As someone who is about to complete medical school, and who went through nursing school for a BSN, the knowledge gap between the two is exponential. In light of recent arguments made by militant nurses who argue that the required nursing courses to complete an associates degree or BSN is just as good as medical school. First you take an A&P, 101 course on microbiology, a introductory 12 week course in "orgo/gen chem, Biochem" all combined superficially in 12 weeks, 12 week course in Pathophysiology 101.
Looking back those courses, they were very superficial at the amount of knowledge required to pass. Those science courses were no where near the complexity that medical schools dig into, where things get broken down into the mechanism of protein structures that allow them to function a certain way. With out understanding the complexities of the inner workings of what actually occur at the cellular level, you can't begin to understand what went wrong when the ALGORITHM they are trained to follow doesn't go according to plan. Then comes the nursing courses, and the "clinicals" that they do. The actual nursing courses were good enough to understand and complete NURSING tasks. They were not good enough to treat and effectively manage complex disease, but when I was a nursing student at that time I thought I knew just as much as a doctor, and I was dead wrong. The clinicals were a joke, you passed out meds,maybe gave a few injections, changed wet diapers on incontinent patients, and followed the orders given by the doctor.
I am all about advanced education, but there is NO DIFFERENCE in the fundamental knowledge between a RN VS BSN other than some "nursing research courses and fluff to get fancy titles like clinical nurse specialist, or infection control specialist" but the core principles are EXACTLY THE SAME. So when they claim they have a BSN not an associates in nursing, there is NO difference, and I dare you to find me a BSN who would say there is.
Something else that ticks me off I hear from nurses trying to be MD's is " I have 15+ years in the ICU, ER, or MED/SURG floor," that counts as more education like a residency. Good for you! But, when I worked as a nurses assistant for 5+ years I didn't claim to know or be equivalent to a RN just because I saw what they did, and helped them carry out orders. How would NURSES like it if LPN's claimed to be EQUIVALENT to RN's/BSN's? Probably wouldn't go well. I am not knocking down the profession of nursing, what I am annoyed with is NURSES/NP's claiming to be equivalent to MD's. You are not, you were trained in the NURSING SCOPE of practice.
I love nurses, yes I would trust a seasoned ICU nurse's opinion vs a Freshly minted MD out of med school in July as an Intern, but I guarantee that by the end of 3-4 months of intern year, his knowledge base will increase exponentially to surpass that of any ICU nurse due to his knowledge base gained from 8 years of education that doesn't stop during residency, and now applying it daily as a intern. So nurses I beg you to please just work within your scope as a nurse, and stop trying to claim equivalency through studies "propaganda" funded by the militant nurses association.
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
I think we're going to need several bags of popcorn for this one.
Yes. We need several different flavors of popcorn, too (cheese, salted caramel, chocolate, vanilla, toffee). There's no fun in watching a drama unfold without the popcorn within easy reach.
Yes. We need several different flavors of popcorn, too (cheese, salted caramel, chocolate, vanilla, toffee). There's no fun in watching a drama unfold without the popcorn within easy reach.
I have a feeling it'll just be us, the several gallons of popcorn, and some wine....as the OP appears to have bugged out on us...
you'll have to let us know if it's worth the drive on over there....I don't even have it in my 'puter GPS :)
It's weird. Really weird. Some of them are using RN and NP somewhat interchangeably (OP included). A lot of them make assumptions on how nurses feel. Honestly, though, sticking with the RN part of the conversation, it reads to me as though a lot of the posters have been dumped on by nurses during their internship and they're jaded against nurses for that. I'd be jaded too, if that happened to me. It's a 17 page thread and I'm feeling a bit bored, so I'm thinking I might skip to the end soon. I will say this OP tried the same thing a year ago here. I'm curious to find that thread.
By the bottom of page 2, OP gets the table turned for being so obsessed with the idea that nurses want to be viewed as equal to doctors. He's also had a couple of posters ask, essentially, why he's so obsessed with topic. And here we are, over a year later....
It's weird. Really weird. Some of them are using RN and NP somewhat interchangeably (OP included). A lot of them make assumptions on how nurses feel. Honestly, though, sticking with the RN part of the conversation, it reads to me as though a lot of the posters have been dumped on by nurses during their internship and they're jaded against nurses for that. I'd be jaded too, if that happened to me. It's a 17 page thread and I'm feeling a bit bored, so I'm thinking I might skip to the end soon. I will say this OP tried the same thing a year ago here. I'm curious to find that thread.
Thinking about those who have been dumped on or whatever by nurses. I have a kid who is now pre-med and is quite outspoken about his respect for nurses---LOL, he'd BETTER have respect! --but seriously he knows what side of his bread gets buttered and knows how to NOT be "that med student/resident" that all the nurses hate. During times he's volunteered in the hospitals, he's been something of a 'pet' of the nursing staff, he's helpful and nice to them, etc.....I've trained him well
I will have to let him toddle on over there to see what he thinks....and make sure he never becomes someone we'd all like to see run over by a wayward med cart
--but seriously he knows what side of his bread gets buttered and knows how to NOT be "that med student/resident" that all the nurses hate. During times he's volunteered in the hospitals, he's been something of a 'pet' of the nursing staff, he's helpful and nice to them, etc.....I've trained him well 
TheCommuter, BSN, RN
102 Articles; 27,612 Posts