Nurses who let NAs Boss them around

PhePhe, RN · Jun 9, 2003

This is obviously a sensitive subject, one that many nurses and aides can relate to. The NA/RN relationship is an important one--when there is no cooperation from the NA it makes the job more difficult for the nurse. Nurses are told to delegate. Its sad to see NAs on break or ignoring lights when the RN is running around trying to do everything. This is especially true when the RN is much younger than the NA--they get intimidated. As many have said there are plenty of good aides around. It is the bad ones that can ultimately help to drive a nurse out of the healthcare facility. This is a big problem--nurses cannot do everything. The acuity level is much higher now and there are so many technical things to accomplish in a shift that often there is very little time for RN patient care. That is the reality--its not that nurses don't want to do it--its just that there are many things they have to do that the NA does not have to worry about!

Disablednurse · Jun 9, 2003

What is so sad is that the bad CNAs pull the good ones down with them. You try to ask them to do something that is within their job description, their reply is "You can't tell me what to do." Excuse me but that is my job. They don't want to be treated like children, but they don't act like adults. I give them the same respect that I receive from them. I will not ask them to do something that is not within their scope of practice. The nurse cannot do their job for them or always help them do their job, because if the nurse gets behind, they cannot help her. Nurses cannot stop in the middle of med pass to help someone to the bathroom, because the meds have to be given within a certain time frame. CNAs do not understand this as a rule. Nurses have to do their charting and keep up with the med pass, dr. orders and other things so that if something like an emergency arises they will not fall so far behind. I also think that if a nurse is sitting at the desk doing nothing and a cal light comes on, she should answer it. There are some nurses that do not show respect to the CNAs and this is wrong. You have to show respect to get respect. We could all learn a lesson about this.

Yankee in Texas · Jun 11, 2003

My, My, My. I am currently a GN (thank you very much May 2003). During school I worked as a NA or here we are called PCTs (pt care techs). What I understand and see is that some nurses ASSUME some or all NAs/PCTs are lazy, therefore even the good ones get no respect for what they do. Not all of us are lazy !! :eek:

There have been times that I have missed lunch or left my lunch to return later, to assist the nurse. I spend just as much or more time on my feet than they do. At least at my hospital, they can sit down during a slow phase and it is frowned upon when we do. Some nurses forget we serve under more than one nurse beside themselves. If OUR patient needs assistance in turning or is in need of a diaper or linen change...why must I go get another tech/NA to assist me when it is NOT HER PATIENT!! :rolleyes:

One day, my assigned nurse come into the breakroom my dinner break that I use as study time. We chatted for a while, then she left. As she was leaving I heard her say, "I have this med to give, pt ____ needs me and room ____ needs to got to the pot. :bluecry1: THE TECH (me) needs to get her head out of those books and help me."

All she had to do was ask me if I was at dinner and if I would assist her. In the past, other nurses have pulled me away during my meal break, as they see fit/or need. Why didn't she.

Anyway, I as a GN to RN, respect the CNAs/PCTs. They do the grunt work that we are not able or unwilling to do. They are a valuable asset to the nursing team. Let them know this, because without them that fundamental patient care would STILL have to be provided!

Some of us remember where we came from. Our goal is patient care! Now, let management know this!! :kiss

Gator,SN · Jun 11, 2003

So, if you are a good CNA, why do you get defensive? No one is talking about you or directing their comments at you.

Thank you Hellllo Nurse! I think this is a very important point!!

I don't think that anyone is saying that all CNAs are bad, so there is no reason for anyone to get upset about it. period.

Gator

Jayney · Jun 11, 2003

Just a point; how would you feel if you overheard a bunch of doctors complaining about how lazy nurses were?

Defensive perhaps?

Or would you just feel the whole conversation didn't pertain to you because you were a diligent nurse?

Anyway, as someone who has seen both sides of the fence recently, there are bad CNA's, just as there are bad MD's, lawyers, dentists, nurses, administrators.........you get the picture.

Hellllllo Nurse, BSN, RN · Jun 11, 2003

Originally posted by Jayney
Just a point; how would you feel if you overheard a bunch of doctors complaining about how lazy nurses were?

Defensive perhaps?

Or would you just feel the whole conversation didn't pertain to you because you were a diligent nurse?

Anyway, as someone who has seen both sides of the fence recently, there are bad CNA's, just as there are bad MD's, lawyers, dentists, nurses, administrators.........you get the picture.

If they said "nurses are lazy" I would be upset, because that would be lumping all nurses together. That was not done here.

The posters in this thread made sure to note that they were not talking about all CNAs.

And yes, there are bad MDs, dentists, etc. I'm sure they discuss their work issues on their boards. This is a nursing board. CNA problems are an issue for many nurses. Therefore, we are discussing it.

Okay?

Signed RN, former LPN, former CNA, former candy striper.

redwinggirlie · Jun 11, 2003

I saw a nurse once who had a special folder for NA's (and RN's) that are described here. When one of these situations arose, she'd get the folder out and hand the perpetrator a couple of sheets of paper....

What was it, pray tell? Their job descriptions.

Jayney · Jun 11, 2003

Hellllllo Nurse,

I'm not telling anyone it isn' t OK to discuss this, it's a very valid topic and problems arise from the CNA/LPN/RN relationship everyday. Just trying to say that it's understandable that some CNA's might be defensive on reading some of the comments here.

Okay?

Yankee in Texas · Jun 11, 2003

Not wanting to be in a defensive stance. I have seen both side of the fence as well. As a new grad, I am coming into the field understanding both roles, while learn the role of an RN.

Unfortunately, the good CNAs are pre-judged with the bad. There is no excuse for poor or the lack of work ethics. Yet. some CNAs are in an attack mode up front due to pre-judged notions. Yet, Two wrongs don't make One right.

Each member of a team MUST work together and make it work for the nonmaleficence of the patient. If things are that bad, then management must step in to create an environment in which conflict is dealt with in a cooperative/constructive manner and not in a competitive/destructive way.

PhePhe, RN · Jun 11, 2003

Ideally all nursing staff must work together. Years ago, I worked on a 24 bed general surgical floor that was really busy. We had 3 teams of an RN and an aide or LPN. When one team was done, we always went to see if the next team needed help. We were not finished until ALL teams were caught up.

The difference is now, the RN may find herself in a situation where the person he/she must delegate tasks to may refuse or ignore him/her. This is what I am taking about. This a pressure of being a RN. Sorry if some NAs take offence. I and others have said all along that there are good NAs. But look at all the RNs who are reporting problems here? This is not an issue to be swept under the table. NAs can start their own thread, "NAs who feel RNs Boss them Around". Every response from an RN should tell you that "delegation" is part of the RN job description. Being "Bossy and nasty" are not.

Gator,SN · Jun 12, 2003

how would you feel if you overheard a bunch of doctors complaining about how lazy nurses were?

I'd probably start laughing since without nurses, the docs wouldn't know what was happening with the patients half the time and are clueless to most of what they do.

My own family physician doesn't even give injections!

Yep, I'd be laughing........ :cool:

Gator

Liddle Noodnik · Jun 12, 2003

Originally posted by Yankee in Texas

Yankee: " Not all of us are lazy !! :eek: "

ABSOLUTELY NOT! There are some CNA's (we dont' have pcas/techs) who are JUST INCREDIBLE! I bet you are one of them!

Yankee: "why must I go get another tech/NA to assist me when it is NOT HER PATIENT!! :rolleyes:"

IF there is a CNA or whatever who is playing on the computer or reading the paper at the desk, and NOT on break, why not, if I am giving meds or doing my charting? Does that seem fair, or no?

Yankee: "THE TECH (me) needs to get her head out of those books and help me." "

Can she say BREAK -- room??? I would assume no one is allowed to go there unless on break. If you are on break, supposedly someone is COVERING for you who can help, or there is someone else available. If chaos reigns, then she could ask you, and you could take a break later. Communication (DIRECT communication) goes a LONG way!

Yankee: "Anyway, I as a GN to RN, respect the CNAs/PCTs. They do the grunt work that we are not able or unwilling to do. They are a valuable asset to the nursing team. Let them know this, because without them that fundamental patient care would STILL have to be provided!"

AMEN! I think those of us who HAVE been CNA's find it hard to FORGET where we came from and are a little more understanding. From what you've written, I'd say your staff is lucky to have you, as an aide and as a nurse! Are you staying on once you get your RN? Hey, good luck, BTW!