Is this any way to retain nurses?

Nurses Activism

Published

Soooo..... We've been unionized with our state nurses assoc since 1983, with significant monetary and professional standard contract gains ever since, and once again are in negotiations with the hospital for a new contract. Is it just us, or does anyone else get the impression that this hospital is doing all it can to drive our nurses out of their jobs???......

On the first day of the first negotiating session, in its opening statements, the hospital refused to recognize some of the RNs on our negotiating team - which had been elected by the rest of the staff RNs to represent them - and refused to release them for negotiations, even though it is required to do so according to our contract. So, in the first 5 minutes of the first negotiating session, the hospital committed an illegal act & we had to stop to file a grievance for arbitration. Nice way to set the tone.

They canceled the next session and gave us dates to meet only once a week. They have given us dates into September, so they apparently have no plans to settle this contract quickly. It expired in June.

At the following session, they announced that recruitment and retention is their focus - BUT they specified that they meant recruitment & retention of new grads. In keeping with that, they proposed to cut the experienced RNs' tuition reimbursement in half & apply that money to establishing sign on bonuses for new grads. They blatantly said they want to be able to take money from experienced nurses & give it to new hires who already start with a base of almost $60,000/yr right out of school. Nice slap in the face for the nurses who already work here.

Then our hospital is refusing to implement retirement benefits that our union RNs have obtained at other area hospitals and, to add insult to injury, is also insisting on cutting its contributions to our retirement annuity plan in half. They also do not want to allow new hires to be vested in 3 years, as the rest of us are, and want to create a 2-tier system by forcing new hires to wait 5 yrs for vesting. So they can work 5 yrs worth of wasted time with nothing added to their retirement funds.

It's insisting on reducing our medical benefits and wants to make us start paying for them too. And it wants to deny new hires the immediate medical benefits they are currently entitled to - forcing them to work more than a month with no benefits at all. Theyll just be out of luck if they get hit by a car on the way to work. What incentive is there for a new nurse to work here when they are more valued at the next facility?

The hospital also wants the right to change our medical benefits plan and providers whenever it feels like it. It's prevented from doing that now.

It's also refusing pay increases in experience, education, charge, shift, or preceptor differentials and offered only a 2% raise. It wants to cut our continuing ed days and reimbursements. It got rid of all the clinical nurse specialists and expects the staff RNs to assume that role for new nurses - without compensation and without a decrease in the RN's pt load. It refused to increase pay for outside experience and insists on being allowed to continue paying a newly hired experienced nurse for up to only 10 years of her outside experience, while we have gotten hospitals all around us to do away with that ceiling and they now pay the nurse for ALL her years in nursing. This hospital also wants to cap the salaries of its own long-time nurses and stop their current increases paid for anything over 25 years at this facility - no matter how long they work there. Again, not competitive with our other hospitals that now recognize and compensate the RN for all her years in nursing. Whats the incentive for an experienced nurse to work here when she is valued more at the next hospital?

The hospital is violating the contract restrictions on mandatory ot pending the arbitration hearing on the matter. It also wants cuts in sick time and retribution against us if we use a sick day. THEN, if we have a sick day, but work an over time shift in that same pay period - mandatory or voluntary - they want to only pay us straight time for the OT and not count the sickday hours in the calculation. We envision the supervisors searching the rolls for anyone who had a sick day that week. We forsee that that's the person who will be mandated to work OT so the hospital can save on the time and a half payroll expense.

There is a punitive atmosphere of intimidation and nurses are suddenly being disciplined for every little thing (like thats really going to scare us into backing down). For example, a unit secretary didnt do her paper work "in a timely fashion" so the NURSE was disciplined. An neurosurgical RN was floated to a med-surg floor & paired with a nurses aid who was floated from mother/baby. An order was written for a lab draw on a pt at change of shift. Lab techs have been laid off & the nurses aid is expected to do those jobs. The RN was still busy with pt care. The mother/baby aid was not certified to draw labs so the RN delegated the lab draw to the aide coming onto the next shift. She gave report, alerted the next RN, stayed late to finish her charting, reminded the aid & the RN about the labs, and went home. She was then written up for not drawing the labs herself before she left.

The grievances will get all these ridiculous disciplines thrown out, but the effect that nonsense like this has on morale is not so easily fixed. One nurse reported a patient safety problem in his unit to our union delegate. That nurse was then harrassed by management and fired. That was illegal and he will win his job back, along with back pay once the arbitration is heard - but he will not accept the job back - and we lost another excellent RN. There are all these grievances, arbitrations, and Unfair Labor Practice charges filed with the NLRB up the wazzoooo, but the hospital doesnt seem to care.

It's demanding that we allow nurses to be disciplined if there are any doctor complaints about them or their unit or if their unit's Press Ganey patient satisfaction surveys are not improved - even though doctors' and patients' complaints usually stem from the fact that there isnt enough staff - and that is not the nurses fault - but the hospital is demanding that we actually agree to hold ourselves responsible for it. It also wants to be able to force the nurses who have received complaints or nurses on units that have not improved their customer satisfaction surveys to attend "customer satisfaction" courses - on our own time and at our own expense as punishment.

In this current round of contract negotiations, the hospital is even demanding the elimination of our clinical divisions and wants to be allowed to have unrestricted floating, irregardless of whether the RN has training in the area she is floated to or not. Thats something we did away with 20 years ago! But the hospital wants it back. It's refusing to implement 12 hr flextime on units that dont already have it, even though our contract allowed for alternative work schedules and required the hospital to consider it on any unit where the RNs want it. Although they agreed to that long ago, the hospital has refused to abide by it - another violation - and told us to "take it to arbitration".

Ok. Done.

It also wants to change our hard-won staffing ratios - because there is no state law that says they must have staffing ratios. (our union's nurses wrote the bill for that state law, got it into the legislature, but it hasnt yet been passed, therefore the hospital is not yet forced to provide staffing ratios by law). So, they want the critical care RN-to-pt staffing ratio changed from 1:2 to make it 1:3. They want the med-surg and oncology ratio to go up to 1:8/9. They want the L&D ratio to be 1:2 instead of 1:1. They accused the nursing staff of slacking off on the job and think we dont have enough work to do to justify our salaries if we dont have that many patients to be responsible for. Instead of instituting measures that would make the place one that nurses want to work in, being able to attract, hire, and keep the staff we need, the assistant VP of Human Resources shrugged his shoulders and actually stated "We dont have the staff for the current ratios. They need to be changed because we dont have the staff. If you force us to comply with your ratios, we'll just mandate YOU with ot to meet them".

Cant even call that a "hidden" threat.

With all the media attention on why nurses are leaving hospital jobs, youd think this kind of attitude towards nurses would be past us & administration would be eager to find ways to bring us back to the bedside. No such reality here.

Why would any nurse want to work at my hospital? Maybe the fact that they wont doesnt matter. The hospital is also demanding to eliminate our entire long-standing job security clause from our contract. Hmmm... does that mean Lay-offs are planned??

After hearing all these proposals, I thought they were joking. Our jaws hit the floor when we realized they werent. We asked if they read the newspapers lately and if they knew what the reasons were that RNs do not want to work at the bedsides anymore.

The corporation VP told us to our faces: "This is a business. We have to run it economically and do whats best for the business. We are not going to lose in business just for some RNs. If we dont have business - YOU dont have a job."

We responded:"Without nurses, YOU dont have a business".

And that was the end of that negotiations session.

I cant believe that they actually had the audacity to seriously make these kinds of demands of us in this time of bedside nurse shortages - and in the same breath state they are "focusing on retention". How is any of this going to attract nurses & keep them working here? Its just going to drive them straight to the hospital around the corner or down the street, where the RNs are in the same union and the hospital administration there does read the newspapers.

Bear in mind that if we were not a union, the administration could have made all these changes already all by itself & we'd already be living with it all. But since we ARE a union, they cant do any of it unless we agree. And we dont. The hospital so far will not change its position or even listen to reason, so the nurses are already demanding that our union take a strike vote to make it listen. This is how hospitals provoke and cause nurses strikes.

Our hospital just posted about 30 vacant RN positions. Some had been filled just a few months ago but those nurses have already left. And it thinks that while its doing all of the above, sign-on bonuses for new grads, with money stolen from experienced nurses, are going to make a difference.

The hospital has the attitude it has towards nurses, makes the kinds of contract proposals and demands that it has just made, and then cant understand why it cant fill the spots & keep them filled.

Well... duh.....

I am a staff RN in the ICU and am on the negotiating team. Yesterday I kept getting called to the phone to take calls from staff nurses all over the hospital wanting to make it clear that, if the hospital doesnt move off its stance, the nurses are ready to take a strike vote & authorize our union to schedule a strike, rather than allow any of the hospitals demands as they are. (The union takes direction and its orders from the staff nurses - it's not the other way around)

Another negotiating session is tomorow.

I just cant wait to hear what the hospital has come up with to show how much it disrespects & devalues us next.

How could anybody in their right mind think this is feasible? Who is going to take a job like that? Id love to know what responses you get from the public when you ask them if they think this a safe or fair thing to do to you or how many nurses they think will continue working if this is allowed. And who they think is going to take care of them in the hospital and what kind of care they will get if they allow it?

Specializes in NICU, PICU, PCVICU and peds oncology.

-jt, because we had a gag order for so long, the whole nursing contract issue has been more or less forgotten by the public. The gag order was only lifted on Monday, and we're starting to get the word out. My non-nursing friends are very alarmed by the thought of this mobility clause and its implications. They also don't like the idea that we could be arbitrarily forced to work permanent nights.

There is so much rhetoric floating around it isn't funny. And some nurses who have read the mediator's document are saying it doesn't sound as bad as the union is making it out to be. From what I can gather, the mediator is making a lot of interpretation of what PHAA is saying in their proposals without being really sure his assumptions are right. The proposals are deliberately vague on the details. The union is taking the worst-case scenario from each of them because we don't have the luxury of feeling confident that PHAA is a benevolent group looking out for patients and nurses. We've seen all too often that the opposite is true.

Recently the government announced that it was going to boost the per diem cost (paid by the individual) for nursing home care by 40% on September 1. The government pays for the medical part of nursing home care... we all know how many "nursing" hours those folks get in a day... and charge the client for housekeeping, linen service, meals and incidentals. Over the last few years they've delisted a number of essentials from senior citizens' benefits. They used to be covered by Blue Cross for those expenses not otherwise covered by the province, and now they're not. So if they can make such cavalier changes to provisions for our parents and grandparents, who built this province and made it the wonderful place it should be, why would we think they have any intention of caring about nurses or patients?

What I and my union siblings foresee happening is that the young nurses will vote with their feet, taking jobs south of the border ("If I'm gonna get treated like $#!+, at least I'm gonna get paid for it!") or do advanced degrees so they can work for insurance companies and equipment manufacturers, and the older on-the-cusp nurses will simply retire. Those of us with few options will stay and slowly burn out. Many will leave nursing altogether and we'll be in even worse shape.

We are voting on the mediator's recommendations in September. Our hope is that we will get a good turnout and the vote will be a resounding "Up your kilt!!". Wish us luck!

Reply to gojack

Silly excuses for siding with management?

Pro-company nurse subconsciously siding with management as a self-defense?

Premise based on nonsense; too funny for words?

I am pro-nursing to the core. I have little "RNs" floating in my blood. After experiencing the kind of crap from management that I received in just a few short years as a staff nurse and getting no help at all from my local or national nursing association, I decided to go into administration to be in a position to try and bring about some change. Even if just a little in one hospital, but some kind of change that valued what RNs do.

I was not liked by management, and I mean primarily nursing management. I was sick of listening to petty bickering over meaningless crap while our department and unit was being run over with cost cutting measures, reducing our staff, forcing us to use cheap, poor quality supplies in order to save a few bucks. I was outspoken and didn't just sit there with my mouth shut.

During my time in administration I have observed, listened, and learned many things about the "administration" perspective. I find your remarks to me about being a pro-company nurse and siding with management as a subconscious self-defense to be absolutely ridiculous and highly offensive.

After being the chief operating officer and chief executive officer of hospitals, in the for-profit arena, I understand fully what these guys are about. I understand fully what they will listen to, how to approach them, and how to sell them on ideas. Learning to do that effectively is part of my job. I have some information that I think nurses can use in our struggle to deal with profit-driven, hard-nosed business people. These guys are about making their numbers, getting their bonuses, and their corporate bosses are about the same thing but have to satisfy the Wall Street analysts whose commentary and recommendations greatly affect the stock price. The stock price is one of the key measures of a corporate executive's effectiveness and the people (many of whom are employees of the company) who own stock in the company want a return on their investment. If you are in your company's 401k or have money in the stock market, you know what I am talking about.

There are ways to approach these guys that will immediately inflame them and you will get NOWHERE very quickly. In my years as an administrator I have listened to several nursing proposals from the CNO and others. Much of the time the nurses come in without being able to answer key questions that administrators are going to ask. It makes the nurses look like they don't understand the business side and don't understand or realize how what they are asking for is going to impact the numbers. It may mean nothing to the nurses, but it means a heck of a lot to a guy that has tens of thousands of dollars worth of bonus riding on these kinds of decisions. I am not siding with management or saying management is right, or wrong, just saying this is how it is, this is what you are dealing with. We need to learn effective ways to get our message across. Coming out blazing with both barrels is sure to inflame these guys and immediately cut off any communication and hope of coming to some kind of agreement. Nurses need to understand the environment we are working in and what motivates management to do what they are doing. Yes, it is money and profit, but it is not just that simple, not just that black and white when it comes to trying to persuade them to do certain things. And the fact is, these are the people nurses are going to have to persuade!! Nurses have not been able to effectively do this because we are speaking two different languages and focused on two different things.

As for my premise of utter nonsense that is too funny for words. See if you can comprehend what I am saying. The occupation of nursing needs to move in a more professional direction. We need to conduct ourselves as mature, educated, professionals while we are on the job. We need to define what we do so that it is understood that it is professional work. We need to be compensated as professionals are compensated. When I say professional, I mean autonomous, broadly and liberally educated, self-regulating, professionals who provide services that requires higher education and highly skilled persons that engage in dealing with complex issues that are sometimes not "black and white." We are not merely people who follow doctors orders and do task oriented labor, or are we? Being paid by the hour and being organized in the fashion that most nursing department are organized in, gives us the flavor of blue-collar employees. So we have the characteristics of blue-collar workers and we are treated as such. When things are not going our way then we react like blue-collar workers. When being run over by greedy administrations we feel, and are, powerless to do anything about it because we are not organized as professionals and do not see ourselves as such with the clout and strength in numbers to get what we want. So many turn to a third party or organize themselves in the fashion of a labor union and engage in "management versus laborer" type activities while trying to achieve some kind of resolution. It moves us away from a true, autonomous, professional model of nursing. It also sets us up immediately as adversaries and we each have "sides." There is no we, there is no team, there is no cooperation in trying to find ways that everyone wins something and can live with. Nurses say management doesn't care about their point of view, is greedy, is deliberately trying to drive away experienced nurses, is compromising patient care for the sake of a dollar. Administration is saying that nurses don't care about their point of view, don't understand or appreciate financial issues, are compromising the financial integrity of the business in the name of patient care, of which they cannot prove and lack the credible data to back it up. Nurses want and want and want but offer nothing in return to the organization other than to say we will stay rather than quit, you need us and can't run this hospital without us. Nurses come across as morally superior and ethically arrogant, as if no one else is worried about good patient care, as if no one but a nurse has the morals and ethics to really care about patients, that no one but a nurse can truly understand. Administration finds this highly offensive just as nurses find administration's word and actions highly offensive. Unfortunately, administration usually has the upper hand.

I am not taking sides, I am sharing with you my observations and what I have learned to hopefully give some insight.

It is a crummy system with many flaws but it is where we are today and it is the environment we have to work with.

Specializes in NICU, PICU, PCVICU and peds oncology.

In recent days, both the Provincial Health Authorities Association and the United Nurses of Alberta issued summaries of the mediator's recommendations. In many articles they bore no resemblance to each other, because of course each side will put their own spin on things to make their version look good. PHAA has also begun running print ads containing their vision of the issues. Naturally they are somewhat misleading, using very deceptive language to describe their desired goals.

I read the entire mediator's report (93 pages) and came to the conclusion that the Union's version is closest to accurate. The Union has called a membership vote on the mediator's recommendations for September 15, and are gearing up to inform members so they can vote with a better understanding of the issues. It would have been helpful had the mediator had a better understanding of the issues... he stated in several instances that he didn't understand the Union's stance on items pertaining to working conditions and scheduling. He quoted numerous reports indicating nurses need some control over their work lives and deserve respect, then turned around and ignored their recommendations completely.

Meanwhile it was announced late yesterday that both sides have agreed to go back to the table in the next week or so. I hope this means that both sides are willing to really talk, and to listen, instead of going into negotiations with minds already made up.

Specializes in NICU, PICU, PCVICU and peds oncology.

There has been no movement in the Alberta negotiations. The Provincial Health Authorities have been running print ads in every newspaper in the province, big and small telling the public that they must have the mobility clause enacted or else the health care of the whole province will suffer. Their spokesperson is writing letters to the editors of each of those same papers making much of the "high wages and great benefits" Alberta nurses enjoy, and implying that we're spoiled children for refusing to allow such a drastic worsening of our working conditions. I'm hoping my rebuttal will be in my local paper tomorrow, which describes what my life would be like if I were floated 50km beyond my usual facility. Drive, work, drive, sleep. Repeat. No way!

I am new to the boards and totally impressed with this thread. There is no union in my state or sufficient organization that can echo my disenchantment with my professional frustrations. -jt, you are fighting my battle. I am compelled to ask, how can I help. There are many of us sitting on the sidelines all across this great country--your fight will affect us all. In sheer numbers, we are great! How can we observers help you not only say no, BUT H--- NO!!!

I can't believe what I am hearing. What does the hospital think nurses do?? Sit around all day and sip tea?? This treatment of experienced nurses is ridiculous, to say the least. Although I must admit, $60,000 for a new grad sounds might good. Maybe the experienced nurses need to make the abominable conditions you described known to the new grads. I will graduate in Dec. and I never really thought about the importance of a union. Guess I need to really do some thinking if I want to be valued as a member of a healthcare team. I hope everything works out for the best for all of the nurses at your facility.

With the current nursing shortage, it would be foolish of you to continue to be involved in a shady organization that treats their employees unfairly. Go get another job.

Specializes in NICU, PICU, PCVICU and peds oncology.

Nekhismom, are you referring to the Alberta negotiations? Let me clarify that these negotiations are for the entire province of Alberta, not a single facility. It will affect over 20,000 nurses province wide. There are now nine health regions, some extending from one provincial border to the other (roughly 700 kilometres or 420 miles) that are under the umbrella of the Provincial Health Authorities of Alberta (The Employer).

Also, take that $60,000 for a new nurse with a grain of salt, since it's in Canadian dollars (currently worth about 70 cents each in US dollars) and from that we pay significant federal and other taxes. I have eight years' experience and work 70% FTE. As of July 27 I have earned $28,891.59 in salary and shift differentials this year; I have paid $9,920.39 in taxes and copayments for my benefits. So my take-home pay is $18,971.20. If I worked full time, I would be in a higher tax bracket (Canada's income taxes are not indexed to inflation) and would therefore have a larger percentage of my cheque skimmed off before I see it.

The latest salvo from PHAA came in the form of a "letter" to nurses outlining the "truth" about how the mediator's recommendations would actually affect the contract, plus a draft of a collective agreement as it would look with all the recommendations included. They crossed out terminology and bolded new clauses so it would be easy to see the changes. But some changes were not denoted as such and so are hidden. They of course are downplaying all the negative aspects and presenting things in the rosiest possible light. So we push on.

i had no idea that you would be driving that far under this mobility clause!!! how could anyone think that a person, nurse or not, could drive that far to work??? also, i can't believe that taxes take that much of your wages. wow. no wonder canadian nurses practice in the states. this thread and others like it make me seriously reconsider nursing.

i agree that jt's problems are affecting everyone- american and canadian.

Have any of you looked into working for an agency instead? I haven't had any of these kind of problems that you are talking about. There is no union problems, no politics, and I have great benefits! I just go in and do my job, that's all...

Specializes in Corrections, Psych, Med-Surg.

Utah, yes, in fact there is an "agency nurses forum" on this BB.

+ Add a Comment