Moms who want to feel absolutely NO pain

[HappyNurse2005]

This is another thing I didn't realize was as common as it is-people who want to feel zip in the way of pain. granted, most women who want epidurals do say that they want to wait until the pain is unbearable, or at least hurts somewhat.

I've had a few now that wanted the epidural BEFORE they had any pain, so they wouldn't have any pain at all. Had a pit induction today. her family was encouraging her to get the epidural before we started the pit. she wanted it asap. So technically, she wasn't even really laboring.

here the doc has to give the okay for the epidural. (female)resident says she's not in any pain, i think she should wait. i was trying to get an answer from her as to when she could get it. (ps-pt is 41 weeks, g1, 2cm). she then told me to ask the other resident b/c she didnt know.

so i asked the (male) resident and the (male) attending. they said go for it, but be more aggressive with her pit. actually, the male attending said "if i was going to get pit, i'd want an epidural. if i was in labor, i'd want one asap".

so, are women allowed to get their epidurals as soon as they want them, even if not in pain? or do htey have a centimeter amount they have to get to first?

(my personal opinion is that they should be able to have it whenever they want it, if there is no medical reason to wait. of course, i also make sure they know that though it won't hurt, you can't eliminate the pressure. )

[ZASHAGALKA, RN]

You may not have had pain then Timothy, but I bet you will if your wife reads this post.....:trout:

EX-wife. BTDT. Otherwise, I would have been too chicken to say that.

~faith,

Timothy.

[CEG]

I don't know what the big deal is. I had 3 boys and I didn't have an epidural or any pain management for that matter, and I don't recall hurting a bit.

~faith,

Timothy.

:chair: :chair: :sofahider :sofahider

I had to do a double take. My husband thinks he is funny when he says that, too!

[Gompers, BSN, RN]

I don't know what the big deal is. I had 3 boys and I didn't have an epidural or any pain management for that matter, and I don't recall hurting a bit.

~faith,

Timothy.

:chair: :chair: :sofahider :sofahider

Hardy har har har!

Wish my dad could say the same, but my mom actually punched him several times during her labor with me. She also ripped the buttons off the OB's lab coat while screaming for some drugs. At one point, she actually got off the gurnee and said she was going home.

I always think of Eric Cartman from South Park - "Screw you guys, I'm goin' home..."

And yet, this is the same woman who is encouraging me to go without an epidural. She said to take IV pain meds early on so I could get some relief and save my energy for later, but that she thinks I can do it on my own after that. Even though her labor was incredibly painful, she said it wasn't as bad as her gallbladder attacks and that at least she knew the pain wouldn't last forever so it was bearable if she thought about it that way. What she remembers most, more than the pain, she says, is that immediately after I was born, she felt wonderful. Within an hour, she was up, taking a shower, eating a sandwich, laughing, etc.

[flytern]

There are side efffects from having an epidural too soon/too long. Ask any lactation consultant (not me!) Ours says if the patient has had an epidural for more than 3 hours, it really screws up the breastfeeding.

Our hospitals policy: primip 3-4cms (unless the patient is such a pain, that the nurse begs for it (for her own sanity).

multips usually 3cms.

Most of our MDs believe getting it too early slows down labor, but I think it relaxes the patient enough so things start to move along. Plus, I can't remember the last time I didn't have to start Pitocin on a patient in labor

(with or without the epidural).

It is funny to see the difference between our female/male MD's. The males are very strict about pain meds. The females will let their patients get their epidurals anytime (except for the one who's never had children).

:balloons:

[flytern]

Some patients don't get what childbirth is all about. They want it to be like on TV, takes 23 minutes, 1 push, 50 people in attendance. They don't take the time or effort to discuss their concerns with their MD's, attend childbirth classes. All they know is family/friends horror stories.

Many a time I've had to explain to a patient that when they are complete they will feel pain/pressure. That they have to participate in the birth of their child. I truly think they expect to go to sleep at 3cm's a wake up to a 2 day old infant. They are horrified when I won't bolus them because they can feel their legs. Their support people are also put to work supporting those very dead legs while pushing. I'm too old to keep hurting my back!

:balloons:

[wubbakat]

Here at my facility, request of an epidural is at the pt's discretion of when they want it. It is encouraged that they wait until labor is established before they get an epidural due to the fact that it is possible that if it turns out to be a failed induction at that time, that they could go home if there are no pressing problems, instead of their only option being a cesarean. There really hasn't been a negative response from pts when talking with them about their options, risks, benefits, etc.

[teeituptom, BSN, RN]

Moms to be who dont want to feel any pain, shouldnt become Moms.

I can talk my wife and had and raised 7 kiddos.

ps. they all survived and so did we

If they think chidbirth is rough, then who is going to raise their kids for them

[klone, MSN, RN]

There are side efffects from having an epidural too soon/too long. Ask any lactation consultant (not me!) Ours says if the patient has had an epidural for more than 3 hours, it really screws up the breastfeeding.

That has not been my experience in working with breastfeeding moms. I don't believe there is anything in current breastfeeding literature that indicates breastfeeding is harder after having an epidural for more than a certain amount of time. Certainly ANY pain meds given to mom has the effect of making baby a little bit sleepier, which can make it more difficult to latch early on. But in my experience, epidurals cause fewer problems in that regard than IV narcotics.

Here's a summary of some interesting research on the topic:

http://www.lalecheleague.org/ba/Nov99.html

[SmilingBluEyes]

That belief that epidurals mess up breastfeeding is misleading and completely untrue in my experience. Any links to the information on which the LC based this remark?

This is just not true where I work. Even in the first hour after their c/sections, moms have the option (and many do take it) to breastfeed right there, in recovery. We do everything humanly possible to make this happen, and we succeed so often, that it is one of the things I find most rewarding about my work.

[SmilingBluEyes]

That has not been my experience in working with breastfeeding moms. I don't believe there is anything in current breastfeeding literature that indicates breastfeeding is harder after having an epidural for more than a certain amount of time. Certainly ANY pain meds given to mom has the effect of making baby a little bit sleepier, which can make it more difficult to latch early on. But in my experience, epidurals cause fewer problems in that regard than IV narcotics.

Here's a summary of some interesting research on the topic:

http://www.lalecheleague.org/ba/Nov99.html

Good post. I have read that information before, and I find my experiences correlate well with this. No one here says epidurals are risk-free, certainly.

I have learned a lot of it is based on the attitude of the staff and the parents, as to whether BF will succeed early-on or not. Many women who truly want ZERO PAIN are the same ones who want us to take their babies immediately, and bathe them (cause they are "dirty") and want them in the nursery all night so they can sleep, without interruption. Lack of staff support can also really do a lot of harm to breastfeeding success, at least initially. Attitude is EVERYthing.

And I also agree, IV pain meds seem to cause more trouble than regional anesthesia does. And I have even seen naturally-laboring unable to initiate immediate BF due to exhaustion or baby just not being ready to nurse vigorously. No worries, we get there, with patience and persistence. And an educated as well as committed, staff, to help make it happen.

[Spidey's mom, ADN, BSN, RN]

Just want to agree with Klone and Deb . . . . . epidurals, in my experience, have NO relation to success at breastfeeding. The women are NOT sleepy, as with narcotics.

As to my own personal experience - I did get Demerol with a couple of my kids and it did absolutely nothing to dim the pain of UC's but did make me zone out in between . . but big deal, 1 1/2 minutes of zoning out and then POW, a contraction.

My epidural with my 4th was lovely - 3 natural births was enough for me.

And Tom dear - having pain with childbirth has nothing to do with how good a mom you will end up being. I have plenty of meth addict moms who have "natural" births and scream, yell the "F" word and don't get epidurals and turn out to be terrible moms. Enduring pain is not indicative of anything really. Except enduring the pain at that moment.

I am not taking away anything from women who have natural births - remember I had 3. Just arguing about whether that makes you a good mom or not.

steph

[klone, MSN, RN]

I have learned a lot of it is based on the attitude of the staff and the parents, as to whether BF will succeed early-on or not.

I completely and totally agree. It's funny, because it is drilled into every woman's head that if a bottle is given in the early days/weeks, it pretty much dooms the mother to failure. Yet, we have Hispanic women come in all the time, where it's culturally accepted that the mother gives formula for the first several days until the milk fully comes in, and then she switches to exclusive breastfeeding. And yet, these women seem to have no problems making this transition, and have no difficulties with breastfeeding. To Mexican women, it's culturally ingrained that they will bottle-feed for the first several days, and then switch to the breast, and that's just how it's done. And they do it. With American women, it's culturally ingrained that if their baby is given a bottle in the early days, breastfeeding won't work. So then it doesn't.

I'm certainly not saying that this means it should be okay to give bottles to breastfed babies. Just trying to illustrate how I really believe that perception and attitude has SO MUCH influence on what a person can or cannot do, and their success at doing it.

To correlate this to the OP, I think the same can often be said about pain in labor. If women are told that labor hurts like a SOB and they won't be able to do it without medication, then usually they won't.