRUB TECH STUDENTS WHO ROTATE THROUGH OUR OR WHO COME BACK AND TELL ME THEY ARE ASOUNDED AT HOW MUCH CONTROL THE TECHS HAVE IN THE OR'S. THEY HAVE NO REGUARD FOR ANYONE EXCEPT THE PHYSICAN. IT IS NOT RIGHT. OUR RNS TRY TO DO AS MUCH AS WE CAN TO HELP WITH CLEANING AND TURN OVER- HOWEVER IF WE FORGET TO EMPTY THE TRASH BECAUSE WE HAD TO STAY AND RECOVER A PATIENT IN PACU THEN THE CRAP HITS THE FAN AND YOU CAN BET THAT FOR THE NEXT COUPLE OF DAYS THERE ARE GOING TO BE DIRTY LOOKS, COMMENTS AND COLD SHOULDERS. CAN YOU OFFER ANY ADVICE ON HOW TO HANDLE SUCH SITUATION? AS FOR EDUCATIONAL BACKGROUND I WOULD LIKE YOUR OPINION: DO YOU THINK THAT A CST DESERVES MORE $ THAN A ST AND SHOULD A BSN GET MORE $ THAT AN ADN? IS ONE MORE VALUABLE OVER THE OTHER? WHEN SHOULD EXPERIENCE VS EDUCATION TILT THE VALUE WHEEL?