PETH testing

Universe93B · Jan 27

Abgirl said:

Has anyone heard of them testing for nicotine? Random question because I pulled option 17 today and when I Googled 17 panel (I know they have their own panels) it had nicotine listed. There is no way they test for this too? Can't wait for this to end.

A dried blood spot test can test for cotinine - which shows nicotine use. It's just included in the panel for our DBS tests, but it's not anything they can take action on. Cigarette smoking is not on the list of substances not allowed.

LMRN2003, MSN, RN · Jan 30

NurseJackie69 said:

Careful there because many people know that alcohol (often rum based) in vanilla extract is deactivated when it's cooked, so no worries there, BUT...........the problem rests in the Icing that is NOT Cooked and that can get people nailed. Not all vanilla extracts contain alcohol (rum) but many do, and when used, it's sometimes not just used for a cupcake itself (which is cooked) but also sometimes used in the Icing, that is not cooked.

In the rare event that someone tests positive for alcohol due to cupcakes or birthday cakes etc. It will Not be the actual cake (middle part) that gets them. It will be the icing.

I definitely consumed cake and donuts with icing, etc., during probation and never had an issue. People must be consuming exorbitant amounts.

NurseJackie69 · Jan 30

Timing is critical. Within 12-14 hours, it's gone. It's rare that it happens for a positive, when it does, it's the same story every time (that I have heard) and that is, nurse ate 2 cupcakes or a couple of high end desserts (cake) with icing made of rum-vanilla extract at 8 or 9 at night, then went and tested the next morning. Donuts have nothing to do with. It's not about "sweets or sugar." It's about vanilla extract that contains real rum and that would be found on cakes, cupcakes, or birthday cake Icing........sometimes. Has to be high end. About 3 out of 4 cupcakes or cakes you buy in a store today don't have real (rum bases) vanilla extract. Restaurants often do though.

Healer555 · Jan 30

I'm just avoiding cupcakes donuts and cake. This is really awful

NurseJackie69 · Jan 30

I like sweets and Friday is my day I eat cake. I avoid cupcakes and icing through the week, but I've been eating desserts and cake for over 4 years and never had an issue, but I always do it on Friday only, because I know by Monday afternoon, if selected on Monday, I'm easily OK.

Another rare way to test positive is when a nurse has loaded up on cake icing and they are at the start of an oncoming UTI. This is kind of a "double hit" that can occasionally trigger a positive.

Healer555 · Jan 30

NurseJackie69 said:

I like sweets and Friday is my day I eat cake. I avoid cupcakes and icing through the week, but I've been eating desserts and cake for over 4 years and never had an issue, but I always do it on Friday only, because I know by Monday afternoon, if selected on Monday, I'm easily OK.

Another rare way to test positive is when a nurse has loaded up on cake icing and they are at the start of an oncoming UTI. This is kind of a "double hit" that can occasionally trigger a positive.

You do this when not in monitoring? After I'm done with monitoring I'm going to live a normal life. I can't imagine living such a restricted life indefinitely. A blood alcohol level not peth seems like the appropriate test to be requested if an employer has a suspicion

Universe93B · Jan 30

Again, all of this is overblown and exaggerated. Eating cupcakes, cake and donuts will not cause a positive test. I've eaten cupcakes the night before a Urine etg and nothing has happened. I ate cupcakes all the time and have done peth tests and nothing came of it. Hardly anyone uses rum-based vanilla extract. Maybe don't eat that the morning of your urine etg test.

Once again, people where they had a positive urine etg will try to blame it on all kinds of other things. But in 99% of those cases, they actually did drink an alcoholic drink.

Healer555 · Jan 30

Universe93B said:

Again, all of this is overblown and exaggerated. Eating cupcakes, cake and donuts will not cause a positive test. I've eaten cupcakes the night before a Urine etg and nothing has happened. I ate cupcakes all the time and have done peth tests and nothing came of it. Hardly anyone uses rum-based vanilla extract. Maybe don't eat that the morning of your urine etg test.

Once again, people where they had a positive urine etg will try to blame it on all kinds of other things. But in 99% of those cases, they actually did drink an alcoholic drink.

If you're the 1% it really matters

Universe93B · Jan 30

Healer555 said:

If you're the 1% it really matters

That 1% drank an alcoholic drink (or 4 or 5 or more) and got caught with a positive urine etg. So doesn't matter if they ate a cupcake or not.

Healer555 · Jan 30

Universe93B said:

That 1% drank an alcoholic drink (or 4 or 5 or more) and got caught with a positive urine etg. So doesn't matter if they ate a cupcake or not.

I disagree. There are definitely false positive tests. Maybe from accidental ingestion or errors at the test site or by the lab technician

In my experience, the phlebotomists, my case managers and even the doctor who did my evaluation are not the smartest to put it kindly

NurseJackie69 · Jan 30

Universe93B said:

That 1% drank an alcoholic drink (or 4 or 5 or more) and got caught with a positive urine etg. So doesn't matter if they ate a cupcake or not.

False. 1 percent versus 99 percent. It's not exaggerating or overblown for the 1 percent that can have their life ruined. 99 percent of humans that fall 10 feet who are between the ages of 8 and 55 LIVE. 1 percent die. Is a 10 foot fall overblown or exaggerated? No, it's not.

NEVER give data or reach a conclusion on anecdotal evidence. Anecdotal evidence is "you eating cakes the night before your test and never having a problem." That's great, but when we take 10,000 humans (a large sample size that is More than "your experience") evidence shows that cake icings with real rum vanilla extract can cause a positive for ETG for some. "SOME" is enough for me to not want to take that chance. To each is their own. Nobody has ever argued that it's common. But, they have argued it CAN happen on rare occasions and research, actual research which is more than "your personal experience" says exactly that.

P.S. Nobody has ever stated vanilla extract made icing can trigger a positive PETH. Those are your words. Studies have shown they can, on rare occasion, if the timing is right, trigger a positive urine Etg. Lastly, donuts have nothing to do with vanilla rum based extract. Some cake icings do.

Universe93B · Jan 30

NurseJackie69 said:

False. 1 percent versus 99 percent. It's not exaggerating or overblown for the 1 percent that can have their life ruined. 99 percent of humans that fall 10 feet who are between the ages of 8 and 55 LIVE. 1 percent die. Is a 10 foot fall overblown or exaggerated? No, it's not.

NEVER give data or reach a conclusion on anecdotal evidence. Anecdotal evidence is "you eating cakes the night before your test and never having a problem." That's great, but when we take 10,000 humans (a large sample size that is More than "your experience") evidence shows that cake icings with real rum vanilla extract can cause a positive for ETG for some. "SOME" is enough for me to not want to take that chance. To each is their own. Nobody has ever argued that it's common. But, they have argued it CAN happen on rare occasions and research, actual research which is more than "your personal experience" says exactly that.

P.S. Nobody has ever stated vanilla extract made icing can trigger a positive PETH. Those are your words. Studies have shown they can, on rare occasion, if the timing is right, trigger a positive urine Etg. Lastly, donuts have nothing to do with vanilla rum based extract. Some cake icings do.

My point is that we have people posting on here who have changed their entire lifestyle and diet due to monitoring. That is a ridiculous way of going about it. Just use some common sense. But it's not good to use blanket advice for all these poor people in monitoring who have enough to deal with, and then people say "Don't eat cupcakes, don't eat cake, don't go out to eat, don't use your favorite perfume, don't use your favorite lotion." Give it a break. Those things don't cause false positives and if you look, there are some studies (not a lot) that show this.

Let's take something that could cause a false positive very easily - alcoholic mouthwash that is 40% or more alcohol. That seems like a lot of alcohol that matches that of liquor. There is a study that tests if it can cause a false positive. But if you ready the study, the participants switched alcoholic mouthwash for 15 minutes, for three times in a row and then took a urine etg test shortly after. Now that does not match real-world applications. But it shows you that use alcoholic mouthwash the night before would not result in any positive test.

Stop scaring everyone here with blanket restrictions on food and lifestyle. We have enough to deal with already.