The Circumcision Discussion

Specialties Ob/Gyn

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I know this can be a HUGE debate, and I'm not looking to start any arguments. I was just wondering as you are OB nurses. I'm expecting a boy in July and not sure if we should circ. or not. My husband says yes, it's better medically in the long run. My gpa who just turned 70 had to have a circ. due to endless complications lately.

As nurses in this area, is the medication that they use good? And what are some questions to ask my Dr. about it. I already know that my hospital i'll be at uses a med. when they perform it, I"m just wondering what you all think.

Thanks

Jen :)

Originally posted by huntsters

If you ever see an adult circumcision, you would never put him in a position to choose. The men are sore (putting it mildly) for several(low estimation) days and the complications are much higher as adults. I would never make my child have to make that decision when he is older. My son never had "psychological" problems about a diaper change other than his own modest personality which he still has. Let's get real, and think more for the child's sake in the future. There are more chances he will need to be circ'd as an adult than that he will have any complications from an infant circ. And truly, "woe" to the poor man who has to choose a circ as an adult!!!

I remember about 15 yrs ago, as a new nurse, assisting a doc perform a circ on a 15 yr old as an OP procedure. IV demerol and 20...count 'em....TWENTY lidocaine injections....

Poor kid, I don't know how the doc could tell what was what and what he needed to cut on the way all that lidocaine here and there deformed him (temporarily)

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Specializes in Specializes in L/D, newborn, GYN, LTC, Dialysis.

Kristi excellent post. I don't hear of too darn many men electing to be circ'd as adults cause they can't stand how it "looks"....it's up to US to let boys/men be OK with their anatomy as it is, not as it "should look". We need to be honest at least about WHY we elect to circ babies, who after all, have NO ability to sign any "informed consent" to the procedure they will endure. WE can at least be HONEST and INFORMED as their parents.

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Originally posted by Rustyhammer

I know this Dr. who does free circumcisions....

...he only takes tips.

-Russell

Oh Groan!!:rolleyes:

Circumcision: NOT medically indicated

MY SONS? Circumcised, to "match" their dad, HIS preference

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Originally posted by huntsters

As an OB nurse, I would like to clarify something. I have watched numerous circumcisions, and the most amazing thing about the circumcision, is that by the time the Dr. is actually "cutting" the foreskin, the baby is usually quiet, unless he was just a fussy infant. The baby mostly screams when he is being strapped down (for his own protection), and the cries come when the dr places the "bell" over the member. When he tightens the clamp, most of them actually get quiet because it must become numb. Many babies actually suck their pacifier through the rest of the procedure, which is only about 2 minutes. I'm sure the rawness is painful, which is why the mothers put vaseline on the circ for about 5 days. If you let them stay wet, I'm sure that is painful, too. Quick diaper changes take care of that, and it is only for the first 2 days at most.

NOW, let's compare this to giving an "older male his choice". If you ever see an adult circumcision, you would never put him in a position to choose. The men are sore (putting it mildly) for several(low estimation) days and the complications are much higher as adults. I would never make my child have to make that decision when he is older. My son never had "psychological" problems about a diaper change other than his own modest personality which he still has. Let's get real, and think more for the child's sake in the future. There are more chances he will need to be circ'd as an adult than that he will have any complications from an infant circ. And truly, "woe" to the poor man who has to choose a circ as an adult!!!

Why would a grown man have more chances of needing a circ? Most of the men in Europe, South Africa, Canada and Australia are intact and they all lead normal healthy lives. All the men in my family are intact and there has never been a need for any of them to be circed later in life.

Additionally, if it hurts a grown man I'm sure it hurts a baby worse since the foreskin is fused to the glans and part of the procedure is ripping off the foreskin (like ripping off your fingernail). In an adult the foreskin is already retractable. Also an adult can use the toilet and doesn't have fresh urine and feces to sting the wound like a baby does in a diaper.

More and more men are getting foreskin restoration done. I can't remember the name of the magazine that had the article about it, I think it was Maxim. They take the skin from the scrotum if you decide to do it surgically and then there are other methods of stretching the skin. So yes, there are more and more men unhappy with their status of being circumcised and are doing something about it.

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Interesting thread here...

Not wanting to repeat many of the comments that have been said repeatedly here, I do have something to add...

In our area, welfare/medicaid is now refusing to pay for newborn circumcisions. Many of our local insurance companies are following suit. Few of our parents want to pay the $300 procedure fee out of pocket. This is having a dramatic effect on our circ rate, to the point that I'd say non-circumcised is now the norm, not vice-versa.

Is anyone else out there experiencing this?

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That's true where I am as well. It has been considered an elective cosmetic procedure for years and parents have had to pay for it since then. It does seem to make up the minds of those who had no strong feelings either way.

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As of July 1, 2003, none of the insurance companies will be paying for the circ. Why???? Because circumcision is a cosmetic and not a medically necessary procedure.

The arguement to have a circ because of the miniscule chance of penile cancer......You've got to be kidding. Do we take little girls ovaries out, or do mastectomies just to aleviate that risk latter in life?

Just a thought!

By the way....both of my boys are circ'd...but 24 yrs ago, the question was "do you want a circ" ,,,,I said yes....no other discussion or education. About 4 yrs later, I began to read more about the procedure...and I would not make the same decision again.

But, I have healthy children and I do not feel guilty about the decision....I made a decision based on what I knew at the time.

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I never thought much about circumcisions being that it was the "norm" in the U.S., and my brother and just about everyone else was circ'd. It was only after I learned that most of the men in the world are not circumcised, and the so-called benefits are really nil. European men, for example, do not have escalating rates of all the diseases that circumcision is supposed to prevent.

There were a few studies which were saying that circumcision helped protect against HIV, but in reality, it doesn't seem to be the case. The U.S., which has one of the highest rates of circumcision, has much higher rates of HIV than European countries, where circumcision is not generally performed except for medical reasons.

At any rate, I feel that circumcision is a very invasive procedure, and it is mutilating a child without his consent. It is also rarely performed with any kind of anesthetic. I worked in the NICU, and I stopped assisting doctors in the procedure. Other nurses followed suit.

Informed consent, as one poster here noted, is not signed by the person being circumcised. :sniff:

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Specializes in ER,Neurology, Endocrinology, Pulmonology.

Roxanne, I applaud you for standing up for your belief. I had no idea you could refuse to assist with circumcision, because I completely dismissed the possibility of becoming mother/baby or ped nurse, just because I refuse to be a part of it.

This gives me some hope.

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Thank you, Anagray. A lot of nurses have been refusing to help with circumcisions. We have no power to stop it, but we surely don't have to participate. It would be rare that a child on a peds floor would be circumcized, unless it was for medical reasons. But in mother/baby and NICU, yes, it happens a lot!

However, a group of nurses in a hospital in Santa Fe, NM, formed a group called Nurses for the Rights of the Child, which is devoted to protecting children from circumcision. This is a link to their website: http://nurses.cirp.org/

Nurses have started to protest this. Just as nurses are not forced to participate in voluntary pregnancy terminations, so it should be with circumcision. The docs were surprised when I began to refuse, but no one really said anything. I guess they'd already heard it!

I also began to ask parents if they wanted to watch it, to see exactly what their baby was going through. Many of those that did said that they would never put another child through it.:kiss

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I agonized over this issue with my first son (as I've told here previously) . . .DAD wanted it done. Second son, I made DAD watch. He came out saying "that was cool". Divorced, Remarried. Had a daughter . . .whew!! :-) Then 12 years later had a son. DAD wanted him circ'd.

I think MEN are the ones who want their son's circ'd . . .

And that is an interesting question . . . . . let's ask the guys . .. .

Why do you want your sons circ'd?

steph

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God put that piece of skin there for a reason! We just don't know what that reason is.

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