NP school reputation

[Jules A]

Something interesting I've noticed is that with undergraduate education although many justify the huge tuition they have paid for their uber expensive big name teaching hospital affiliated university BSN is it doesn't really make that much of a difference. I have done quite well with my community college start and have worked a major medical centers in the Baltimore/DC area as an undergraduate ADN and BSN.

However with NP education the reputation of the school does seem to matter. Where I work unless there is a compelling reason they quietly ignore resumes from three of the big name, "As Seen on TV", for profit schools. I work with one excellent NP who won't precept students from certain schools due to bad experiences with totally unprepared students.

Is that what others are finding? Does our NP pedigree matter?

[WKShadowNP, DNP, APRN]

I haven't graduated, but I feel like in my area, certain schools are favored. I don't have a lot of solid evidence to back this on...only the observed fact that my friends who graduated from my school or a select few others are having a MUCH easier time finding jobs compared to some from schools that have no brick and mortar affiliate. Well, to be honest, grads around here from even one school that has campuses in multiple states and is for-profit(can you guess where I'm referring to?) seem to have a hard time finding jobs in comparison. The same holds true for finding preceptors.

I gotcha. And when I called the area between you and I to find preceptors (I was very determined that if I had to travel I would), they politely told me no because they were full already with students from the bigger schools in that city between us and where you are. (Sorry for being vague, but I think you know which institutions I mean.)

[WKShadowNP, DNP, APRN]

I'd disagree. In addition to the points you noted, there are NPs who graduate ready to practice, which in my experience is what physicians expect, and those who aren't. It sounds like there are a few places that offer orientations to new grads but my guess is they are few and far between. Employers expect us to be ready to work with minimal hand holding.

This is a point I'm learning now. One factor I gained today is that my preceptor said as a new grad I would have an orientation with other providers in the office. I was encouraged by this. But this is also the same guy who is quizzing me every day I'm in clinic with him and pushing me harder to understand the medical model so I can think in that structured format.

AND, he is amazing at the holistic approach...as many have noted elsewhere, it's not unique to us.

[littlepeopleRNICU]

I gotcha. And when I called the area between you and I to find preceptors (I was very determined that if I had to travel I would), they politely told me no because they were full already with students from the bigger schools in that city between us and where you are. (Sorry for being vague, but I think you know which institutions I mean.)

And it may even be the STUDENTS themselves that cause this, not the school. I have two friends who are attending that school that are very serious, hardworking, great nurses and students...but they frequently are less than impressed with the ethics of their fellow classmates. That probably says more than it just being the school name. But idk, just what I have observed and been told, for my area only!

[WKShadowNP, DNP, APRN]

Oh, I agree! When I called my school's field placement office and told them what I'm doing to market myself (portfolio of resume', cover letter, and course objectives/requirements) she said that was amazing and what a good idea. I figured that if it works out for me (which it has) shouldn't that then reflect on the school? Meh.

Not all of my classmates approached it the same way. I've seen where some have harassed the practices on the phone or on FB, which is a big NO BUENO!

[WIBound]

Open book tests va closed book test schools nuff said. You can't build a foundation without memorizing a large amount of facts first. The usual defense of open book tests is usually that memorizing doesn't teach students to conceptualize information and memorizing is a low level of learning blah blah. These people who say this came from an open book test school.

I read this a while back and thought what school has open book tests?? Since then I have met several nurses who are in programs where they are essentially given open book tests.

In my program we have all our tests proctored - which is a huge PIA, but on some of these programs they are given 3 hours to take a 50 question test online - if that is not open book I do not know what is. Another program has zero tests but weekly open book quizzes!

An instructor recently told my class that a patient should expect a certain level of knowledge from a provider and that should include knowing what the risk factors are for many conditions and what are appropriate and high lab values are - and the only way we learn that is to commit it to memory. Can you imagine sitting with a patient and needing to look up every fact - would not instill much confidence.

Geez! If I had open book tests I would never miss a question - but some of the questions I have missed and looked up after are in the vault now and I will never forget those.

Can you imagine medical school with open book tests? Geez!!

[sauce]

average poster on allnurses

3 months into fnp school "this isn't bad i can't wait to get out in the real world and practice!!!!!!! Everybody should do an fnp program!!!!"

3 weeks into first job "omg I'm so unprepared if only I would have went to a real school and taken actual tests, this is horrible, ahhh"

sigh

[littlepeopleRNICU]

I read this a while back and thought what school has open book tests?? Since then I have met several nurses who are in programs where they are essentially given open book tests.

In my program we have all our tests proctored - which is a huge PIA, but on some of these programs they are given 3 hours to take a 50 question test online - if that is not open book I do not know what is. Another program has zero tests but weekly open book quizzes!

An instructor recently told my class that a patient should expect a certain level of knowledge from a provider and that should include knowing what the risk factors are for many conditions and what are appropriate and high lab values are - and the only way we learn that is to commit it to memory. Can you imagine sitting with a patient and needing to look up every fact - would not instill much confidence.

Geez! If I had open book tests I would never miss a question - but some of the questions I have missed and looked up after are in the vault now and I will never forget those.

Can you imagine medical school with open book tests? Geez!!

This is scary 😳

[sauce]

patient- what does this medicine do

np- one sec let me look it up

np thinks to self- hmmm i remember writing a paper on this medicine, i think its for umm blood pressure

np to patient- its for blood pressure

patient- want are some side effects i can expect?

np- let me look that up too

This is pretty common due to the poor education of many nps. But then again we do provide high quality care according to the aanp and aanc, who also accredit schools with open book tests.

I guess they think the oversimplified board exam lasting 2 hours, can test the entire range of things we will see in a primary care setting.

Supreme Fail.

[chiromed0]

The reputation of an NP school matters? To whom? I seriously doubt it does profession wide. All that matters is a license to practice. Some programs probably are better but who would know? That's why you pass a national certification test to equate everyone's base level of understanding. Beyond that you can get a great NP from a mediocre school or a bad NP from a great school. I've never had anyone acknowledge my school and it's seriously old, pretty good school with high pass rates, etc. I don't think an employer cares. To a Doc, anywhere you've gone is NOT going to impress them b/c they are unfamiliar with what you do/don't know, however, you're prior experience as an RN might. I think that matters more is what experience did you get as an RN in the field.

[BostonFNP, APRN]

The reputation of an NP school matters? To whom? I seriously doubt it does profession wide. All that matters is a license to practice. Some programs probably are better but who would know? That's why you pass a national certification test to equate everyone's base level of understanding. Beyond that you can get a great NP from a mediocre school or a bad NP from a great school. I've never had anyone acknowledge my school and it's seriously old, pretty good school with high pass rates, etc. I don't think an employer cares. To a Doc, anywhere you've gone is NOT going to impress them b/c they are unfamiliar with what you do/don't know, however, you're prior experience as an RN might. I think that matters more is what experience did you get as an RN in the field.

I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see some difference with program quality and employment opportunities nationwide. In a competitive market, NP students from quality schools get better clinical placements, they have better networking contacts, and they often have a locally established legacy of placing quality students. As an anecdotal example, the school I graduated from for the past 5-years has had 100% employment in advanced practice at the 6 month mark.

Most employers that have had experience hiring NPs in the past have at least a general idea of which local programs are quality and which are not.

How long have you been working? No one has ever asked where you went to school?

[sauce]

Most docs could care less about the rn experience. Ones i worked for previously did care about the school, and had a few on a no-hire list due to previously bad experiences. Nurse experience helps in some ways but there is no way that one can learn a majority of a provider role from being a nurse, no matter how much some "experienced nurses" tout that it does.

Great nurse practitioners can come from all programs, but usually the easier to get into programs will (on average) not provide as good as a provider if you take a large number and average out their success (which would be hard to do). Part of this may be due to the schooling, but the other part is usually the less motivated take the path of least resistance, which in turn perpetuates through the program and further into his or her career, making the problem worse..., and the stellar providers will have enjoyed the challenge of going to a more selective program and compete harder to be the top of his or her class.

Patients deserve better than a "i passed boards nothing else matters" type of provider.

anybody can pass boards...