NURS 4465 - Vulnerable Populations (starting 8/12/13)

Nursing Students Texas (UTA)

Published

Getting an early start on the support group thread for the August 4465 class.

I heard it's second only to Research in terms of horror level...though having just survived Research, I'm optimistic about this one--it can only be better than Research was.

Thank you, Jadiva.:)

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Specializes in Emergency/ICU.

Vera and MBrickle - Another one down - see you in Assessment!

Catarina - So sorry about Research not coming up until November because I know you want this to be OVER!

Jadiva - congrats on only having 1 more class! It must be so exciting to be at that point! I'm counting down - four classes left!

Scarletfire - Way to go!!! Put that degree in a beautiful gilded frame! :)

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Hi all,

I am also in this class, and I just noticed that there are discussion blogs about each class. I am writing tonight about some emails that were exchanged yesterday and today between myself and my coach. My initial inquiry was about the reason for a full 10 point deduction from the Week 4 assignment, in the area of APA/Writing, as I thought this was a bit harsh. In her first response to me, she stated that an in-text citation was required for each and every section of the paper. In her second response, she cc'd the other instructors and lectured me for a bit about how the lack of citations were examples of academic dishonesty. The most recent email from the coach is to our entire group, where she states that "UTA is about to get very serious about this issue," she is now re-grading EVERYONE'S papers, and deducting for missing citations.

Here is a complete and concise transcript of our conversation, (the only thing redacted is her name):

(My initial email)

Dear *******,

I reviewed my comments and the rubric for the week 4 paper, and I am unsure as to how you determined the deduction of 10 points for the last section, APA and writing. I see two mistakes in APA formatting; the lack of a citation and the missing hanging indent. My writing is clear and precise. My reference to "Julia," in some sections could be considered informal, however it was not present throughout the entire paper. I can certainly see a deduction in this area, however I feel that the full deduction is a bit harsh. Please review and advise.

Thanks so much,

Michele McCluskey

(Response #1)

Faculty wanted to see many more areas where agency goals and services must have proper citation. There are very serious about plagiarism and academic dishonesty. All areas discussing information obtained from person or agency must be cited- apply my comments on citations missing to all areas. *******

(My reply)

I have two issues with this. First, I am wondering where it states that each section must contain a citation, as I clearly would have done that if it was made clear that this was the expectation. Additionally, while I can understand that there were issues with some missing citations, the last section in the rubric is meant to cover both the APA formatting and the writing. My writing deserves more than a "0" effort.

(Second response)

Michele,

Faculty is expecting that all students read resources in class that cover APA. This paper is to be considered just like any formal paper or any other academic paper. You must discuss where you obtained information that is not your own words and it must be cited. You will continue to have "0" for APA points and possibly have your work submitted to academic dishonesty faculty if you continue to submit assignments not citing the source of where you information is obtained from. Citing "Julie said" is not APA format. Citing information from agencies and not telling the reader where it came from is plagiarism and academic dishonesty.

I will pass on to faculty your concerns to include more information to guide students to be careful to cite but this is expected in every class you are in. You are not expected to cite every section, but every area where personal communication obtained and areas where internet material or brochure information etc are used.

Please be very careful about turning in work in any class at UTA without using intext citations as this will be treated in a very serious way with penalties and submission to academic dishonestly board if it continues. Let me know if you need more information on where links are so you can read more about this.

*******

(My last email)

*******,

In looking back, there is a clear reason that I didn't treat this paper in the regard you expected, and it is my suspicion that many people in my class made the same mistake. I am certainly no beginner at writing research, as my FIRST Bachelors degree was actually in psychology. I am completely competent in writing in APA style, as I have earned As on many, many TRUE research papers. If this assignment had been to actually write an APA-style paper, it certainly would have been clearer, more precise, and less informal. The template used for this assignment was completely contradictory to the rubric given. If one is instructed to "interview agency staff" for information, than to most people, the answers given are implied responses from the interview. How, indeed, can that be construed as plagiarism? Additionally, the templates are so cumbersome and difficult to use, as I spent as much time adjusting the color and font as I did actually writing the paper. You all are so hung up on APA formatting and "academic honesty," but nobody really seems to care about content. As a student, I care more about content. I want to be challenged and I want to actually learn something.

Furthermore, not only are the instructions for this assignment vague, but in reviewing our conversation in this email thread, you initially stated that "all areas discussing information obtained from person or agency must be cited- apply my comments on citations missing to all areas." In your most recent response, however, you stated "you are not expected to cite every section, but every area where personal communication obtained and areas where internet material or brochure information etc are used." Exactly which is it? This is just another example of unclear directions. It leads me to believe that even the coaches don't understand the requirements, so how are the students to understand?

Michele McCluskey

So here it is...am I the only one who thinks that this assignment was unfairly graded? I'm not sure if this is going to spread to the entire class, or just to our group, but after reading all of this over again, now I feel that I was initially singled-out with the full deduction, (and only after I said something), the coach is just now going back and spreading the misery to everyone?!?!

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Michelle,

How can the coach go back and lower everyone's grade? Can they actually do that? I thought my papers were crap in this class, but I got a 100 on all but the last (got a 96). I do think the grading in a lot of these courses is ridiculous. I got 30 points off a discussion posting for incorrect format on a reference. I argued and basically was told that's the way it is. I only have capstone left and cannot wait to put UTA in the rear view mirror.

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ldawn79,

I am merely letting everyone know what has transpired, as I believe it to be very wrong. And now it's affecting the entire class, or at least my coach's group?!?!? The courses are (by far) the worst college experience I have ever had. I am currently enrolled for MATH 1301, HIST 1311, NURS 3335, NURS 4455 and Capstone this semester, and then I'm done too. The one and only class where I actually learned anything useful was Health Assessment, and I was actually told by an adviser that that I could not even take Pharmacology, because I'm an online learner. I have pulled As in most everything, except Research, (B)...I submitted absolute crap for every post and paper in this entire curriculum, and I'm still doing well. I read emails and assignment comments from coaches who have advanced degrees (usually from UTA), but little to no grasp of proper grammar, punctuation or proof-reading. I'm glad to be almost done, but certainly won't EVER recommend this school to anyone!!

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Specializes in Psych ICU, addictions.

I'm not in your group, but I got a similar e-mail. So it's not just your group.

ETA: found out another classmate got one of these as well.

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Specializes in Psych ICU, addictions.

As far as the regrading though...it doesn't seem fair to issue grades and then suddenly retract them for "regrading." Yes, people should have cited correctly--or cited, period--but it should have also been graded correctly the first time around. All this drama makes me wonder how fair the "regrading" will be.

I didn't lose any points, but I didn't expect to. Not sure how my classmate did.

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I got a 100 on my last paper but my citations were vague. I think a big issue here is standardization between faculty. Some use this job for extra money to supplement income and have less time to grade (and in my opinion just skim) while others are more picky. I am finding that grading is directly related to the AC and that their requirement are no standard.

Mostly what bothers me about your situation is the APA stuff. I agree - they are so caught up on making sure we tick every box that content is absolutely on the back burner. Furthermore, I wholeheartedly agree with you - if the ENTIRE assignment revolves around interviewing an employee of ONE agency then yes, it SHOULD be implied that is where your info came from!!

Yikes!

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Meriwhen,

I agree. My point in posting all of this is that if the issue was as widespread as the coach's email to the class indicates, AND she was even unclear enough to improperly grade the papers in the first place, how clear was it to begin with? An APA paper is just that...it either is, or it isn't...the rubric and the templates contradict each other. An assignment to interview implies that the answers are indeed obtained through an interview. These kind of assignments really only teach that following blurry rules are important, and nothing else. It seems like they don't even proofread the assignments before they post them, yet we are held to some higher standard??

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And I think the unfortunate part is that they only look to make sure that all of the rubric requirements are fulfilled with little regard to the content written.

I have been successful because I make sure to hit each and every point on the rubric, template and any other assignment-related requirement that I find. They can't possibly grade each paper. They just look to make sure you hit it all even if the overall content is crap.

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Specializes in Psych ICU, addictions.
Furthermore, I wholeheartedly agree with you - if the ENTIRE assignment revolves around interviewing an employee of ONE agency then yes, it SHOULD be implied that is where your info came from!!

Yikes!

As much as this will be the unpopular opinion, UTA has a very valid point. It's like how nurses always say, "if you didn't chart it, you didn't do it." If we don't cite it, then we can't prove we got that info from them, even though that may be the only source used. Otherwise, they don't know if it came from the interview, a website or the imagination.

Hopefully for those affected, they'll just leave it to the deduction on the paper's score.

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Specializes in ICU.

I have a different AC and got a similar email.

I lost points but I haven't looked at because it didn't affect my letter grade. What is ridiculous is that I cited EVERY box with personal communication and cited several websites. I don't understand how with that I could have lost 8 points after the regrade.

I understand the plagiarism thing, but APA is supposed to protect against "stealing" research and such. UTA has gone a little overboard with it I think.

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