Nurse fired for calling police

[Runman1914]

Last year while eating at local restuarant i witnessed an irate customer being removed by police for screaming at the staff. Last month i witness a patient daughter screaming at staff for more than a week , security called almost every day. She was 10 times worse than the restuarant customer. Each day the nurse manager and administration kissed her butt and apologized. She would make a scene , throw things, etc...

Everyday she was given a new nurse. Nurses were calling off like crazy to avoid this unpleaseasble daughter. Finally after multiple problems with this daughter it came to a head. She came into the nursing station and began to throw things. The charge nurse called the police and she had to be removed kicking and screaming. One week later the nurse was fired for not handling it internally!!!

[icunurse42066]

Actually, I am not demeaning the nurse that was fired. I am just attempting to point out that all organizations have rules and policies. If I do not agree with the rules and policies of my employer, I move on. I have done it in the past. As for me being out of bounds for threating to slap the nurse, funny how you take her side and lessen mine. No one has addressed the fact that she continued to use the same needle to dig around the back of my hand and that she was causing me a great deal of pain. You all seem to focus on the fact that I threaten to slap her. And the threat was made on my third request for her to stop. Tell me, what should I have done. Continue to beg her to stop hurting me. As a patient I am never suppose to get angry at any of the staff because they are only there to help me, right? I really hate to tell you guys this, there are just as many bad, nasty, mean nurses out there, as there are patients and families. It is time we all admitted to this short coming. I saw them when I worked and I have had the misfortune to experience them once in a great while when I was a patient. And believe me, when as a patient or family member has suffered abuse from a nurse, they remember it. And some swear never to be abused again, even if they have to abuse first.

A poster question the change in the behavior of patients and families towards staff. I have also noticed that a lot of the younger nurses do not feel that they have any responsibility in defusing tense situations. Too many of you feel the need to pick up the phone and call the police. When I was in school and when I worked, we were responsible for assisting patients and their family. You had to make a situation work, no matter how much you might disagree with the behavior. Now it seems, if you can't handle the behavior, call the cops.

It sounds more like you guys are the ones who are whining, not me.

Woody:twocents:

First of all, yes in a way you were demeaning the nurse for getting fired. I believe if you would have read the entire post, they tried to handle it internally. I'm sorry, but I do not get paid enough to stand there and let someone throw objects at me or "wave a gun in my face" (which was kinda stupid to stand there and talk them out of the gun in the first place). If I feel like I am in danger, I'm going to call the police. Most of the places that I have worked won't allow their security guards to carry anything more than pepper spray and a flashlight. Second, you could have moved your hand away from the nurse, unless you were restained or couldn't move your arm for some reason. FYI, if I'm ever your nurse and you threaten to slap me, you WILL be walking out in handcuffs!!!

[nuangel1, BSN, RN]

Actually, I am not demeaning the nurse that was fired. I am just attempting to point out that all organizations have rules and policies. If I do not agree with the rules and policies of my employer, I move on. I have done it in the past. As for me being out of bounds for threating to slap the nurse, funny how you take her side and lessen mine. No one has addressed the fact that she continued to use the same needle to dig around the back of my hand and that she was causing me a great deal of pain. You all seem to focus on the fact that I threaten to slap her. And the threat was made on my third request for her to stop. Tell me, what should I have done. Continue to beg her to stop hurting me. As a patient I am never suppose to get angry at any of the staff because they are only there to help me, right? I really hate to tell you guys this, there are just as many bad, nasty, mean nurses out there, as there are patients and families. It is time we all admitted to this short coming. I saw them when I worked and I have had the misfortune to experience them once in a great while when I was a patient. And believe me, when as a patient or family member has suffered abuse from a nurse, they remember it. And some swear never to be abused again, even if they have to abuse first.

A poster question the change in the behavior of patients and families towards staff. I have also noticed that a lot of the younger nurses do not feel that they have any responsibility in defusing tense situations. Too many of you feel the need to pick up the phone and call the police. When I was in school and when I worked, we were responsible for assisting patients and their family. You had to make a situation work, no matter how much you might disagree with the behavior. Now it seems, if you can't handle the behavior, call the cops.

It sounds more like you guys are the ones who are whining, not me.

Woody:twocents:

no you are the one wining.some places don't have security on off shifts my hospital is one of them.if any situation is unsafe we call the cops .i have a right to be safe i don't care about policy.that policy if it should exist means nothing especially if i am dead.and or injuredand the police come every time .we have had people escorted off the property if there was a crime arrested .in 3 years not 1 cop disagreed with our calling.they bring prisoners and drunks in constantly .we take care of the pt.if they come in for er we treat them respectfully they do the same for us.you have your experience we have ours.just as you have the right to your position we have the right to ours.so get off your high horse.

[achot chavi]

you certainly don't need my support or indignation- you are certainly in the right:bow:- why can a stewardess, waitress or teacher utilize the support of the police and we cant- I was almost infected when an AIDS patient just threw his IV at me (squirting blood) for no reason (I had just entered the room and he was angry at someone else) and no one cared. In Israel after a few incidences of violence against doctors in hospitals:down:, the entire physicians organization of the whole country went on strike for half a day to protest . Too bad we cant do something like that.

We all get irate family members or patients, I once complained about a daughter of a patient and the SW went to court to get an order limiting her visitation hours. We had the police come every day to remove her at the appointed time as she refused to cooperate. Bottom Line- How can I help you- who can I write to about this :typing ? you deserve all of our support:heartbeat. BTW -rule for the future- never treat an uncooperative patient and make uncooperative relatives leave- we never have to put ourselves in jeopardy in order to give treatment:no:!!

[MAISY, RN-ER, BSN, RN]

I have considered why hospitals have been able keep nurses down, it may have something to do with military training. When Woody posted about following orders....it hit me, hospitals are institutions built on autocratic rules....how many are staffed by former military-taking orders, and giving them!

While this may work when "taking the hill"-dissention or opinions in the ranks would create havoc.....WE AS NURSES ARE SUPPOSED TO THINK INDEPENDENTLY! I am not sure being a "good little soldier" is good for the patient or the NURSE.

Perhaps, independent thinking should be encouraged in nursing school and elsewhere so that this type of managerial behavior dies out! IF ther is no staff to take that type of tight managment, there will have to be changes.

Maisy

[Vito Andolini]

If a reasonable person thinks police are needed, the police should be called. No matter what policy is, safety comes first. Whether a worker is threatened by a patient, family, coworker, doctor or whoever, the worker has a right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. We have the right to defend ourselves, our loved ones, and our property, no matter where we may be. Now I'm sure the law has become so convoluted that there are manmade restrictions on these God-given rights. But if I think I need police, I will be calling the brothers in blue. Yeah. Rock on.

Why not make the call anonymously, if possible?

I totally agree - no one in their right mind dares to harm or threaten a flight attendant any more, knowing they will face federal charges big time. So why is it ok to do this to nurses?

For OP: if for no other reason than the fact that the person's violence and temper tantrum would have been frightening to other patients and visitors, and since Security had been unsuccessful in their many attempts to handle her on previous days, police should have been called. No question in my mind that that was the right thing to do. Where do things stand now?

For the person who was attacked by a crackhead in the ER, what led up to this? Was it out of the blue or had there been an argument? Words? I'm glad you're ok.

[nursekare]

security should have called the police after the first couple of times that the visitor began throwing things. not only was she putting the staff at risk of injury but other patients and their visitors as well. someone in a prior post indicated that hospital policies are there to be followed but most facilities have policies allowing security to call policing agencies when patients & visitors become unruly and make the patient care environment, in which they find themselves, unsafe. if security and the house supervisor had been called multiple times previously and if this visitor was given preferential treatment in spite of policies giving the supervisor & security the authority to call the police, the nurse was within her rights to call the police and provide a safe environment for the patients & other visitors, not to mention a safe work environment for his/her coworkers.

the lack of a hostile work environment is federal law.

the nurse really should see a lawyer, if what was posted is factual.

she/he might be able to get their job back and recieve compensation for time missed from work related to the firing.

this is one of many reasons why burn-out is such a problem in the nursing profession.

expecting staff members to endure the tirades and physical assualts of patients and visitors should not be an expected requisite for the position. if they act like a psych patient they should be treated like one and a take down performed and medication administered or they should be given the option of leaving never to return or going to see the local jail.

i applaud the nurse for taking such bold steps.

unfortunately, the hospital administration holds all the cards in regard to employment until the case is settled by a judge and/or jury.

[nursekare]

...as for the nurse being fired. i have worked in hospital administration. we don't just fire someone for calling the police. i think there is much more to this story then the op posted. she gave her side only, which was slanted to favor her, not the hospital nor the family. with the exception of a very small privately owned hospital, here in florida, no one has ever been fired for doing one thing wrong. the hospitals i have worked at, all had steps that had to be gone thru before one could be terminated. shorted of harming a patient or stealing drugs would get you fired. and now only the harming a patient does...

woody:twocents:

i've seen many nurses get fired for doing one thing wrong. not long ago, in a hospital i was working in, a new graduate recieved the results of a positive drug test on a patient and a container of an illicit drug had been found in the room. the nurse thought that she was supposed to notify police of this and without notifying the house supervisor and/or security made a call to the local police department. she had a detailed conversation with the police about the patient and was informed by the officer to call the supervisor. at the end of the incident the admininstration said that she had violated several policies, hippa violation, calling without notifying the supervisor, calling without notifying security,... and the nurse was fired.

so, things don't always happen as we might think.

[MAISY, RN-ER, BSN, RN]

i've seen many nurses get fired for doing one thing wrong. not long ago, in a hospital i was working in, a new graduate recieved the results of a positive drug test on a patient and a container of an illicit drug had been found in the room. the nurse thought that she was supposed to notify police of this and without notifying the house supervisor and/or security made a call to the local police department. she had a detailed conversation with the police about the patient and was informed by the officer to call the supervisor. at the end of the incident the admininstration said that she had violated several policies, hippa violation, calling without notifying the supervisor, calling without notifying security,... and the nurse was fired.

so, things don't always happen as we might think.

this is a totally different scenario-one that my school and my hospital addressed during my orientation. definately a firing offense.

maisy

[squeakykitty]

A poster question the change in the behavior of patients and families towards staff. I have also noticed that a lot of the younger nurses do not feel that they have any responsibility in defusing tense situations. Too many of you feel the need to pick up the phone and call the police. When I was in school and when I worked, we were responsible for assisting patients and their family. You had to make a situation work, no matter how much you might disagree with the behavior. Now it seems, if you can't handle the behavior, call the cops.

It sounds more like you guys are the ones who are whining, not me.

Woody:twocents:

Sometimes, nothing will work to defuse the situation, especially if they're dealing with a person who is high on drugs such as PCP. I'd call the police if I seriously thought the person was posing a real danger either to me or others. (Personally, I'd rather be alive to collect the unemployment check.)

[Warpster]

THIS IS WHY NURSES NEED A UNION!!!

These wimpy suits always kiss butt even when nurses are assaulted and badly hurt. It's always the nurse's fault to these "We provide customer service and the customer is always right" office types.

A union would have backed this nurse up and she'd still have a job.

Once the screamer started throwing things, she crossed the line. Physical threats should always be taken seriously.

[woody62, RN]

THIS IS WHY NURSES NEED A UNION!!!

These wimpy suits always kiss butt even when nurses are assaulted and badly hurt. It's always the nurse's fault to these "We provide customer service and the customer is always right" office types.

A union would have backed this nurse up and she'd still have a job.

Once the screamer started throwing things, she crossed the line. Physical threats should always be taken seriously.

I agree, when a patient or family member or another nurse or nurse crosses the line and physically attacks someone, of course the police should be called. And yes, I do support unions. I believe one of the worse things that happened to this country was when the bill of goods was sold to us, in a lost attempt to save jobs. But that is another thread, on a different host.

But, I am sorry, I do support the firing of a nurse who acts against the hospital's policies and rules. Given the change in attitudes, it should be one of the questions you ask during orientation. And if you do not like the answer, don't let the door hit your *** on the way out. No one is forcing you to remain with an employer whose rules you don't support and whom you do not believe supports you as a nurse.

Woody:twocents:

[Batman24]

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